NEWS: Four Canadian Police Killed in Pot Raid

There are many pitfalls in life that can snare you if you let it. Most choose their own pitfalls such as doing nothing but getting high. Those types would have had some other pitfall because they do not have the will power to succeed. Pot by itself does not cause someone to be lazy and abandon their goals it is their will power that lets them down not weed. Like I said before I know many people that smoke weed and are very ambitious and very successfull. Don't blame weed or any other substance for someones apathetic lifestyle, it 's their choice not to succeed not the substances choice. It seems that nobody wants to take personal responsbility for their actions anymore, blame it on weed that they get bad report cards, it's not John Doe's fault.

It's all strategy...

What the plan was is as follows..

Marijuana is the most widely used illicit drug.
Puts it up there with alcohol... which means *almost everyone uses it or knows someone who does (knowingly/unknowingly)

So make it appear like they're doing cannabis users a favor and decriminalize it on the street level, so the public doesn't testy...

Under the police guide-lines that they're testing the water to see if it helps decrease the problems and the organized crimes...
So essentially it's as if a hose has a crack in it, and it's leaking all over the place so instead of fixing the problem at the crack they move down near the end of the tube and "fix" the problem there and hope we won't notice they haven't done anything to the crack...
now they're going to say "Okay! Your way didn't work, so now we're going to do it ourway .." ... when in actuality they KNEW ahead of time decriminalizing it on a small scale actually does NOTHING new WHAT-SO-EVER because if you read the laws on personal possession, there wasn't really any stiff penalty, it was up to the officer at the scene to use his discretion... so realistically they didn't do anything except tell us the law, now their going to claim that law doesn't work.. TRY to revise it by making it even more stupid... You think by making penalties mandatory they have anything to lose? Of course they're going to shoot you stupid... You're putting them in jail for a plant.. you're creating monsters by outcasting people, ... you cannot outcast people .. humans don't function well mentally when you judge them, especially for something as trivial as a plant whose narcotic influence is detectably mild compared to legal intoxicants..

Originally posted by sardion2000
Okay then I challenge you to change my mind! Show me a peer reviewed and widely cited study with abosultely no scent of a conflict of interest either way and I might consider yours and FredT's point of view.(And who know I might even change my mind)

You know that whatever link i provide which proves that marijuana has many negative effects you will accuse of "having a conflict of interest." The best way to prove that marijuana has many bad side effects without citing any links is by watching what happens to those that use marijuana. I have personaly seen what marijuana does to people. I have seen a student in college arriving to class while still under the influence of marijuana, which he himself would proclaim, pretty much every day. he got the worse grades in the class, and was eventually expelled because he always fell asleep in class while still under the influence of marijuana.

You can also see that Deus is also agreeing, and is giving an example as to what happens to his sibling for using this drug. There are millions of cases which show that marijuana has more bad side effects, than any good it can provide.

Originally posted by sardion2000
If I do plan on having children(which is doubtfull due to medical reasons...) will I ever smoke around them? NO I would not even consider it, and I mean smoke ANYTHING not even incense around a developing brain, any type of Free Radical exposure is a bad thing IMHO.

You think children would not realise in time what their parents are doing? and they would not try to imitate what their parents do? Children are very perceptive, and they normally imitate what their parents do at a very young age. Also, the smell and some of the effects of marijuana stay for quite a long time in a room according to what i have read and heard others say.

Originally posted by sardion2000
Why are you comparing Marijuana smokers to Glue or Paint sniffers? Seems like a pointless comparision, the only logical comparision in this case is Marijuana and Tobacco or Alchohol.

Ok, you did not seem to understand what I was trying to explain. Some people have claimed in the past in these forums, that if marijuana is legalised, that many children will not use it anymore, since the main reason for them to try it and use it is because it is prohibited.... i was pointing out the fact that millions of kids get high by sniffing legal products, and this proves that if marijuana is legalized, children will continue to use it. not only that, but it will be more readily available to children to use.

Originally posted by sardion2000
Decriminalisation != Legalisation plain and simple. I support Legalisation as I hate Big Brother purportedly "protecting us", and I oppose the propaganda and lies that seem to be coming back into vogue. I know people generally have to have something to be deathly afraid of, for the powers to pull the crap that they have been since the dawn of time. It's called bait and switch, I'm sure you are familiar with that Tactic Muaddib.

Well I'm finished, I look foward to your reply. Hope it's worth it

We are in a society, a society must have rules that people have to abide, if not all hell breaks lose. You call laws, in this case marijuana being illegal, as a propaganda to keep people in fear... but laws, and the prohibition/restriction of certain things are necessary in any society, otherwise there would be anarchy, and in anarchy everyone has their own notion as to what is right and wrong....which would bring more problems, more crimes, people will resort to more violence, etc, etc. Enough rant for tonight.



[edit on 6-3-2005 by Muaddib]

Originally posted by Muaddib
The best way to prove that marijuana has many bad side effects without citing any links is by watching what happens to those that use marijuana. I have personaly seen what marijuana does to people.

i've seen what it does to people, too. it makes them fabulously inspired and they become workaholics while under the influence. i'm not kidding. different people are affected differently. different strains of weed have more or less of a fatiguing effect. it's true that many people RELAX after they smoke. should we outlaw television and chesterfields, too?
you know a kid who fell asleep in class? is he a dangerous world leader, now? i know a dangerous world leader that slept in class, smoked pot, drove drunk, did coke and has a major drinking problem. once an alcoholic, always an alcoholic, you know.
i know a kid who used to smoke like a chimmeny back in high school. he would get high to study at home, and then get high to write the test. he got straight A's. i could go on and on about very successful people who use pot regularly. entrepeneurs, stockbrokers, doctors, lawyers, COPS, military, politicians, teachers. you're doing your surmising from an armchair. i've spent my whole life as part of the culture. i won't tell you how to clean your rifle, and you don't tell me about the 'dangers' of pot, k?

Originally posted by MuaddibYou can also see that Deus is also agreeing, and is giving an example as to what happens to his sibling for using this drug. There are millions of cases which show that marijuana has more bad side effects, than any good it can provide.

forget trying to single it into individual cases. there are TENS OF MILLIONS of people smoking up TODAY. right now, there's propobably hundreds of thousands toking away this instant.
people want to do it. they won't be stopped without a TOTAL POLICE STATE LOCKDOWN.
but, of course, that would be GOOD, right, muaddib? then all these dangerous people who think they own themselves could be properly controlled. i mean, let's face it. if there were laws to tell us right from wrong, we'd have no way of knowing which is which, right?

Originally posted by Muaddib
Also, the smell and some of the effects of marijuana stay for quite a long time in a room according to what i have read and heard others say.

much like the stench of propoganda.
i'm MUCH more worried about what the children are learning with regards to the freedom of the human spirit and the right to personal autonomy than whether they, too, will enjoy relaxing with pot. you know, muaddib, that it's a PLANT, right? it's been here as long, or longer than we have. in fact, the THC receptors in our brains seem to serve NO OTHER PURPOSE. get that? we EVOLVED with pot. human's love pot, and pot loves humans.
get that? it's ALWAYS been a part of human culture. your worries about generational informational channels are rather alarmist, i'd say.
if you found out jesus smoked pot and did mushrooms, what would you say?

Originally posted by Muaddib
Ok, you did not seem to understand what I was trying to explain. Some people have claimed in the past in these forums, that if marijuana is legalised, that many children will not use it anymore, since the main reason for them to try it and use it is because it is prohibited.... i was pointing out the fact that millions of kids get high by sniffing legal products, and this proves that if marijuana is legalized, children will continue to use it. not only that, but it will be more readily available to children to use.

pure speculation. i would much rather have kids get high on god's green ganja than have them sniffing glue, gasoline, drink metallic paint, poke holes in aerosol cans, etc...
like you say, after it becomes legal, kids would CONTINUE to use it. so what's changed? only that they won't go to jail or be persecuted by 'society'(i put that in quotes, because what we are talking about is the media's agenda view of society, and not the actual push and pull of opposing views in the matrix of mass human behavoiur patterns, which is what 'society' actually is).

well, if legal, they will get popeye joints, anyway. just like popeye cigarettes, if the corporation gets a hold of pot production and propoganda, they will use a candy archetype to program the young with. like tobacco, they will start lacing the product with a host of mystery chemicals, for 'improved flavour', and 'reduced _____', or 'lasting freshness'. things like cyanide, arsenic, or any rat poison are always good to throw into consumer products. absolute corporations corrupt absolutely.
it's 'okay' for corporations to tell us what is desirable and doable, but not for parents to their children? they are NOT the state's children, you know. what we DON'T NEED, and is much worse then anarchy, is super-centralised control of everything.
when exactly did the paradigm shift, and the children became wards of the state, and not wards of the parents? you know, for a guy who rails against socialism, you sure can switch-hit good.

Originally posted by Muaddib
We are in a society, a society must have rules that people have to abide, if not all hell breaks lose. You call laws, in this case marijuana being illegal, as a propaganda to keep people in fear... but laws, and the prohibition/restriction of certain things are necessary in any society, otherwise there would be anarchy, and in anarchy everyone has their own notion as to what is right and wrong....which would bring more problems, more crimes, people will resort to more violence, etc, etc. Enough rant for tonight.

PURE speculation. anarchy has never been tried. as far as i can tell, most people have the same basic sense of right and wrong. people react to information, and it is only information enviroments that are wholesome or corrupt.
once again, when you have supercentralised control of information, (as we do, now) right and wrong are moot points. wrong is the natural state of the pyramid power structure. every single (north american)protest i've seen 'erupt' into violence, has been started by the police. it is authoritarian regimes that are a MUCH, MUCH, MUCH, MUCH bigger threat to the health of society than lazy stoners.
but, whatever, you're a soldier or a cop or some other form of clone for the clone wars, so it is simply impossible for you to understand that, by RIGHT, people are not property.

I think I will let him do the Talking for me:

www.pot-tv.net...

Too much ignorance in this thread for my taste. But I will say that it's a shame these men died while fighting for an unjust cause. The illegality of marijuana is detrimental and serves no real purpose but to fill the pockets of a few. Legalize it and these rare occurrences will most likely cease.

Originally posted by billybob
forget trying to single it into individual cases. there are TENS OF MILLIONS of people smoking up TODAY. right now, there's propobably hundreds of thousands toking away this instant.
people want to do it. they won't be stopped without a TOTAL POLICE STATE LOCKDOWN.
but, of course, that would be GOOD, right, muaddib? then all these dangerous people who think they own themselves could be properly controlled.

My..my...how much I've missed posts like this! Way above, billybob! I feel so dangerous.

My condolences to the families.

Very tragic. But linking the tragedy to pot is retarded at best.

You sure can pick out the programmed robotic humanoids when it comes to the pot issue. The last time I checked Amsterdam had the highest murder rate in the world. Violent crime is up 300%. People are being gunned down in smoke shops so they can get the last bit of that Ak-47.

For those that support plants being illegal I would like to thank you for being a passive part in the selling out of your species. I know, a little harsh. But damn I am so tired of these people that can only regurgitate the lies from the criminals at the top. What's "bad for the children" is being raised by livestock instead of human parents.

I'll play devil's advocate for a second though. Pot is bad. Bush smoked it.

Quote: "The last time I checked Amsterdam had the highest murder rate in the world. Violent crime is up 300%. People are being gunned down in smoke shops so they can get the last bit of that Ak-47."

You should add that you were being Sarcastic - perhaps the
"Robotic Humanoids" would not be able to tell!

Quote: "What's *Bad for the Children* is being raised by Livestock instead of human parents."

Thanks for that statement - it made my day - really!

Originally posted by Bangin

My..my...how much I've missed posts like this! Way above, billybob! I feel so dangerous.

you bad. yeah, you bad.

how about freedom of religion for rastafarians? there's a good legal excuse, praise jah!

we kin all be rastas, mon, irie. one love, one heart, let's get together and feel alright. we don fear no nuclear wipawns, mon. babylon will fall, jah be praised!

I'm not going to say to much.. they were rookies. They were young. They were probably told to stay were they were (protect the contraban). THEY DIED.

Seldom does one here about a single Mounty being killed during the line of investigation. Canadians should feel exceptionally downed that so many RCMPs' died on that investigation. Fairness and Thorough is what they do.

At times' RCMP lose too..

Dallas

Dallas, thank you for taking a sober stance considering the information that has been coming out. They should be respected, and well from what I heard they should not have even been there in the first place, the SWAT team should have been sent(or what ever the RCMP equivalent is). I believe he was well known to the RCMP for some time, at least that is what the RCMP Officer on TV said.

www.idpz.net...

c3dlc,

give it a break, ok?

.
When governements get on the wrong side of totally unnecessary restrictions of personal freedoms some people take it personally.

The government was wrong and these 4 poor guys paid the price.

Nicotine is addictive, pot is not.
Alcohol is fatally toxic, pot is not.

When govenments and their populations are blinded by so-called morality to actual facts they take stupid and unnecessary stands where they shouldn't.

Maybe some amount of personal responsibility does have to fall on these four guys. If you work for a stupid government you make that choice. With the choice comes possible outcomes such as this.

Where is the nation of savy intelligent people I can go move to?
.