The Trivium

Hello again ATS. I wanted to share a video on something called the Trivium. It is a method of truth discovery by learning how to think and analyze things properly. The people who rule over us know the Trivium, and it is taught in elite schools. People who want change in the World are going about it completely wrong, because many do not understand the casual factors, rather they treat and scream at the symptoms. I urge everyone to watch this 1.2 hour long video. Thank you.

a reply to: TheGreatWork

There’s a great book by Sister Miriam Joseph about the Trivium that is well worth the time it takes to read it. The trivium is essentially non-existent in today’s education.

The Trivium: The Liberal Arts of Logic, Grammar, and Rhetoric

a reply to: TheGreatWork

I seriously tried to watch it but it's the worst presentation anyone ever made. This guy is repeating himself over and over with 5 million times "okay" and I simply don't have the patience to go through that kind of torture.
Plus what he has to say (judging from the sheets) is not new in any way.

a reply to: TheGreatWork

I have watched 25 minutes of nonsense about "truth" and "causality" and not one word about what the Trivium itself... I am not inclined to continue. I become suspect whenever someone tells me the conclusion I must come to before telling me the facts themselves. And, in fact, this is actually contrary to the Trivium method itself! Hmmm...

However, for those curious, the Trivium was basically the established method of teaching from the Dark Ages and through the Middle Ages. It might be considered primary education -- grammer, logic and rhetoric. The Quadrivium would be considered higher education -- arithmetic, geometry, music, and astronomy.

The Trivium:

Grammar teaches the mechanics of language to the student. This is the step where the student "comes to terms," defining the objects and information perceived by the five senses. Hence, the Law of Identity: a tree is a tree, and not a cat.

Logic (also dialectic) is the "mechanics" of thought and of analysis, the process of identifying fallacious arguments and statements and so systematically removing contradictions, thereby producing factual knowledge that can be trusted.

Rhetoric is the application of language in order to instruct and to persuade the listener and the reader. It is the knowledge (grammar) now understood (logic) and being transmitted outwards as wisdom (rhetoric).

The Trivium/Quadrivium method -- or a variety thereof -- has apparently become popular among Christian schools and other private education institutions.

Among the beauties of the method is that it teaches how to evaluate any expressed thought or statement for its actual value; i.e., is it fact or opinion? Proven or theoretical? Can it be proven? And so on.

a reply to: Peeple

I agree. It was like a lot of talking for nothing and not really teaching anything new. Maybe others will get something out of it. Sorry OP, I'm sure you meant well and wanted to share something you found of value. I had never heard of the term Trivium before, so I did learn something.

originally posted by: Boadicea
a reply to: TheGreatWork

I have watched 25 minutes of nonsense about "truth" and "causality" and not one word about what the Trivium itself... I am not inclined to continue. I become suspect whenever someone tells me the conclusion I must come to before telling me the facts themselves. And, in fact, this is actually contrary to the Trivium method itself! Hmmm...

However, for those curious, the Trivium was basically the established method of teaching from the Dark Ages and through the Middle Ages. It might be considered primary education -- grammer, logic and rhetoric. The Quadrivium would be considered higher education -- arithmetic, geometry, music, and astronomy.

The Trivium:

Grammar teaches the mechanics of language to the student. This is the step where the student "comes to terms," defining the objects and information perceived by the five senses. Hence, the Law of Identity: a tree is a tree, and not a cat.

Logic (also dialectic) is the "mechanics" of thought and of analysis, the process of identifying fallacious arguments and statements and so systematically removing contradictions, thereby producing factual knowledge that can be trusted.

Rhetoric is the application of language in order to instruct and to persuade the listener and the reader. It is the knowledge (grammar) now understood (logic) and being transmitted outwards as wisdom (rhetoric).

The Trivium/Quadrivium method -- or a variety thereof -- has apparently become popular among Christian schools and other private education institutions.

Among the beauties of the method is that it teaches how to evaluate any expressed thought or statement for its actual value; i.e., is it fact or opinion? Proven or theoretical? Can it be proven? And so on.

You do not know his work. He goes over many things and he gets into the trivium after the opening stuff. If you think it is nonsense then sorry you feel that way.

The mere fact that most of you will go right back to a political thread or UFo disclosure thread show the exact point. That most of you do not really understand it. It's much broader and he explains this and much more.


If you would like to go further, the book is out there.

a reply to: TheGreatWork

You do not know his work. He goes over many things and he gets into the trivium after the opening stuff.

You're right -- I don't know his work, and I gave him 25 minutes to give me a reason to want to know his work, and he failed to do so.

As I already stated, I am always suspect of those who give me their conclusions before the fact. Which I also noted is actually contrary to the Trivium method. So

If you think it is nonsense then sorry you feel that way.

Just to be clear about this, I think he's nonsense; NOT the Trivium.

originally posted by: TheGreatWork
The mere fact that most of you will go right back to a political thread or UFo disclosure thread show the exact point. That most of you do not really understand it. It's much broader and he explains this and much more.

Wow. Your assumption that because we're not impressed with this guy's ramblings that we do not really understand it is quite arrogant and ignorant...

And let's be clear, we are not really talking about the Trivium, we're talking about the Trivium According to This Guy, with all his own added interpretations and extrapolations. So what we've really made clear is that we are not impressed with this guy and his version of the Trivium.

And we already know that he himself does not follow the Trivium principles. Neither have you.

I, on the other hand, defined the objects and information...i.e., the "Grammer" or the "Law of Identity."

I then applied thought and analysis, identifying fallacious arguments and statements, removing contradictions, thereby producing factual knowledge that can be trusted.

I applied language in order to instruct and to persuade... the knowledge (grammar) now understood (logic) and being transmitted outwards as wisdom (rhetoric).

So...........

originally posted by: Boadicea

originally posted by: TheGreatWork
The mere fact that most of you will go right back to a political thread or UFo disclosure thread show the exact point. That most of you do not really understand it. It's much broader and he explains this and much more.

Wow. Your assumption that because we're not impressed with this guy's ramblings that we do not really understand it is quite arrogant and ignorant...

And let's be clear, we are not really talking about the Trivium, we're talking about the Trivium According to This Guy, with all his own added interpretations and extrapolations. So what we've really made clear is that we are not impressed with this guy and his version of the Trivium.

And we already know that he himself does not follow the Trivium principles. Neither have you.

I, on the other hand, defined the objects and information...i.e., the "Grammer" or the "Law of Identity."

I then applied thought and analysis, identifying fallacious arguments and statements, removing contradictions, thereby producing factual knowledge that can be trusted.

I applied language in order to instruct and to persuade... the knowledge (grammar) now understood (logic) and being transmitted outwards as wisdom (rhetoric).

So...........

Sorry, I did not mean to come off as that, I am simply saying that when you study this, along with everything else that goes with it, you are liberated from the bs. Most do not want to hear the truth, as we can see by the endless political drivel. That shows people clearly have no idea where the root causes are if they are focused on politics and the other garbage that goes with that. I made a broad term and was not pointing at you.

Do not take this guy's explanation for it, but learn about it in general is my message. It's far deeper than just grammar, logic and rhetoric. Again, sorry for coming off that way as it is frustrating watching the world waste their time, being led in the complete wrong direction.

originally posted by: Boadicea
a reply to: TheGreatWork

You do not know his work. He goes over many things and he gets into the trivium after the opening stuff.

You're right -- I don't know his work, and I gave him 25 minutes to give me a reason to want to know his work, and he failed to do so.

As I already stated, I am always suspect of those who give me their conclusions before the fact. Which I also noted is actually contrary to the Trivium method. So

If you think it is nonsense then sorry you feel that way.

Just to be clear about this, I think he's nonsense; NOT the Trivium.

It's a podcast.. He is assuming listeners have been keeping up. I should have found a better source.

originally posted by: Boadicea
a reply to: TheGreatWork

I have watched 25 minutes of nonsense about "truth" and "causality" and not one word about what the Trivium itself... I am not inclined to continue. I become suspect whenever someone tells me the conclusion I must come to before telling me the facts themselves. And, in fact, this is actually contrary to the Trivium method itself! Hmmm...

However, for those curious, the Trivium was basically the established method of teaching from the Dark Ages and through the Middle Ages. It might be considered primary education -- grammer, logic and rhetoric. The Quadrivium would be considered higher education -- arithmetic, geometry, music, and astronomy.

The Trivium:

Grammar teaches the mechanics of language to the student. This is the step where the student "comes to terms," defining the objects and information perceived by the five senses. Hence, the Law of Identity: a tree is a tree, and not a cat.

Logic (also dialectic) is the "mechanics" of thought and of analysis, the process of identifying fallacious arguments and statements and so systematically removing contradictions, thereby producing factual knowledge that can be trusted.

Rhetoric is the application of language in order to instruct and to persuade the listener and the reader. It is the knowledge (grammar) now understood (logic) and being transmitted outwards as wisdom (rhetoric).

The Trivium/Quadrivium method -- or a variety thereof -- has apparently become popular among Christian schools and other private education institutions.

Among the beauties of the method is that it teaches how to evaluate any expressed thought or statement for its actual value; i.e., is it fact or opinion? Proven or theoretical? Can it be proven? And so on.

It is also a Masonic teaching.
Quad(rivium)

disregard

a reply to: TheGreatWork

Thank you for this very reasonable reply. I appreciate it. I actually appreciate you posting about the Trivium. After what I watched of the video, I was still interested enough to search out more info, eh?

This is ancient wisdom, and the principles are still worthy of learning.

But we live in a time when people would rather just "think" than actually be thoughtful, and would rather opine than reason, so I share your frustration there.

a reply to: Quadrivium

It is also a Masonic teaching.

Quad(rivium)

Thank you! Now that you've reminded me, I think that may have been the context I first learned of it. It rang a bell as soon as I read it.

a reply to: Quadrivium

It also aligns with everything mathematically and geometrically and astronomically, so it's antiquated to when this game began. Every culture/mystery school has their version of it.

Trivium is also where the game Trivial Pursuit got its name from. Just a fun fact, I'm not saying it's trivial. But that's the origin of the word.

a reply to: TheGreatWork

I happen to find the video very informative and thought provoking. I don't have 1.2 hours to listen to it in full continuity, but I will watch it in pieces. Thank you!