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WAR: Indiana Man Allegedly Tried to Sell Spy Names

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posted on Mar, 3 2005 @ 10:01 PM
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An Indiana man has been indicted by a Federal Grand Jury on charges that he tried to sell the names of U.S. Intelligence operatives in Iraq prior to the U.S. led invasion. Shaaban Hafiz Ahmad Ali Shaaban, 52, has been charged with agreeing to act as a foreign agent for Iraq and with immigration violations. Traveling from Chicago to Bahgdad, on a trip paid for by the Iraqi government, he agreed to hand over the names for the sum of $3,000,000. Investigators believed that he never actually was able to attain the names he tried to sell.
 



story.news.yahoo.com
INDIANAPOLIS - A federal grand jury has indicted an Indiana man on charges he tried to sell names of U.S. intelligence operatives in Iraq to Saddam Hussein's government before the U.S. invasion.

Shaaban Hafiz Ahmad Ali Shaaban, 52, was charged with agreeing to act as a foreign agent for Iraq and with immigration violations, federal prosecutors said Thursday following Shaaban's arrest.

Shaaban traveled in late 2002 from Chicago to Baghdad, where he agreed to sell the names of U.S. intelligence agents to Saddam's government for $3 million, said Susan Brooks, the U.S. attorney for southern Indiana. The Iraqi government paid for the trip, the indictment alleges.

"The deal was never consummated," Brooks said.

Shaaban sought the names from foreign sources, but investigators believe he never obtained them, Brooks said. Investigators believe Shaaban acted alone.


Please visit the link provided for the complete story.


Treason in any form is ugly, but giving up covert agents has to be the lowest form. For a mere 3 million dollars he was willing to essential give a death sentence to people he never met. Perhaps an eye for an eye would be appropriate here. But I'm getting ahead of myself as he has not been convicted of anything as of yet.




posted on Mar, 3 2005 @ 10:04 PM
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Well if the guy is guilty then by all means lock him up for life. Or in the case of the USA would it be lethal injection?



posted on Mar, 3 2005 @ 10:15 PM
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Too bad he didnt get to sell them


Actually I better stop before I get some visitors

[edit on 3-3-2005 by CmptrN3rd5]



posted on Mar, 3 2005 @ 10:19 PM
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Originally posted by sardion2000
Well if the guy is guilty then by all means lock him up for life. Or in the case of the USA would it be lethal injection?


No treason does not get the death penalty. Life in Club Med Leavenworth yes. Aldrich Ames IMHO should get the death penalty.



posted on Mar, 3 2005 @ 10:24 PM
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Or we could hand him back to the people he was probably trying to rip off and let them deal with him in their own special fashion (which probably involves a sharp rusty device or two) It would save us time, money and general headache by letting someone else take him out, thus freeing up the courts here to attend to the more pressing matters like fining mp3 traders.



posted on Mar, 3 2005 @ 10:39 PM
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Treason is no joke..

There can't be any tolerance of dissent in the armed forces, it leads down a dangerous path. The best thing to do is ensure that the armed forces never have cause to revolt. The best way to do that is to always be on the side of righteousness.

Now I don't think what we're doing in Iraq is righteous, but that's another topic. The fact is, this man jeapordized (or rather is alleged to have been in the process of attempting to jeapordize) the lives of field operatives. That sort of behaviour, once allowed or sanctioned through inaction, will become endemic. I don't like what the spies do, but I understand the necessity of it in our current mode of interaction with foreign interests, and I would never consider dropping the dime on the agents. I'd much rather dime on the people responsible for the state of world affairs, the politicians, drug pushers, chemical barons, energy oligarchs, and international bankers.

Probably the LEAST treasonous thing a marine could do right now would be to turn that fat spectre around and do a pass over Washington.

I have no tolerance for mindless, profit minded violence - but that's why God created mercenaries.
I wouldn't have asked marines to do Fallujah if I were the Iraqi theater commander, I would have contracted mercenaries and gone in with long term, slow and steady wetworks, night operations, hits, stings, and ambushes. Using gunships to mow down one of the most beautiful cities in the world was not only bad PR, it was bad for morale.

That being said, soldiers should follow orders or quit being soldiers.

Back on topic, Treason: It's inexcusable, even though our politicians engage in it quite frequently...



posted on Mar, 3 2005 @ 10:43 PM
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Originally posted by CmptrN3rd5
Too bad he didnt get to sell them


Did you forget the sarcasm tags or what? You can't be serious.



posted on Mar, 4 2005 @ 03:31 AM
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While persons selling out others, I consider as lowlives, I believe the usa government bought info from an iraqi guy that allowed them to locate and shoot the sons of Saddam, so from a moral perspective that puts their agents on auction as well...

That indiana conman should be glad he has to answer his actions against a U.S. court, suppose Saddam would have found out, he'd be taken to the cleaners for $3 million, he would await gruesome fate in Baghdad...


[edit on 4-3-2005 by Countermeasures]



posted on Mar, 4 2005 @ 04:17 AM
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Originally posted by FredT

No treason does not get the death penalty.


yes it does if the act endangers lives.



posted on Mar, 4 2005 @ 04:40 AM
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Treason is certainly punishable by death and is the worst possible crime you could possibly commit.



posted on Mar, 4 2005 @ 09:20 AM
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Originally posted by FredT
No treason does not get the death penalty. Life in Club Med Leavenworth yes. Aldrich Ames IMHO should get the death penalty.



Did they change the laws on treason in the past few months? As of 2004 one could get the death penalty by law.



18 U.S.C. § 2381

Treason

Whoever, owing allegiance to the United States, levies war against them or adheres to their enemies, giving them aid and comfort within the United States or elsewhere, is guilty of treason and shall suffer death, or shall be imprisoned not less than five years and fined under this title but not less than $10,000; and shall be incapable of holding any office under the United States.


Source

Another source says
Non-homicide crimes which may result in a federal death sentence:

Espionage (18 U.S.C. 794)

Treason. (18 U.S.C. 2381)

Fenderal laws that permit the death penalty



posted on Mar, 4 2005 @ 12:35 PM
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I believe all forms of treason are punishable by death, even firing squad, durning time of war. During peace time there is a more 'relaxed' attitude. That's my understanding of it anyway.

Certainly on the battlefield this has always been the law. The battlefield has been 'extended' by new warmaking technology and 'non combative' strategies. The same rules still apply. Selling state secrets, aiding the enemy with material or support, endangering the lives of the American people (soldiers or otherwise) - these are all crimes punishable by death in a wartime situation.

Am I wrong?



posted on Mar, 4 2005 @ 01:24 PM
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Originally posted by WyrdeOne
I believe all forms of treason are punishable by death, even firing squad, durning time of war. During peace time there is a more 'relaxed' attitude. That's my understanding of it anyway.
Am I wrong?


I do not think that we have to be at war per se to impose the death penalty. Here is what 794 states


794. Gathering or delivering defense information to aid foreign government

(a) Whoever, with intent or reason to believe that it is to be used to the injury of the United States or to the advantage of a foreign nation, communicates, delivers, or transmits, or attempts to communicate, deliver, or transmit, to any foreign government, or to any faction or party or military or naval force within a foreign country, whether recognized or unrecognized by the United States, or to any representative, officer, agent, employee, subject, or citizen thereof, either directly or indirectly, any document, writing, code book, signal book, sketch, photograph, photographic negative, blueprint, plan, map, model, note, instrument, appliance, or information relating to the national defense, shall be punished by death or by imprisonment for any term of years or for life, except that the sentence of death shall not be imposed unless the jury or, if there is no jury, the court, further finds that the offense resulted in the identification by a foreign power (as defined in section 101(a) of the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act of 1978) of an individual acting as an agent of the United States and consequently in the death of that individual, or directly concerned nuclear weaponry, military spacecraft or satellites, early warning systems, or other means of defense or retaliation against large-scale attack; war plans; communications intelligence or cryptographic information; or any other major weapons system or major element of defense strategy.


As I read it, if the spying reveals the identity and results in the death of an agent of the US, they can indeed put someone to death. It also states that if it directly concerned nuclear weaponry, military spacecraft or satellites, early warning systems, etc., they can also be put to death. At least that is how I read it.



posted on Mar, 4 2005 @ 01:30 PM
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Punishment is based on the severity of the crime, like always. If a Pentagon employee stole plans for a classified toilet and sold them to the enemy, that employee would would certainly not be shot. On the other hand, if he stole Pentagon plans for a some critical piece of military hardware during wartime, I'd say the case for firing squad would be easy to make.

Of course what we have here with this guy from Indiana, he wanted to do something, made promises to do something, but never did it. Where does he fall? I don't know, it remains up to the judges.



posted on Mar, 4 2005 @ 04:42 PM
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Then they ought to put Bob Novak away too. He didn't even charge for outing one of our spies, Valerie Plame.

[edit on 4-3-2005 by kazi]



posted on Mar, 4 2005 @ 04:45 PM
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Good research guys
I thought the death penalty had been put aside. i wonder why the Reagan Era Spies did not get it????

In this case however, he never actually attained the data to sell so Iwould be just as happy to see him rot away in some supermax somewhere.




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