E. Jean Carroll Says ‘Most People Think of Rape As Being Sexy’ In Bizarre CNN Interview

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04

originally posted by: InTheLight

originally posted by: ketsuko

originally posted by: Sookiechacha
a reply to: ketsuko

So, you believe that Bill Clinton raped women, because they said so, but you don't believe that Trump raped women, because they said so?

No. I believe a lot of people in this thread want so desperately to believe this woman and to believe Blasey-Ford because they represent a possible means of removingfrom/barring from power people that they ideologically despise. It's belief born of political convenience more than anything else.

I don't have any stake in your political games, but when 22 accusations against this guy surface any reasonably fair and intelligent person would keep an open mind? How come your mind is so closed?

And when not one has panned out and some have been demonstrably false you should take your own advice about being open minded. Leeds was wrong about what plane it happened on, and the armrest, while it can be raised, usually required a flight attendant to do it and does not happen in the manner she described.

I also put closed-mindedness about rape down to crafty lawyers and not that the truth was ever found, let alone justice prevailing.

originally posted by: InTheLight

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04

originally posted by: InTheLight

originally posted by: ketsuko

originally posted by: Sookiechacha
a reply to: ketsuko

So, you believe that Bill Clinton raped women, because they said so, but you don't believe that Trump raped women, because they said so?

No. I believe a lot of people in this thread want so desperately to believe this woman and to believe Blasey-Ford because they represent a possible means of removingfrom/barring from power people that they ideologically despise. It's belief born of political convenience more than anything else.

I don't have any stake in your political games, but when 22 accusations against this guy surface any reasonably fair and intelligent person would keep an open mind? How come your mind is so closed?

And when not one has panned out and some have been demonstrably false you should take your own advice about being open minded. Leeds was wrong about what plane it happened on, and the armrest, while it can be raised, usually required a flight attendant to do it and does not happen in the manner she described.

I put that down to crafty lawyers and not that the truth was ever found, let alone justice prevailing.

It's the lawyers' fault the truth was uncovered? Actually in this case the internet uncovered it and you cannot blame any good lawyer for bringing it up. The facts as they would have been do not fit the story meaning something was fishy somewhere. Things could not have happened the way the lady presented her case.

Blasey-Ford had the same problem.

Just because you "feel" something should be so doesn't mean it is. This is why we have a court that uses evidence as a primary means of deciding cases over testimony from witnesses.

originally posted by: ketsuko

originally posted by: InTheLight

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04

originally posted by: InTheLight

originally posted by: ketsuko

originally posted by: Sookiechacha
a reply to: ketsuko

So, you believe that Bill Clinton raped women, because they said so, but you don't believe that Trump raped women, because they said so?

No. I believe a lot of people in this thread want so desperately to believe this woman and to believe Blasey-Ford because they represent a possible means of removingfrom/barring from power people that they ideologically despise. It's belief born of political convenience more than anything else.

I don't have any stake in your political games, but when 22 accusations against this guy surface any reasonably fair and intelligent person would keep an open mind? How come your mind is so closed?

And when not one has panned out and some have been demonstrably false you should take your own advice about being open minded. Leeds was wrong about what plane it happened on, and the armrest, while it can be raised, usually required a flight attendant to do it and does not happen in the manner she described.

I put that down to crafty lawyers and not that the truth was ever found, let alone justice prevailing.

It's the lawyers' fault the truth was uncovered? Actually in this case the internet uncovered it and you cannot blame any good lawyer for bringing it up. The facts as they would have been do not fit the story meaning something was fishy somewhere. Things could not have happened the way the lady presented her case.

Blasey-Ford had the same problem.

Just because you "feel" something should be so doesn't mean it is. This is why we have a court that uses evidence as a primary means of deciding cases over testimony from witnesses.

So this one case makes all other rape accusations false? The hypocrisy from both sides here is ridiculous.

originally posted by: Sillyolme
a reply to: Lucidparadox

So you only have two choices?

Respect a woman and her personal space or indulge in her sexual fantasy?

No in between?

You ever play games with your significant other? Fantasize? Maybe she gets dressed up sexy for you?
Do you then lose respect for her or do you find the way to accept both about her?

I think theres a lot of wiggle room here.

But lets be clear... a fantasy of rape is not anything like a woman being actually raped where she has no power and her attacker has all the power. Maybe she gets hit .. maybe she gets stabbed or strangled and left in a ditch or a shallow grave.

And you kind of described some pretty damaged women if they want to be degraded. Or used as property.
That is not a rape fantasy.

And I also think that a lot of people lie about their sex lives on an internet forum. Like saying they've had women (plural) who wanted him to degrade them. Sounds more like Penthouse Forum than ATS forum. Sorry.

Thats a great question.

You definitely can do both, those arent your only 2 choices.

Also, yes many of my past relationships have been with damaged women, who have had histories of some form of abuse.

Im not sure where the crazy sexual requests come from... either...

1. Its simply what they like.
2. Due to their self worth, damaged past, they feel the need to be deemed acceptable by their partner, this is the only things that brings them joy, therefore they take the persona of what they think men want based on porn and pop culture.
3. There history of abuse has taught them that that is what it is supposed to be like.
4. A combination of all of those things?

Also take note, Im not saying I personally cannot accept the dichotomy of the situation...

Im leveling with the people who cant, and saying... I can see how that can be confusing. Its not a stretch.

originally posted by: InTheLight

originally posted by: ketsuko

originally posted by: InTheLight

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04

originally posted by: InTheLight

originally posted by: ketsuko

originally posted by: Sookiechacha
a reply to: ketsuko

So, you believe that Bill Clinton raped women, because they said so, but you don't believe that Trump raped women, because they said so?

No. I believe a lot of people in this thread want so desperately to believe this woman and to believe Blasey-Ford because they represent a possible means of removingfrom/barring from power people that they ideologically despise. It's belief born of political convenience more than anything else.

I don't have any stake in your political games, but when 22 accusations against this guy surface any reasonably fair and intelligent person would keep an open mind? How come your mind is so closed?

And when not one has panned out and some have been demonstrably false you should take your own advice about being open minded. Leeds was wrong about what plane it happened on, and the armrest, while it can be raised, usually required a flight attendant to do it and does not happen in the manner she described.

I put that down to crafty lawyers and not that the truth was ever found, let alone justice prevailing.

It's the lawyers' fault the truth was uncovered? Actually in this case the internet uncovered it and you cannot blame any good lawyer for bringing it up. The facts as they would have been do not fit the story meaning something was fishy somewhere. Things could not have happened the way the lady presented her case.

Blasey-Ford had the same problem.

Just because you "feel" something should be so doesn't mean it is. This is why we have a court that uses evidence as a primary means of deciding cases over testimony from witnesses.

So this one case makes all other rape accusations false? The hypocrisy from both sides here is ridiculous.

No, it simply highlights what the right has been saying all along, that each case should be evaluated on it's own merits. Every case should be viewed from the position of the skeptic and be beyond a reasonable doubt.

I think this is a subject that is nearly impossible to be talked about in an honest and open fashion.

Almost no one would admit to these fantasies even if they have them. Whether it's a male fantasizing about rape or a woman that has fantasies about being raped.

In the case of the male they don't want to be thought of as a rapist or potential rapists, nor give ammo to the idea of toxic masculinity, no matter if it's not something they'd ever really do. For most men it's a simple frustration/power fantasy the idea of being able to skip the bull# and just take what they want. Men actually have very little control in most relationships or how they progress. They don't really want to hurt anyone and find the idea of actually hurting a woman disgusting. There's virtually no threat that men with this kind of 'rape' fantasy would ever hurt or actually rape a woman. But most are too ashamed to admit having such a fantasy even if they find the idea of actually doing it disgusting.

For women it's ironically a very similar reason. It's a frustration/power fantasy as well. Women are constantly judged and expected to take control of the relationship, constantly expected to try and look their best, play hard to get. They are often especially in modern culture expected to maintain control at all times. The female rape fantasy is one brought about like male rape fantasy, born of extremes. The female isn't fanrasizing about some stranger brutally raping her. It's some fantasized male ideal that they want to take them and remove that control they are expected to maintain and allow them to simply be a sexual being with no expectations. Women don't admit to such fantasies because they fear it will give the rapists with the 'they wanted it' delusion fuel for their belief and lessen how bad real rape really is.

The male fantasy is born out of frustration due to having little control in how a relationship progresses.

The female fantasy is born out of frustration for having too much control and the expectation to maintain it.

Sometimes a man wants to be able to just express his affection and attraction, no questions asked, and sometimes a woman wants a man to be spontaneous and just shower them with affection and attraction, no questions asked.

I'm happy in my relationship, we don't play stupid games, and we don't give two #s about societies expectations. I want to kiss my girlfriend while walking, I'll stop and pull her to me and kiss her and she loves it. It doesn't matter where we are. If she wants to kiss me, she does it wherever. If one of us wants the other we just go for it, we don't ask for consent. If the other doesn't want it at the time they say so, though we typically relieve the other anyway in some fashion. We are affectionate and loving, have been since pretty much our relationship started little over two years ago, and it hasn't lessened one bit. We find it absurd the stupid control games most people play. A lot of the things we do to each other whenever we want within reason (public decency and all) most people would frown upon and think of as demeaning or treating each other as objects, but we both love each other, it feels nice and we think everyone is stupid to play dumb games when they could just take comfort in being close to each other.

All these rape fantasies, both kinds are because society has made us too damn uptight and put too many damn expectations on when where and how we can express ourselves sexually.

With the way some consent laws are being pushed, eventually we'll need to write out a script, get a lawyer to go over each act, and then have it signed and notorized just to have any kind of intimacy. That's no fun for either party. It's no wonder so many men and women have rape fantasies.

originally posted by: Boadicea

originally posted by: Lumenari
a reply to: ElectricUniverse

The Kinsey Report on female sexuality listed rape as the top fantasy women have.

So here we are.

Kinsey has since been discredited. To say the least. Here is a fairly mild account of how his data was faulty:

Alfred Kinsey was a pervert and a sex criminal

1. [Dr. Kinsey’s team] ‘forced’ subjects to give the desired answers to their sex questions, 2. Secretly trashed three quarters of their research data, and 3. Based their claims about normal males on a roughly 86 percent aberrant male population including 200 sexual psychopaths, 1,400 sex offenders and hundreds each of prisoners, male prostitutes and promiscuous homosexuals. Moreover, so few normal women would talk to them that the Kinsey team labeled women who lived over a year with a man ‘married,’ reclassifying data on prostitutes and other unconventional women as “Susie Homemaker.”

Kinsey was not a good person -- much less researcher!

modern research says that about 1/3 of women have some form of rape fantasies.

www.psychologytoday.com...

It's controversial, and rape is wrong, but some people are in to all kinds of stuff.

originally posted by: AaarghZombies

originally posted by: Boadicea

originally posted by: Lumenari
a reply to: ElectricUniverse

The Kinsey Report on female sexuality listed rape as the top fantasy women have.

So here we are.

Kinsey has since been discredited. To say the least. Here is a fairly mild account of how his data was faulty:

Alfred Kinsey was a pervert and a sex criminal

1. [Dr. Kinsey’s team] ‘forced’ subjects to give the desired answers to their sex questions, 2. Secretly trashed three quarters of their research data, and 3. Based their claims about normal males on a roughly 86 percent aberrant male population including 200 sexual psychopaths, 1,400 sex offenders and hundreds each of prisoners, male prostitutes and promiscuous homosexuals. Moreover, so few normal women would talk to them that the Kinsey team labeled women who lived over a year with a man ‘married,’ reclassifying data on prostitutes and other unconventional women as “Susie Homemaker.”

Kinsey was not a good person -- much less researcher!

modern research says that about 1/3 of women have some form of rape fantasies.

www.psychologytoday.com...

It's controversial, and rape is wrong, but some people are in to all kinds of stuff.

Consensual non-consent is not the same as rape though.

a reply to: AaarghZombies

modern research says that about 1/3 of women have some form of rape fantasies....[snip]...It's controversial, and rape is wrong, but some people are in to all kinds of stuff.

Yeah, it's definitely a thing for some women. I've checked out the numbers before, and they seem to vary, but they all come up with numbers that surprise me. But then I guess if I'm honest then even one would surprise me! I have to question the emotional/mental health of anyone who would fantasize about rape.

It is quite controversial -- both the subject matter and the surveys/studies.