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Conventional Wisdom On Tariffs Shattered: Import Prices Decline, Year Over Year.

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posted on Jun, 18 2019 @ 06:32 AM
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a reply to: Justoneman

That is unfortunate. He is about as opposite of a libertarian/classical liberal as possible.

He resembles a 1980's Democrat or a European protectionist.

Sadly most people high on his rhetoric don't seem to understand how fast the present is changing. While trump plays demagogue human genetic engineering advances, AI is advancing, block chain is advancing, and the economy is changing quickly because of the rapid advancement of tech and deep learning.

We don't need to make america like the good old days when we had an unbalanced manufacturing centered economy. It's gone. The future is here. If we don't talk about the real future soon we can count on the rich being the only ones with access to genetic engineering for disease and traits like IQ and skynet taking over.

This emotional demagoguery may feel good to those who feel disenfranchised but it doesnt help with the actual future. One that doesnt care about political rhetoric.




posted on Jun, 18 2019 @ 08:03 AM
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a reply to: luthier



The debt is growing faster than ever in history.


No it isn't.



Trump and his "roaring" economy is producing 2009 level bail out debt.


Federal spending is untethered from financial health of the economy. It's simply a budget made by congress to pay for the crap they want to pay for versus the tax receipts. Congress doesn't care what the tax receipts say, they're going to spend spend spend.



He is literally I mean literally calling for the feds to lower rates and start doing more quantitative easing. He directly says we need to do more quantitative easing.


He's doing art of the deal while attempting to outdo china to strengthen his position at the negotiating table. It's really that simple.



From personal, business, and as a nation we are in massive debt...record debt levels all the way through the economy.


Yes, because debt has never been this cheap. What happens when something is cheap? People get more of it.



While trump is playing 1980 Democrat and turning conservatives into Europeans the actual world is developing block chain tech, AI, and genetic engineering at a breakneck pace.


America is at the forefront of all of that.



The train is not stopping in 1980.


Who said it is?



We may destroy some farmers lives for the next 6 years if he stays in power but no positive change comes from unilateral decisions to the global economy.


Well then I guess you support trump. If it weren't for him, china 2025 would be on the table and if you're against unilateral decisions about the global economy, that's the real threat.



posted on Jun, 18 2019 @ 08:08 AM
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a reply to: Dfairlite

It seems you are confused of the constitutional rule of the president.

Perhaps you are a liberal progressive?



posted on Jun, 18 2019 @ 08:40 AM
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a reply to: luthier

Perhaps. Or maybe I just read Article 1, Section 9, Clause 7:



“No Money shall be drawn from the Treasury, but in Consequence of Appropriations made by Law; and a regular Statement and Account of the Receipts and Expenditures of all public Money shall be published from time to time.”


For those who don't understand the constitution, article 1 sets out the form and duties of congress, Article 2 sets out the form and duties of the executive, and article 3 sets out the form and duties of the judiciary..

Now, in the 20's congress tried to delegate some of this to the president by making him submit a budget, which he still does. But what comes out of congress is completely different than what goes in. We all know this because every year trump's budget funds the wall and every year the congress removes said funding. Every year he proposes cuts to programs and every year congress fattens those programs up. So while he certainly gets to say something about the budget, his say means very little. The only threat he has is veto and in some way that may put some responsibility on his shoulders. However, I have long contended that this is a congressional problem, not a presidential problem.



posted on Jun, 18 2019 @ 08:43 AM
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a reply to: Dfairlite

So just declare an emergency and bipass congress. Like selling arms to Saudis many in his own party voted against.

He has veto power and can be a real leader.
edit on 18-6-2019 by luthier because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 18 2019 @ 11:20 AM
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a reply to: luthier

I work I work in industrial automation as a tech.

The job our robots do does the work of 100s of employees at just this location and they are in process of consolidating multiple other warehouses into ours.

We are getting ready to automate 3 very large and well known corporations that are mostly unionized and pay on average of 17.50+ per employee at each distrobution location

By my own calculation we will eliminate between 15-30k median income jobs THIS YEAR ALONE

This old archaic ideology these people are rigidly holding onto no longer applies to the world were moving into.

Mind you, we are one of several companies in a highly competative market doing the same exact thing.

The future is now.



posted on Jun, 18 2019 @ 11:23 AM
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a reply to: luthier



So just declare an emergency and bipass congress.


You know, that's an interesting idea. I'd have to go look over the national emergencies act to see if it would be legal (off the top of my head I don't think it would qualify, but I could be wrong as I've never specifically looked at it from this angle).



He has veto power and can be a real leader.


You guys bitched and moaned when republicans shut down the government in 2014 (IIRC on the year) because of the deficit spending. Trump has shut it down twice now (with veto's or veto threats), of course followed by bitching and moaning. Trump holds the record for longest government shutdown in US history. Do you know how much democrats budged after that? Basically zero. So let me pose a question.

If trump said he was going to shut down the government until the budget was balanced, would you support that?



posted on Jun, 18 2019 @ 11:26 AM
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a reply to: toysforadults



This old archaic ideology these people are rigidly holding onto no longer applies to the world were moving into.


They say the same thing with every major evolution of technology. The underlying principles remain the same even though we no longer have many stage coach drivers.



posted on Jun, 18 2019 @ 11:50 AM
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Give it time. The real tariffs are only now taking effect with them escalating and exemptions being ended. I expect a dramatic economic crisis by the end of this year or early next year, as I’ve been saying. Time will tell. It’s funny, though, that we are largely taxing American companies in China, which taxes are to be passed onto us consumers.



posted on Jun, 18 2019 @ 12:00 PM
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a reply to: Dfairlite

I am an independent libertarianish voter. I never bitch when budgets are vetoed for things other than actual emergencies.



posted on Jun, 18 2019 @ 12:06 PM
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a reply to: Dfairlite

Uh...no no time has ever excelled like this. In human history.

While this dumb stuff gets debated that don't have reasonable plans anyway,...scientists are developing AGI, and figuring out how to raise IQ for those who can pay crispr tech...we are on the brink with quantum computing thanks to a few recent related discoveries. Like predicting entanglement etc..

We lived relatively similar for 1000's of years, a hundred years ago it changed drastically. Lots of riots over job losses (labor day riots) due to manufacturing advances...last 20 years quadrupled. Last five quintupled.



posted on Jun, 18 2019 @ 03:58 PM
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originally posted by: luthier
a reply to: Dfairlite

So just declare an emergency and bipass congress.

He isn't a dictator. His emergency declaration for the border security issues is based on reality.



posted on Jun, 18 2019 @ 04:27 PM
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a reply to: luthier

You ought to read the 5000 year leap. We're just doing the same thing, faster. Your fear of the future notwithstanding, people will still need to contribute to society in order to prosper. They will contribute in different ways than they currently do, just like they contribute in different ways now compared to how they did even a few decades ago.



posted on Jun, 18 2019 @ 05:09 PM
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a reply to: luthier

Oh but that's how congress does it. They'll stop sending out the welfare checks and cause chaos to get what they want (increased spending). We've seen them do similar things in the past. They'll maximize pain to keep that trough from running dry.



posted on Jun, 18 2019 @ 06:41 PM
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Oh man many of you are totally blind to the waves of changes already riding through our society from what automation is doing

Im seeing it first hand its picking up so fast you guys have no idea i plan on moving into an engineering position within 6 months if I continue to work my ass off



posted on Jun, 19 2019 @ 07:04 AM
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originally posted by: pexx421
Give it time. The real tariffs are only now taking effect with them escalating and exemptions being ended. I expect a dramatic economic crisis by the end of this year or early next year, as I’ve been saying.

This assumes that China won't back down.


Time will tell.

Exactly.

You have to understand the long game - just like with Mexico, the tariffs are hurting China's economy far more than ours. It is called short term pain for long term gain.


It’s funny, though, that we are largely taxing American companies in China, which taxes are to be passed onto us consumers.

But I thought taxing big mean nasty corporations was a good thing?



posted on Jun, 19 2019 @ 07:11 AM
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originally posted by: toysforadults
Oh man many of you are totally blind to the waves of changes already riding through our society from what automation is doing

Im seeing it first hand its picking up so fast you guys have no idea i plan on moving into an engineering position within 6 months if I continue to work my ass off

This is true, and it is the one real, actual argument that could be made that could explain how, economically, we could move to a system where people no longer have to 'work to make a living'.

Reminds me of a book by one of my favorite authors, Isaac Asimov, called The Naked Sun. A small number of colonists lead hermitic lives on a planet called Solaria, having their every need taken care of by robots.

Not that I think that would be a good thing, but done right, once robots got to the point they could maintain and even reproduce themselves - why not?

Of course, I believe at some point they'd wake up and realize - what do they need us for, and decide our fate in a millisecond.




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