Trying to resolve 9/11

a reply to: MoonMine

Richard Gauge?

Who lied about the twin tower falling through the path of greatest resistance?






Funny you want to use people to tell you what was in the video evidence? Than actually use the video evidence.

It like you believe people that ignore facts to target a target audience to push a product.

Vs people that state the facts actually found in the video evidence.

3WHAT ABOUT THE ALMOST FREE-FALL COLLAPSE OF THE TWIN TOWERS? The key is the “almost” modifier. If I told you I was making almost $100,000 and you found out I was making only $67,000, you’d say I was exaggerating. So stop exaggerating the collapse speed of the WTC Towers! The 80,000 tons of structural steel slowed down the collapses of the Twin Towers to about ⅔ (two-thirds) of free-fall.3 And the core collapsed at about 40% of free-fall speed, coming down last.4 According to Richard Gage: “To bring a building symmetrically down, what we have to do is remove the core columns.” But on 9/11 the stronger core columns came down last, which violates this supposed most fundamental rule of controlled demolition.
www.skeptic.com...

a reply to: MoonMine

What does your post have to do with...

I know I am no fun when I don’t let conspiracists move goal posts and don’t let them change subjects.

And this is where you provide evidence of charges actuating and columns being actively cut to initiated collapse. Even before building movement, What’s wrong? All three of the building collapses are right there in the photographic, audio, video, seismic evidence?

Is there evidence that hundred of charges was doing the below in hundreds of locations with the assistance of kicker charges to misalign columns?



Hell no

a reply to: MoonMine

Didn’t Gage also use a picture of a column cut during clean up by thermal lance as “proof” of thermite in his presentations?

a reply to: MoonMine

Didn’t Gage also state the fires were no hotter than normal office fires? I guess that rules out hundreds of fires fueled from hundreds of thermite charges burning over 4,000 F before building movement?

a reply to: MoonMine

At 13:27. The concrete was pulverized to a fine powder.
Good thing a large portion of the WTC dust was insulation.

Concrete not pulverized to a fine powder. Tell that to this building collapse.


And don’t tell that to this hydraulic jack controlled demolition

a reply to: MoonMine

Would you like to elaborate on Gages claim a count down was heard on a Red Cross Radio. How many first responders died at the WTC? But they were in on the count down?

Good Gosh. You believe anything in the name of CONSPIRACY!

That’s right. I F’N used all CAPS &ITHES!

originally posted by: neutronflux
a reply to: MoonMine

Didn’t Gage also use a picture of a column cut during clean up by thermal lance as “proof” of thermite in his presentations?

He did, i remember that one, don't know if uses that picture anymore though(not in the special grand jury evidence at least).

originally posted by: neutronflux
a reply to: MoonMine

Didn’t Gage also state the fires were no hotter than normal office fires? I guess that rules out hundreds of fires fueled from hundreds of thermite charges burning over 4,000 F before building movement?

Do not be jumping the gun on temps and exaggerate. Differentiate the temperatus below and above impact point. I remember firefighters reporting, on the radio, temp conditions just below the impact point as being workable.

originally posted by: democracydemo

originally posted by: neutronflux
a reply to: MoonMine

Didn’t Gage also use a picture of a column cut during clean up by thermal lance as “proof” of thermite in his presentations?

He did, i remember that one, don't know if uses that picture anymore though(not in the special grand jury evidence at least).

What a joke...

Debunked: The WTC 9/11 Angle Cut Column. [Not Thermite, Cut Later]

Thread starter Mick West Start dateJan 27, 2018


Post by:
Mick West Jul 10, 2018
#127
Tomi said:
What Gage says in the video is “Could this be thermite?“ He does not say it is evidence of thermite and so in his mind he is not a liar but just asking questions

He says "This is some of the leftover 45 degree cuts on the columns at the world trade center you see them again and again and again. Could that be thermite?"

Not also the slide says "Before Iron workers on site", which is false as the photo was taken six weeks after to collapse.

www.metabunk.org...

originally posted by: democracydemo

originally posted by: neutronflux
a reply to: MoonMine

Didn’t Gage also state the fires were no hotter than normal office fires? I guess that rules out hundreds of fires fueled from hundreds of thermite charges burning over 4,000 F before building movement?

Do not be jumping the gun on temps and exaggerate. Differentiate the temperatus below and above impact point. I remember firefighters reporting, on the radio, temp conditions just below the impact point as being workable.

Jump what gun. It’s in AE’s website. They clear state the fires were not hotter than normal office fires.

Again.

Didn’t Gage also state the fires were no hotter than normal office fires? I guess that rules out hundreds of fires fueled from hundreds of thermite charges burning over 4,000 F before building movement?


Is there evidence that hundred of charges was doing the below in hundreds of locations with the assistance of kicker charges to misalign columns?



Hell no

a reply to: neutronflux

Ah yes sorry i was thinking you were addressing the possibility of pre-ignition, a non-controllable scenario, regarding temperature of Nano-thermitic material below impact point - in the core column stucture.

Is there evidence that hundred of charges was doing the below in hundreds of locations with the assistance of kicker charges to misalign columns?

There is, hundreds even, if you have the right timing for all 47 core columns to dislodge at multiple levels and let gravity do her worst:

a reply to: democracydemo

See your pushing your old manufactured evidence. You are falsely pushing sounds of fire and building collapse that has nothing to do with charges columns. Your narrative in not supported by the seismic and physical evidence.

Again...

originally posted by: neutronflux
a reply to: democracydemo

Again with your recoding.

originally posted by: neutronflux

originally posted by: democracydemo
a reply to: neutronflux

You created your own “evidence”.
Now again... "I counted them on the video did i not?"
Is that after your claim you tweaked the audio? So you are manipulating the sound? Where, if the “explosions” actually had the force to cut steel columns, the detonations would be clear, obvious, and would have echoed about manhattan. Let’s say you claim eight loud bangs that are expected from any large building fire, or from a structure failing by overloading. Eight bangs who’s audio you manipulated, is that false?

Tweaked and manipulated the sound...oh sweet baby Jeesus.

Tell you what

1.Download the original Huibregtse clip:
archive.org...

2.Get a decent Audio Editor (i use WavePad)

3.Since explosive detonations create low frequencies this is where you want to concentrate on. So a Band-Pass filter must be used.
See where i whipped mine: 96-169Hz
Essentially this operation disregards the helicopter and random street noise, leaving the juicy bits.

4. Report back if your results vary.

Don’t have too. Your created evidence and frequencies are not reflected in the seismic data for detentions with the force to cut steel columns. By frequency, how can you tell if a fire cracker sets off vs a pressurized air conditioning unit exploding in a fire. Other then the ac unit exploding would be more forceful. Again, nobody is say there were no explosions. But, keep on making your own reality.

And the whole argument.

originally posted by: neutronflux

originally posted by: democracydemo
a reply to: neutronflux

With ease:

The same old out of context with no attempt at quantification argument.

Nobody disagrees there was explosions from closed pressurized systems like refrigeration units and air conditioning units cutting loose in the fires. And nobody disagrees there wasn’t a pop when floor connections failed as in WTC 5 being an example.


A detonation that makes a transient pressure wave in the atmosphere where the pressure wave has the force to cut steel columns is entirely different.

And your easily debunked again.

originally posted by: neutronflux
a reply to: democracydemo

You didn’t hit a nerve with me. You created your own “evidence”.

Now again...

I counted them on the video did i not?

Is that after your claim you tweaked the audio? So you are manipulating the sound? Where, if the “explosions” actually had the force to cut steel columns, the detonations would be clear, obvious, and would have echoed about manhattan.

Let’s say you claim eight loud bangs that are expected from any large building fire, or from a structure failing by overloading.

Eight bangs who’s audio you manipulated, is that false?

Next, there is no way CD systems would survive the jet impacts and fires to initiate collapse on the floors impacted by the jets as attested to by the video evidence.

Next you claim:

Nature of material used to cut core colums (Nano-thermite anyone)?

If you are saying nano-thermite cut the columns by shockwave, it still would have to create a pressure wave to cut the columns. The energy created by that shockwave is still going to produce audible energy of at least 130 dB.

If you are saying thermite cut the core columns, then why is the no visible white hot sparking from the WTC video evidence. Why would there be “explosive” sounds. Thermite burns relatively slow. Why is there no glowing metal from the collapse video?



Next. You.

Would, lets say, a normal shaped cutting charges even leave this evidence in the first place? Provide evidence for your claim!

But you are not claiming shape cutting charges are you?

You claim eight explosions from the video you “tweaked”?

I did some tinkering with the original video/audio and ended up with this:

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Oh. Sorry. You tinkered. Nice that you “tinkered” to create your “evidence” that should be obvious.

Anyway.

You again.

Would, lets say, a normal shaped cutting charges even leave this evidence in the first place? Provide evidence for your claim!

Let’s say you claimed eight loud bands you
Tinkered into “evidence”.

You claim eight cutting charges? Well, flight 175 probably took out about 7 core columns, and the tower did not fall.

Some estimates are more than 7 core columns taken out by Flight 175, with no serious consideration the tower would have collapsed from the jet impact.

That indicates your eight supposed “explosions” could not be cutting charges on individual core columns to take out enough of the 44 core columns to initiate collapse. For you fantasy to work, the supposed explosives would had to be wide area in nature. Not eight shape charges only taking out eight columns. Explosions that would need to take out multiple core columns with each detonation. Explosions that would look like the one event that is known to have taken out 7 core columns, and produced a seismic event of .7 magnitude.




Again. CD systems would not have survived the jet impacts and fires to initiate collapse of the twin towers as attested to by video evidence.

You are falsely confusing expect sounds of “explosions” from a building fire, and expected from a building failing from being overloaded.

You have produced no evidence of explosions with the force to cut steel columns. Explosions that would be obvious, awe inspiring, and echoed about manhattan.
Very similar to the explosive sounds starting around 4:14 mark of the FDR drive video

18 Views of "Plane Impact" in South Tower | 9/11 World Trade Center [HD DOWNLOAD]
m.youtube.com...

How far is FDR drive fromWTC 2?

But you only have audio you “tinkered” with from expected normal building fires, or sounds from a building being overloaded.

You cannot produce physical evidence of columns cut by pyrotechnics. Especially when the truth movement claims the resistance of each floor had to be removed by removing the structural steel of each floor.

a reply to: neutronflux

Don’t have too. Your created evidence and frequencies are not reflected in the seismic data for detentions with the force to cut steel columns. By frequency, how can you tell if a fire cracker sets off vs a pressurized air conditioning unit exploding in a fire. Other then the ac unit exploding would be more forceful. Again, nobody is say there were no explosions. But, keep on making your own reality.

You still can't debunk my video can you? After giving you a step-by-step instruction to replicate the result, did you even try? Reality bites, does it not.

a reply to: democracydemo

What? The video you admitted to tampering with?

I did some tinkering with the original video/audio and ended up with this:

That video. With no audio of fire related explosions, not planted charges, with the strength to cut steel columns. The seismic evidence showing there were no explosions with the force to cut steel columns. With no evidence of splintered steel from explosions. With no evidence of steel being worked on by explosives.


Your argument is something you manufactured, and not supported by any citable evidence.

a reply to: democracydemo

Which is false from the onset in there is no evidence the core was cut before building movement. With no indication of a pressure wave with the force e to cut steel columns in the video/audio/seismic evidence. With it being impossible a CD system would survive the jet impacts and fires to initiate a collapse as captured on video from multiple angles.

You have at least five strikes against your manufactured evidence.

a reply to: neutronflux

1.Download the original Huibregtse clip:
archive.org...

2.Get a decent Audio Editor (i use WavePad)

3.Since explosive detonations create low frequencies this is where you want to concentrate on. So a Band-Pass filter must be used.
See where i whipped mine: 96-169Hz
Essentially this operation disregards the helicopter and random street noise, leaving the juicy bits.

4. Report back if your results vary.


Yes that video:

What? The video you admitted to tampering with?

Repeat or debunk the actual evidence i have presented, before you make such a bold claim. Can you do either?

originally posted by: democracydemo
a reply to: neutronflux

1.Download the original Huibregtse clip:
archive.org...

2.Get a decent Audio Editor (i use WavePad)

3.Since explosive detonations create low frequencies this is where you want to concentrate on. So a Band-Pass filter must be used.
See where i whipped mine: 96-169Hz
Essentially this operation disregards the helicopter and random street noise, leaving the juicy bits.

4. Report back if your results vary.


Yes that video:

What? The video you admitted to tampering with?

Repeat or debunk the actual evidence i have presented, before you make such a bold claim. Can you do either?

What are you babbling about.

The first step is there is no reflection in the seismic evidence of detonation with the force to cut steel columns. Period. Game over dude.

The second step is there is no evidence of a pressure transient with the force to cut steel columns.

The third step. There is no evidence columns were cut by detonations.

Your so intellectually void you will not event state how many core columns had to be cut to make your conspiracy fantasy work. How many charges and what type it would take to make your fantasy work. And you will not state how your manufactured evidence supports your fantasy.

Again..

Don’t have too. Your created evidence and frequencies are not reflected in the seismic data for detonations with the force to cut steel columns. By frequency, how can you tell if a fire cracker sets off vs a pressurized air conditioning unit exploding in a fire. Other then the ac unit exploding would be more forceful. Again, nobody is say there were no explosions. But, keep on making your own reality.


Nobody disagrees there was explosions from closed pressurized systems like refrigeration units and air conditioning units cutting loose in the fires. And nobody disagrees there wasn’t a pop when floor connections failed as in WTC 5 being an example.

All you have is expected sounds of a structural failure.

Crane collapse in New York City kills one: ‘It sounded like 9/11 again’
Two others seriously injured after crane collapses in Tribeca neighbourhood and crushes several cars stretching the length of a city block

www.theguardian.com...

Charlie Jones, 35, a builder at a neighbouring construction site, said the sound of the collapse was so loud that he initially thought it might have been a terrorist attack. He saw many people running out of buildings and up the streets in panic, he said.

“I thought it was a bomb,” Jones said.

Memories still haunt those in Big Blue tragedy at Miller Park

We didn't know if it was a bomb or something.

archive.jsonline.com...

Big Blue crane collapse at Miller Park
m.youtube.com...

Very tragic. But at about the 40 second mark you here booms like the ones in you manufactured evidence.

Now. So? What tool is there to differentiate a loud boom from a mechanical failure vs a detonation with the force to cut steel columns.

Seismic evidence. And the seismic from the WTC shows there was no detonations that cut steel columns.

Sorry.

a reply to: democracydemo

I am a conspiracist. I want my controlled demolition fantasy to be real. I will ignore there is no evidence in the seismic evidence of explosions with the force to cut steel columns. I will ignore there is no physical evidence of cut columns. I will ignore there was no distinctive demolition’s shrapnel. I will take audio from the WTC of the sounds of expected mechanical failures. I will manipulate that audio to until I manufacture the “evidence” I desired. I will falsely push that manipulated audio as “evidence” of explosions with the force to cut steel columns even though others people’s attempts have been debunked. I am the special one. And I will make no effort to quantify / qualify my manufacturer “evidence” by showing actual comparisons by contrasting/comparing audio from actual mechanical failures vs actual explosions cutting steel. Even when the sounds of mechanical failures are available on line. Whaaaaa I am a conspiracists being called out because I am pushing manufactured “evidence” not supported by the a actual events and not reflected in the seismic evidence.

a reply to: democracydemo

Any way. If you have the “smoking gun” evidence, why mess with a small time operator like me? If you had real brass kahunas, you would post your “evidence” at International Skeptics or Metabunk. I think that would make a great thread here at ATS. A thread about your account and experience posting real “evidence” to show those guys at International Skeptic who is boss, and how you dominated. Looking forward to your progress reports in a new thread.

originally posted by: neutronflux
a reply to: turbonium1

You are F’n wrong

But the only issue to clarify, first of all, is to prove that such a collapse, from only random fire/damage, is impossible. It cannot happen, in any way

The Plasco Building (Persian: ساختمان پلاسکو‎, romanized: Sâxtmâň-e Plaskô) was a 17-story high-rise landmark building in Tehran, the capital city of Iran. At the time of its construction in the 1960s it was the tallest building in Iran[1] and was considered an iconic part of the Tehran skyline.[2] The building collapsed on 19 January 2017 during a high-rise fire.[3]

en.m.wikipedia.org...

Massive high-rise fire causes building to collapse in Brazil, at least 1 dead
By Karma Allen,Aicha El Hammar Castano
May 1, 2018, 5:26 PM ET

abcnews.go.com...

A massive fire engulfed two high-rise structures in Sao Paulo, Brazil, on Tuesday, causing one of the buildings to collapse.

Video posted on social media early Tuesday showed a 24-story building crumbling to the ground as flames raced toward the top floor, killing at least one person.

THE FIRE AT THE TORRE WINDSOR OFFICE BUILDING, MADRID 2005

www.structural-safety.org...

Consequential damage
In the absence of any protection the mullions weakened in the heat. A sufficient number lost their required load capacity causing sections of the building above the upper strong floor at level 17 to collapse. It is likely that only the presence of this floor prevented total progressive collapse. At lower levels none of the fire protected mullions failed. The mullions distorted at the 9th level (yet to receive their protection), but there was sufficient load sharing amongst the remainder-above and below this level- to prevent collapse of the floors. Notwithstanding the failure of the mullions, the reinforced concrete structure also suffered serious damage as a consequence of the temperature attained.

The above making your words below totally empty and baseless.

Shame on you for claiming such blatant falsehoods in the first place!

Your claim is so ridiculous, on any level, to keep spewing it, is truly shameful, and repugnant.

So. How is “ that such a collapse, from only random fire/damage, is impossible. It cannot happen, in any way” actually a true statement in any way?

That's another CD, obviously. No building can collapse like that, from only fire/damage.

When puffs of smoke suddenly start coming out of the lower parts of the building, moments before the collapse, it is a blatant indication of a CD!

When a building that's intact on all the lower floors, puffs smoke out those floors, it's only when they CD it, for sure.