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Free Traders No More?

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posted on Jun, 7 2019 @ 06:00 PM
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With President Donald Trump threatening to slap tariffs on goods from Mexico, his transformation of Republican Party trade policy is nearly complete.

Republican lawmakers usually don't like tariffs. They're viewed as a tax on consumers and unwanted government intervention in free trade. But many Republicans, unwilling to buck Trump, are prepared to follow the president's lead and support 5% tariffs on Mexico in his dispute over illegal immigration.


nytimes.com


I love this opening to the article. It's blunt, it pulls no punches and tells it like it is. But it seems most Republicans these days aren't even aware that they're stepping over everything they've always believed in, just so they can support an icon and fall in with his views.

How many thousands of times, or tens of thousands of times, have we seen people stand up for and support Free Trade here on ATS?

How many thousands of times have those same people fought for and ardently defended against government intervention and overreach?

And now?

...Crickets...

What happened Patriots? What happened Republicans?

Will you be able to find your way back to your values when this is all done?




posted on Jun, 7 2019 @ 06:04 PM
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It's still free trade, just on another level.



posted on Jun, 7 2019 @ 06:07 PM
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a reply to: Duderino

When conservatives talk about free trade we are talking about trade in our country, unfettered by governmental regulation.

Tariffs, on the other hand, were once the only mechanism we had to fund the Federal government.

Apples and oranges, but the left (who thinks that taxing everything IS the answer, unless it's not them doing it) are probably not going to understand the difference.

Which isn't the point of the NY Times article anyways...

It's just a convenient "Orange Man Bad" argument.

Unless you can post for me a link or two on them criticizing the absolutely insane amount of actual tax increases the Democratic Presidential candidates are proposing.




posted on Jun, 7 2019 @ 06:08 PM
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Free trading with commies who are engaging in espionage against us, manipulate currency, steal intellectual property, and pollute more than anyone, while imposing tariffs on US to begin with, isn't a good idea. Free trade doesn't mean let the other guy hose you.

Mexico encourages illegal aliens to enter the country, beginning at their southern border. They are so corrupt that they protect drug cartels while their citizens are brutally murdered and local governments collapse. They send billions in narcotics into our nation, and turn a blind eye to the human trafficking epidemic in their nation. Why shouldn't we demand better from our neighbors to the south?

Rewarding countries for taking advantage of us and engaging in criminal activity at our expense isn't a free market principle.
edit on 7 6 19 by projectvxn because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 7 2019 @ 06:12 PM
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Fair trade would be better.

Free trade shouldn't be a license for foreign countries to exploit the US economy with massive trade deficits.

imo



posted on Jun, 7 2019 @ 06:14 PM
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That five percent tarriff will not even pay the healthcare and benefits that illegals receive in this country. Many come to the USA to get treatments for diseases which are tacked onto money our citizens pay for those services, both by direct taxation and fees added on to reimburse hospital costs by health insurance companies...raising the rate they pay the hospitals by those who are insured. This raises our insurance rates country wide for anyone getting insurance policies. This came into effect before Obama came into office, but Obama care capitalized on this change, so employers pay more for insurances, people cannot get raises.



posted on Jun, 7 2019 @ 06:17 PM
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a reply to: Duderino

Sometimes you have to use real threats backed up by real action to get the job done. I think trump did the right thing. Mexico has allegedly deployed 6000 troops to their southern border to help stop these migrations.

Cheers - Dave



posted on Jun, 7 2019 @ 06:22 PM
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originally posted by: bobs_uruncle
a reply to: Duderino

Sometimes you have to use real threats backed up by real action to get the job done. I think trump did the right thing. Mexico has allegedly deployed 6000 troops to their southern border to help stop these migrations.

Cheers - Dave




Perhaps those troops are there to help the migrants get through, perhaps they are a response to the armed vigilantes that have been going to the border to stop the immigrants . We know the media is all spin so where does the truth lie?



posted on Jun, 7 2019 @ 06:24 PM
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a reply to: Duderino
Can you cite a specific Republican going back thirty years who championed the cause of global free trade while those we traded with imposed heavy tariffs in our goods?? I believe you should be able to find a handful, and I would like to know their names and the context of the global free trade with states that tariff our goods they were championing. From what I can tell, we still trade freely here in the USA.

Seeking documented facts, not opinionated speculation/accusations. Horse's mouth testimony will work as facts.



posted on Jun, 7 2019 @ 06:39 PM
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a reply to: Duderino

The trump tax is ok with me. I'm ok with taxes if the money is used to benefit us all.

This is one of those things that we have to wait and see.

Could be good for us in the long run.
Could be bad.

Could be a degree of both.

I'm usually ok with trying something so I'm just going to wait and see.



posted on Jun, 7 2019 @ 06:46 PM
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a reply to: worldstarcountry

Lmao...good luck...these dudes can do nothing but whine about orange man bad.



posted on Jun, 7 2019 @ 06:56 PM
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originally posted by: Duderino
But it seems most Republicans these days aren't even aware that they're stepping over everything they've always believed in, just so they can support an icon and fall in with his views.


BULLCRAP!!!

I present to you, EXHIBIT A, posted by me in January of 2009... long, long before Donald Trump ever rocked the apple cart with talk of trade barriers and tariffs.


Step 1: Repeal NAFTA, institute stiff taxes & tariffs on imported goods and, especially, on outsourced labor from US-based compnaies, withdraw the United States from the World Trade Organization, institute tax credits & cuts for corporations & small businesses based on percentages of US citizens employed.


The GOP lawmakers who have lambasted the President over tariffs are self identifying as RINOs. Conservatives have a much, much more robust history supporting national protectionism than they have pushing for unbalanced, unfair to the USA, "free" trade.
www.marketwatch.com...

From the Civil War until the eve of World War I, Republicans largely dominated the U.S. government, so average tariffs were set as high as 50%. Some elections during this period were fought largely over the tariff issue. The “Great Tariff Debate” of 1888 ended in victory for the Republicans, who then enacted the McKinley Tariff of 1890.


www.theamericanconservative.com...

Every Republican platform from 1884 to 1944 professed the party’s faith in protection. Free trade was introduced by the party of Woodrow Wilson and FDR. Our modern free-trade era began with the Trade Expansion Act of 1962. Among the eight no votes in the Senate were Barry Goldwater and Prescott Bush.

Even in recent crises, Republican presidents have gone back to the economic nationalism of their Grand Old Party. With the Brits coming for our gold and Japanese imports piling up, President Nixon in 1971 closed the gold window and imposed a 10 percent tariff on Japanese goods. Ronald Reagan slapped a 50 percent tariff on Japanese motorcycles being dumped here to kill Harley-Davidson, then put quotas on Japanese auto imports, and on steel and machine tools. Reagan was a conservative of the heart. Though a free trader, he always put America first.

What, then, does history teach?

The economic nationalism and protectionism of Hamilton, Madison, Jackson, and Henry Clay, and the Party of Lincoln, McKinley, Teddy Roosevelt, and Coolidge, of all four presidents on Mount Rushmore, made America the greatest and most self-sufficient republic in history.

And the free-trade, one-worldism of Bush I, Clinton, Bush II and Obama enabled Communist China to shoulder us aside us and become the world’s No. 1 manufacturing power.


I reject and rebuke anyone who claims that national protectionist economic policy is not a cornerstone of real conservativism and, consequently, something that should be exalted within the GOP platform.

ETA: Feel free to try to argue that I'm not an actual conservative or Republican, by the way... that's always a hoot.

edit on 7-6-2019 by burdman30ott6 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 7 2019 @ 07:17 PM
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a reply to: RickyD
Hey now, let's give op a chance. I know there has to be a couple, and if he wants he can go all the way back to the founding of the nation. But all i need is a name, and what they were saying about Free trade being great.

Frankly we can all blame Kissinger for how quickly China took over global manufacturing, he was instrumental in the state level introductions that led to meetings and policy changes.
edit on 6-7-2019 by worldstarcountry because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 7 2019 @ 08:18 PM
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posted on Jun, 7 2019 @ 10:48 PM
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originally posted by: hopenotfeariswhatweneed

originally posted by: bobs_uruncle
a reply to: Duderino

Sometimes you have to use real threats backed up by real action to get the job done. I think trump did the right thing. Mexico has allegedly deployed 6000 troops to their southern border to help stop these migrations.

Cheers - Dave


Perhaps those troops are there to help the migrants get through, perhaps they are a response to the armed vigilantes that have been going to the border to stop the immigrants . We know the media is all spin so where does the truth lie?


Mexico stated it was sending the troops to curb Central America and South American transit through Mexico. Seems an agreement has been reached. There is nothing wrong with protecting your borders. If you think there is, maybe you should invite bed bugs into your home?

Cheers - Dave



posted on Jun, 7 2019 @ 11:37 PM
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a reply to: bobs_uruncle

I don't have issues with border control it's necessary, I have little faith though in either politicians or the media.



posted on Jun, 8 2019 @ 08:55 AM
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originally posted by: hopenotfeariswhatweneed
a reply to: bobs_uruncle

I don't have issues with border control it's necessary, I have little faith though in either politicians or the media.


I have no faith in politicians, however trump is not a politician. He's more a "I'm here to chew bubblegum and kick ass and I'm all out of bubblegum" type of guy. I hope he never becomes a politician.

Cheers - Dave



posted on Jun, 8 2019 @ 05:14 PM
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a reply to: bobs_uruncle

Fair enough, I see him more like a " play favorites and talk out of his ass " kinda guy, each to their own I guess.







 
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