Crop circles are underground structures

a reply to: Zanti Misfit

You did not get the basic information about molding and casting,, Did you?

The holes are not drilled, they are structures in the master mold, depending on various things, the structures can be made from natural rubber or "lost materials" such as wax or wood.

This is not just a song.

I only got a small break, and do not have the time to go over novice level information.

a reply to: Waterglass

If one goes over the material in these pages, it becomes obvious why scientists have found strange properties in the material, of the stones, including acoustic.

a reply to: AaarghZombies

It is all right in front of you,

What were these moulds made of, how were they formed because my understanding of a mould is that it has to have the shape and size of the product it produces, plus the extraneous material of the mould itself.

A mould for the Baalbek megalith would have to be huge to some degree...how was that mould made and of what material?

Where are the remnants of these moulds?

If a mould had a small 'flaw' in it, like a tiny flaw on a camera lens, for instance, would that not be repeated on every megalith it produced?

I understand the thinking behind this theory, I just do not believe it is correct.

originally posted by: fromtheskydown
What were these moulds made of, how were they formed because my understanding of a mould is that it has to have the shape and size of the product it produces, plus the extraneous material of the mould itself.

A mould for the Baalbek megalith would have to be huge to some degree...how was that mould made and of what material?

Where are the remnants of these moulds?

If a mould had a small 'flaw' in it, like a tiny flaw on a camera lens, for instance, would that not be repeated on every megalith it produced?

I understand the thinking behind this theory, I just do not believe it is correct.

Well, i can not say because many mold materials deteriorate, depending how complex, and how many you will need to produce, a simple square rock may be just wooden boards, coated with a release agent, like lard, oil, you could even use leaves as a release agent.

But complex art pieces like the sarcophagus lid of Pacal, most likely, the original is made from wood, carving and sanding,, then it could be pressed in clay, then lifted up, then poured, and hardened, one could make the mold from natural rubber, then a fine layer of beeswax could be used as a release agent, the tiny "drilled" holes you see in puma punku pieces, were most likely just wooden sticks, or a wax , then it was lost during the curing process.

And the molds, well as i said, even the best of modern molds do not live as long as the casts that were born from them.

Also interesting, one can add the look of chiseling to the finished piece, lots of people do this still today, for various reasons, and one can also hide tool markings by heating, or with acids.

The baalbek monolith could have been made inside a wooden box, then it would have to been sealed from the inside, using tar and resins, then the inside of the mold sanded to a nice smooth finish, then just mix and pour, demolding could have been done by carefully hammering away the outside board, or just set on fire and burn the mold away.

All depends on how strong and how complex you need the form to be.
And what materials are powdered, some of them only needs water, and time to cure, other stronger mixes need heating and acids.

You ever heard that the Nahuatl world for Olmec actually means "Rubber people" funny is it not?

originally posted by: solve
a reply to: stonerwilliam

Still need a couple of months, but soon will be able to conduct experiments following the footsteps of the master alchemists of old, such as High Priest Imhotep and our lord, K`inich Janaab`Pakal.

The focus will be on reverse-engineered Geopolymers and ancient Metamaterials.

I Hope some one goes bat# crazy and puts together the items stated and reports back

a reply to: stonerwilliam

Pulled the first object from the mold, ended up crushing and filtering granite in the Geopolymer mix, among other ingredients, was surprised how little effort it takes to crush stones and minerals to a fine powder.

Used fluorite and labradorite dust as a release agent, also gave the object a nice surface.

Very impressed with the results, also bubbles were present and it looked very similar to the ones observed in some of the old stones.

a reply to: stonerwilliam

A small update,

I could not prove to myself the Andesite theory, still believe in it.

But.

There is no doubt in my mind anymore, about huge pyramid blocks that are made from sandstone, it was very easy to create, and would be plain stupidity to try to lift those blocks up, much easier and faster to crush them by the cubic meter, and reconstruct them to where they need to be.

originally posted by: solve
a reply to: stonerwilliam

A small update,

I could not prove to myself the Andesite theory, still believe in it.

But.

There is no doubt in my mind anymore, about huge pyramid blocks that are made from sandstone, it was very easy to create, and would be plain stupidity to try to lift those blocks up, much easier and faster to crush them by the cubic meter, and reconstruct them to where they need to be.

The difficult bit is ensuring that they remain chemically identical to the original bedrock. Recreating all the bedding planes. And getting every single piece of crushed rock to be exactly the size and shape of the sand grains from which the original rock was made millions of years before.

a reply to: AndyMayhew

This was an interesting clip, very short, i recommend watching it,

I am only trying my best to prove or disprove this by experimentation, this theory offers answers to lots questions, and it also is in line with ancient legends.

I have been having trouble finding suitable naturally weathered and depleted rocks, most likely need to order them from somewhere.

originally posted by: AndyMayhew

originally posted by: solve
a reply to: stonerwilliam

A small update,

I could not prove to myself the Andesite theory, still believe in it.

But.

There is no doubt in my mind anymore, about huge pyramid blocks that are made from sandstone, it was very easy to create, and would be plain stupidity to try to lift those blocks up, much easier and faster to crush them by the cubic meter, and reconstruct them to where they need to be.

The difficult bit is ensuring that they remain chemically identical to the original bedrock. Recreating all the bedding planes. And getting every single piece of crushed rock to be exactly the size and shape of the sand grains from which the original rock was made millions of years before.

Lol! All through this I've been thinking "a geologist could probably tell us about this better...."

Megalith mystery is fun to dive into.

Molding, softening, or even liquifying rock is an interesting theory, at least. It at least makes it more plausible to be moving such large rocks a far distance, if they could break the task into small parts, and then combine them into single, bigger, stones at the final location.

Otherwise we need to figure out how they made ropes that were stronger than silk, to move heavy rocks. Even if you have a million people pulling together, it's all for nothing if the rope snaps.

a reply to: bloodymarvelous

All i can say for sure at this point, is that sandstone and granite type stones are possible to create, and i have created them.

One interesting sentence that keeps popping up in my research is-

-Geopolymer that is indistinguishable from natural stone-

I have seen lots of data, that proves this is a possibility

AND
I have not seen data, that tells me that this is impossible because X reason.

a reply to: bloodymarvelous

One more interesting bit-

60-100nm Spherical silica particles occurring in the pyramid stones are not found in the local, natural sedimentary stones of Giza.


Ok, so how did they find their way in the blocks?

When you look at the number of modern discoveries in chemistry, that were made by accident, it gets harder and harder to discount ancient tinkerers discovering something.

www.sciencealert.com...

Sometimes the greatest breakthroughs happen when you abandon your knowledge, and just try something.

Here are some more accidental modern chemistry discoveries:

mentalfloss.com...



Basically, when we suggest that ancient people might have possessed a chemical technology we don't have in the modern world, what we are really suggesting, is that they had different accidents than us.

That is...um.... the nature of accidents in general, is it not? To be random?

The question that has been bothering me, so far is : if they had the technology to make synthetic granite, then why is it still granite? Why not make a new kind of material, instead of mimicking existing rocks?


Is the idea that they were able to take fragments of granite and liquify it and cast it again?


I've been reading about super heated water for a bit. Wondering if that will lead somewhere. Granite is known to be weakened by water, if you apply it right. But I don't know if you could use superheated water to combine smaller fragments. (And I really don't know whether it would cause spherical silica particles to appear or not. Maybe?)

en.wikipedia.org...


Basically superheated water is something people create by accident all the time if they heat water in a microwave oven. It's certainly unlikely the ancients had microwaves, but you could create a similar effect if you focused a lot of sunlight onto a smooth vessel full of water.

If they treated granite with superheated water, that could explain the very smooth surfaced statues in Egypt, for example.

I just don't can't seem to find enough information to know whether you can combine smaller fragments into a single rock that way.

a reply to: bloodymarvelous

Final update, i came to a very disturbing conclusion the other day while conducting experiments.

Basically, if one is interested and looks in the subject of geopolymer technology, It reveals that these structures have two basic categories.

Genuine and old.

Fake, and alarmingly recent.

Will be continued in another thread that will be presented as fiction, once i have organized some things.

Happy hunting!

-Edit- if interest to Geopolymers was awakened, keep a close eye to the places that research it, and patents involving them, new discoveries are made all the time,

And may the silent ones who fell from the stars shine light to your path.

a reply to: solve

Good Thread for discussion.

I don't believe crop circles are from underground structures. Just my opinion.

And as far as crushing stone to powder, carry to the site then put into mold, it does not make sense to me either. How would they build something like the New Ellora Caves of India for example with the method you propose? I suspect there is more to it than just molds or stone softening here. I am no expert on the subject but I am intrigue as much as anyone about stone structures built in antiquity that are mind boggling.

A theory about many old civilizations with advance technology have been around before us, should also be considered and I believe those caves, pyramids and temples are much older than what we're lead to believe. Michael Cremo talks on that subject.
Thank you for bringing that up, antiquity is a mystery that just might reveal our past. s&f

a reply to: solve

Here is the New Ellora caves

originally posted by: solve
a reply to: stonerwilliam

A small update,

I could not prove to myself the Andesite theory, still believe in it.

But.

There is no doubt in my mind anymore, about huge pyramid blocks that are made from sandstone, it was very easy to create, and would be plain stupidity to try to lift those blocks up, much easier and faster to crush them by the cubic meter, and reconstruct them to where they need to be.

Found this on my travels on the interweb and thought of this thread

www.stolenhistory.org...

skip to the 1839 news paper article