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Trade schools are for blue collar work. Blue collar work is being devalued by the day, and in another 40 years will almost entirely disappear. It has no future, because it does not educate individuals enough. It creates drones, not people who will revolutionize industries that can keep America competitive in a world where businesses generate revenue globally but spend it locally.
originally posted by: Aazadan
a reply to: Subsonic
Here's the thing, those online courses are crap. Not all of them, but most are. Things like Coursera and Udacity are scams. That is not knowledge, it is watching a youtube video. It is one way communication when the point of university is two way communication. Class time is literally the most inconsequential part of college. Yes, you go to class, but you're supposed to be using university resources to do your own further study in the off time.
Since they are one way, anything that requires a person to evaluate like a writing course, cannot be taught. Furthermore, anything that may require some additional resources that you can't get by watching a video cannot be taught. Also, it eliminates any form of discussion. A good lecture will involve the professor speaking, but also engaging with the class, videos do not do that.
The only thing that is happening with higher education, is that people want a quicker and easier path to gain knowledge in a world where a 4 year degree is not enough. The absolute bare minimum at this point requires more like 8 years of study for most subjects as bachelors degrees are insufficient.
Not helping matters, is the fact that interns are worthless. Society has decided to merge both education and job training into the same program, a college education. This results in insufficient time for both. But, we've also decided that individuals need to take the risk on obtaining job skills. This means that universities are not giving students the tools they need to perform work, or the tools they need to think critically. This in turn causes interns to be of nearly zero value to a business.
If you think about it, this also makes sense. While the barrier to entry on labor is always going down, the world itself relies more and more on specialization so in order to do any meaningful work more education is required. If you need people with more than just a 4 year degree to fill entry level roles (which usually aren't very profitable to the business in the first place), how is someone with even less than that supposed to be able to contribute?
Internships are no longer about experience, or cheap labor. The only value an intern has to a company is as part of a talent identification process. A company can get some interns and try them out at a smaller loss than they take on normal entry level employees, and hopefully find some people who show potential that can be given return offers. The actual work an intern does, and the value they provide the company is negative.
tl;dr: People who are misinformed are trying to claim that reference material is replacing the need for classrooms. This is quite simply false. If it were true, then books would have ended the entire school system 100 years ago.
originally posted by: Puppylove
When we are younger it is when our minds are most adaptable and capable of learning. It's during our youth that most of the molding into who we will become and our capabilities as an adult are molded.
Instead we are forced to try and learn when our prime learning years are behind us making it all that much harder because we need to unlearn all the bad habits in grained in us from our #ty school system.
Also you mentioned taxes. When the hell in school do you remember being taught taxes or how to do them including itemization and the many forms? That would actually be a useful class in grade school everyone should have. It doesn't happen though because once again our schooling system is wholly inadequate.
originally posted by: Aazadan
a reply to: GrandPog
First job at 34 actually and yes. Finished with bachelors in business, computer science, and simulation engineering plus minors in math and political science. Additionally associates degrees in computer graphics, web development, and what would most closely today be human computer interaction.
37 now. Was hired directly out of university (actually a year before I finished) to be a lead software engineer, now software architect (which had no change in duties just a more descriptive title of my role) at a Fortune 500 company. Intern wage was about 45 per hour in an area where minimum wage can still pay rent. FTE wage is well above that.
Total cost of my education which the government was kind enough to pay was 250k for food tuition and housing. In the past 3 years I’ve paid roughly 113k in federal taxes. In a couple more years I’ll have fully repaid that entire investment and then some. Not a bad investment right?
Unless you think the state should step in and help people make better choices.
Schools teach whatever there is demand for.
...people tend to not like those outcomes.
The demand comes from people that wish to study such things.
Um...that's what I said. I will assume this is agreement.
That said, it’s not like we should have a society where things like Canadian studies aren’t studied. In some amount such a degree is beneficial.
I agree. If you pay for it, it's your call in a free country. To the OP's point, making the tax payer supplement a tsunami of Canadian Studies majors is not sound. And if it does come to pass, I am opening a University for Canadian Puppet Science degrees. I need a means to recoup my fleeced tax dollars.
originally posted by: Zanti Misfit
a reply to: SailorJerry
The School of Hard Knocks is Cheaper , and you Really do Learn a lot More.............