Leaving tommorow for the border, will miss you ATS'ers

a reply to: AugustusMasonicus

Drone interceptors, Kamikaze style would do it and is within civilian means. Good laser pointers as well come to think of it, so you don’t lose your drone. But illegal as all heck and the FAA would black bag rendition you somewhere far worse and more unknown than Gitmo though.

originally posted by: AugustusMasonicus
a reply to: RUokayHun
Because a private citizen cannot effect an arrest that a Federal law enforcement officer is legislated to perform.

I've googled a bit on this and don't see any exceptions for federal crimes, and lots of proof that private citizens indeed can make citizens arrest of anyone they catch in the act of committing a crime... even in that bastion of liberty cesspool of a sanctuary state known as California

a reply to: tanstaafl


You just linked a Canadian website. We're talking about the United States.

dbl

originally posted by: AugustusMasonicus
a reply to: tanstaafl
You just linked a Canadian website. We're talking about the United States.

Hah, right you are, copied the wrong tab link... fixed...

But since it is essentially the same in Cali, and most every state in the union... maybe you can elaborate on why you seem to think otherwise?

originally posted by: tanstaafl
But since it is essentially the same in Cali, and most every state in the union... maybe you can elaborate on why you seem to think otherwise?

Because illegal entry into the United States is not a felony, it's only a misdemeanor and you cannot make a citizen's arrest on a misdemeanor unless it's a breach of the peace. This doesn't qualify.

a reply to: Flyingclaydisk

I think I've been very clear. I'm fine with many militia groups, but not so fine with the handful of people who want to make citizens arrests.

You continue to say you have no issue with militia groups, yet you see no purpose for them other than being "vigilantes". In other words, if I read you right, they have no purpose other than to just sit there and talk smack in their parent's basements about all the stuff they think is wrong with the world, and as long as they do that...they don't bother you. Is that right?

Again with putting words in my mouth. Militia's, legitimate ones, are not vigilantes and you don't see them on the border playing cops and rounding people up with zero authority to do so. They are not getting in the way of the Border Patrol making their jobs harder.

Is it your contention that all militia groups are the same? You seem to be lumping them all together?

Why do you think the Border Patrol asked them to leave? Could it be that these small groups of wana-be's made the situation worse? Of course they made the situation worse. Perhaps it would be best to stop calling these little bands of people militia's instead of what they are, vigilante's.

a reply to: AugustusMasonicus

No they aren't military, but they have stepped up to a different level when they decided to take up arms and force themselves upon us. They are now enemy combatants. Just like pirates out at Sea.

A nation built by immigrants wants to kill immigrants. Ironic

a reply to: sean

Except its not at sea so thats nonsense

originally posted by: sean
No they aren't military, but they have stepped up to a different level when they decided to take up arms and force themselves upon us. They are now enemy combatants. Just like pirates out at Sea.

I must have missed the arms part, any links to them shooting at anyone? You bad analogy is still bad.

a reply to: Blaine91555

... Is it your contention that all militia groups are the same? You seem to be lumping them all together? ...

No! It seems that is your contention! You're okay with militia groups as long as they stay home, go shooting at a range every now and again and play cops and robbers (in their basement)d.

Tell me, honestly, do you see any "legitimate" militia groups??? OR, do you see them as a bunch of posers playing "army" in their yards?? C'mon man, be honest.

You've dismissed these people as idiouts, and people who have a "right", but not one YOU believe in. Right?

Botton line...DID they make the situation "worse"? Who knows....and you certainly don't know, or if you do please tell me.

You "say" they are getting in the way of the border patrol, but have you heard this from the "US Customs and Border Patrol" personnel personally???, or just the MSM claiming to quote someone from such services???

You see...you have been influenced by the MSM~!!!

Do you know for a fact USCBP is able to handle this situation at the border, or are you just going with your gut???

Please do tell.

I've actually been to the border. Regularly. I don't like it, but have you???

originally posted by: Stu112
A nation built by immigrants wants to kill immigrants. Ironic

No, just stop them at the border, because they mostly do not qualify for asylum just because they want a better life, and we already have tent cities full of homeless who need jobs and such. Many of them will take advantage of free services, food stamps, health care, and other goodies paid for by American citizens and/or they will disappear into the cities and work and get paid under the table while sending money home to their respective countries of origin.

a reply to: Blaine91555

So, my apologies. You see, you and I have a fundamental disagreement.

You can call me names all you want, but the bottom line is, patriots have a value. And, fundamentally, you think they don't and they're best kept in their own private worlds. And, so long as they don't bother anyone they are free to do what they wish. I see it differently.

Now, you may not like what happened up in Nevada with Cliven Bundy, and the aftermath which led to the murder of LeVoy Finicum...now, if you can say that was a clean "shoot", well, then you'll be very telling of your posture.

I've posted often here about what an idiot I thought Finicum was, but at least he believed.

So, you can take me to task...but I am a patriot! I believe in the Constitution and the rights granted by it.

There are two ways to look at it...1. the government is out of control...or...2. the government is in complete control.

Either way...are you okay with that?

Oh, By the Way...



It's all the same!

originally posted by: AugustusMasonicus

originally posted by: tanstaafl
But since it is essentially the same in Cali, and most every state in the union... maybe you can elaborate on why you seem to think otherwise?

Because illegal entry into the United States is not a felony, it's only a misdemeanor and you cannot make a citizen's arrest on a misdemeanor unless it's a breach of the peace. This doesn't qualify.

Thanks you for the correction. I guess it depends on what is included in the term breach of the peace.

Personally, I would argue that it actually does qualify, especially in cases of human and drug trafficking, and always when these invaders are armed, but at least unarmed families quietly crossing the border may not be considered a 'breach of the peace' as it is understood in the common law.

So, here is one more thing that needs to be fixed.

Congress needs to amend the Immigration and Nationality Act of 1965 to make this a felony.

And while they are at it, make it a felony for any local, state or federal agency to pay any benefits whatsoever to any alien who is here illegally (take away the motivation for many/most).

originally posted by: tanstaafl

Thanks you for the correction. I guess it depends on what is included in the term breach of the peace.

Personally, I would argue that it does qusalify, but it is debatable.

Breach of the peace statutes are very well defined, this doesn't qualify.

originally posted by: AugustusMasonicus
Breach of the peace statutes are very well defined, this doesn't qualify.

See my edited post...

a reply to: tanstaafl

First time illegal entry is a misdemeanor, subsequent times afterward is a felony I think. But things can be added such as trespassing with criminal intent if crossing a rancher’s land which may or may not be a felony by local laws.

A simple asking of how they planned get around I9 preemployent checks can reveal intent of fraud (making up a SS number) or felony theft (identity theft) or working under the table (tax fraud, which can be a felony).

All depends on how or who is interviewing a detainee.

a reply to: Flyingclaydisk

I did not call you names?

I believe in the rule of law. Why do you believe it's not best handled by the Border Patrol?

I've also not derided Patriots. Part of being a Patriot is believing in the rule of law is it not?

Cliven Bundy? Apples to Oranges? People were not trying to make citizens arrests there or interfere with the Border Patrol, it's not relevant to this discussion.

Am I to take from this you believe the Border Patrol is either incompetent or in on some kind of conspiracy? I think they do a great job and don't need interference making their jobs harder.