Ton 618. A mind bender

ever since the pictures came out showing the black hole i have been thinking about this constantly.

this meaning space. the universe. how much of it there is and how little of it we understand

things like Ton 618 just mess my mind up

en.wikipedia.org...

TON 618 is a very distant and extremely luminous quasar—technically, a hyperluminous, broad-absorption line, radio-loud quasar—located near the North Galactic Pole in the constellation Canes Venatici. It likely contains one of the most massive known black holes, perhaps weighing in at 66 billion times the mass of the Sun

sixty six billion times bigger than the sun..

christ man

i was freaking out about M87 at 6.6 billion times bigger

you can fit 1 million earths inside the sun and this damn thing is 66 billion times bigger.

M87 is 200 trillion miles away

it is a total mind F

it really bothers me that i dont have the answers

it really bothers me that it is so vast

makes me wonder what is the point.

what is the point of us?

what is the point of there being so much space out there?

is there a point?

will we ever get to the point to where we can bend space and travel to or even through one of these black holes?

where does it go?

another dimension?
beginning of time?

entry to heaven?


just thinking out loud.

this is the kind of # that goes through my head at night when the monsters come

Sounds made up. Much like 95% of everything in space.

Nearly everything out there is just theory. How can you possibly see something so far away with any sort of accuracy?

NASA has been caught lying about tons of sh*t in space.

Sure it's cool to think about how much space there "could" be, but these concepts of how large certain objects are and what they do is becoming pure absurdity and its all complete sci-fi nonsense to keep you distracted off in neverland, rather than trying to understand the real truth of what is right in front of you.

I used to LOVE space and everything about it. Then I began to search for the truths of this world we live in - Now it's no longer a mystery to me.

The recent picture that is supposedly the first image of a "black hole" makes me laugh. Everyone that covers the subject always state "scientists have discovered.." - "Scientists have finally..." etc.. All one generic term used from the vague science-tism priesthood. They never site who specifically did it, worked on it, which organization etc..

Plus its just some blob image.. They could render that out of anything and just declare that its a black hole and throw in "scientists did this".

Everyone believes it.

Why?

Years of indoctrination.

originally posted by: CeeWhizzle
Sounds made up. Much like 95% of everything in space.

Nearly everything out there is just theory. How can you possibly see something so far away with any sort of accuracy?

could be made up.
for sure

or not

i dont know how to see something so far away

i am stupid. thats why it bends my mond

a reply to: CeeWhizzle

The mass of a celestial object, such as TON 618, can be calculated given the speed of things orbiting it and the distance at which they orbit. This is true for the planets orbiting the sun. This is true for the Moon orbiting Earth and other moons orbiting other planets. It's true for man-made satellites put in orbit around Earth.

There is gas orbiting TON 618 at a specific distance and moving at a specific speed (known from spectral analysis of the gas). If we are to consider this information as correct, the mass of TON 618 can be calculated. That is, unless you have some other explanation for the speed of the orbiting gas or some reason to think the information is not correct.

It's certainly possible the velocity and orbital distance of the gas is not correct, but as far as we know it is correct, and to say it's wrong would require more than just saying "I think it's wrong".

a reply to: TinySickTears

It's not 66 billion times the size of the sun, that's the mass.

originally posted by: Vector99
a reply to: TinySickTears

It's not 66 billion times the size of the sun, that's the mass.

ok

but still pretty big

M87 is 6.6 billion times the mass

Ton is 66 billion times the mass


so my point was friggin big

a reply to: CeeWhizzle

How can you possibly see something so far away with any sort of accuracy?

Telescopes.

NASA has been caught lying about tons of sh*t in space.

They have also provided a lot of information.

but these concepts of how large certain objects are and what they do is becoming pure absurdity and its all complete sci-fi nonsense to keep you distracted off in neverland

Nope, its called science...we have books.

The recent picture that is supposedly the first image of a "black hole" makes me laugh.

I am sure you can provide a better pic?

Everyone that covers the subject always state "scientists have discovered.." - "Scientists have finally..." etc

Thats what scientists do, I'd like to hear about your genius finds or breakthroughs?

Everyone believes it.
Why?

Books, science, astronomers, telescopes, cameras etc etc.

Then I began to search for the truths of this world we live in - Now it's no longer a mystery to me

Of course not!!

a reply to: TinySickTears


Space is a very cool thing...the mind bender for me is that we know more about space than we do our own oceans.
Theres something to think about next time you go swimming in the ocean.

a reply to: DrumsRfun

That's fine


I think you already made it clear with your response to OP.

The fact that we know more about space than our own oceans pretty much throws the whole thought out there that space could indeed be pure BS as far as we have been told.

I think it's something entirely different than what NASA and said proclaimed "scientists" say it is.

a reply to: TinySickTears

It is mind blowing, no doubt.

Like anything, it's your choice how you embrace it. It's easy to feel insignificant and that there's no meaning. However, it's just as easy to feel incredibly lucky you get to be a part of such a vast cosmos.

The same stuff in those unimaginably large things so far away is the same stuff in me. I belong.

a reply to: ABNARTY

i just need to take another trip to the other dimensions.


it changed my life for sure

i need to revisit that

a reply to: TinySickTears

I've been thinking that the supermassive black holes don't go anywhere.

Where do the smaller black holes go? They're basically the same thing, doing the same thing, sucking up and disappearing matter, even light. Maybe it "rips" a hole through fabric as it gains in strength due to the forces blah blah etc.

It probably condenses the matter into the the form that will be the heaviest in the smallest amount of physical space possible swirling around past where you can see.

I saw an image recently of a "side angle" of one of these, the matter or energy or summin being different colors like the severity of weather on a radar presentation. There seemed to be a lot of # spinning around the middle area before and after the center or event horizon.

originally posted by: Vector99
a reply to: TinySickTears

It's not 66 billion times the size of the sun, that's the mass.

A singularity has no spatial size. It is a singularity.

originally posted by: TinySickTears
a reply to: ABNARTY

i just need to take another trip to the other dimensions.


it changed my life for sure

i need to revisit that

You have to be careful about moves and rotations in other dimensions.

You could do a left turn in the 23rd dimension and wind up inside out.

a reply to: TinySickTears

Not necessarily, a ton of bricks and a ton of feathers have the same mass, but the ton of feathers will be much larger in size

originally posted by: chr0naut

originally posted by: TinySickTears
a reply to: ABNARTY

i just need to take another trip to the other dimensions.


it changed my life for sure

i need to revisit that

You have to be careful about moves and rotations in other dimensions.

You could do a left turn in the 23rd dimension and wind up inside out.

i hear ya

i dont go very often

its been a while and i am due

a reply to: chr0naut
I know, I was simply informing the op that mass doesn't equal size

a reply to: Vector99

its how my stupid brain reconciles it though

when we get into the 66 billion x's whatever its just how i process

in the end its big as #

unfathomable really

a reply to: DrumsRfun

you took the bait.

so like what is mass

and how does gravity make it out of matter

the hole sucks things into it right, any planets, stars, debris within the gravity pull of it

then, it has to convert that into mass and stick it into its mass storage blob area of see through nothingness spinning around the eye of the hole

originally posted by: chr0naut

originally posted by: Vector99
a reply to: TinySickTears

It's not 66 billion times the size of the sun, that's the mass.

A singularity has no spatial size. It is a singularity.

There is no real consensus whether or not a black hole is a real physical singularity, or if even singularities actually exist.

Right now the math says a black hole is infinitely dense, and infinite density — by the math — means a size/volume of zero.

However, when physicists or mathematicians see “infinity” pop up in the math of physics, that raises red flags that their theories and their math are not adequate enough to give a real explanation. Infinity in math is usually a sign that something is wrong with the math being used.