Mysterious infection spanning the Globe

originally posted by: roadgravel

originally posted by: Wide-Eyes
a reply to: 727Sky

There are different theories as to what happened with C. auris. Dr. Meis, the Dutch researcher, said he believed that drug-resistant fungi were developing thanks to heavy use of fungicides on crops.

Gee, thanks Monsanto...

Just as after a shooting, blaming the maker of the bullets instead of the person shooting the gun.

I've read your argument and I'm honestly struggling to figure out what your exact point is.

Are you playing Devil's advocate for the fun of it or do you genuinely believe Monsanto are a benevolent Corporation?

Or are you calling customers of Monsanto et al murderers?

The farmers that use their products were mislead and manipulated.

originally posted by: Wide-Eyes
a reply to: DustybudzZ

I don't know maybe I'm the stupid one but to me that doesn't sound so stupid lol

 

For real.

It's very easy for the human ego to ignore the intelligence of "lower lifeforms".

Apparently the "lower lifeforms" have an ego too

People are just an inconvenient host that will be ignored 

Lol seems they are not so different from us

a reply to: DustybudzZ

They're exactly like us.

Disturbingly so.

Hell yeah...

Man! I can't wait until I evolve into a beautiful butterfly!!!

lmfao

But for real though why can't humans evolve as fast as lower lifeforms is what I want to know we grow up then kinda go backwards then die???

Is it because we are being genetically altered to not be able to reach our "full potential" or "final stages"??? Because of different people, places and things. like monsantos, "chemtrails", aspartame, fluoride (etc). Too many
DNA altering/brainwashing. Chemicals & experiments &(whatever else) to list

There is a reason why there is two different kind of realities in this world...

There is the "official story" world that everyone who is brainwashed think's is real.

Then there is the real world. Where anyone who has some common sense and actually observed the world around them and is awaken knows the real world works very differently so

all I'm saying is

LOL

originally posted by: Oldtimer2
a reply to: 727Sky

I've never been one to reference the bible,but look how things are panning out,there is a rogue star system in our system,with it is debris,which plays out as the 7 plagues,when the bible was written this was 1st hand knowledge,the earth gets destroyed in ,sucks because we are in that stage now cycle

too bad the bible is a fairytale story =(

double

a reply to: 727Sky

THanks for the nightmare fuel with my 7 month old.


Disease has always been one of my biggest fears since it is so hard to actually prepare for it.

a reply to: 727Sky

Nature is always going to try and put us in check.

Will it be a version of Ophiocordyceps the gets us?

Or something else.

This probably should scare me but just doesn't.

originally posted by: Wide-Eyes

originally posted by: roadgravel

originally posted by: Wide-Eyes
a reply to: 727Sky

There are different theories as to what happened with C. auris. Dr. Meis, the Dutch researcher, said he believed that drug-resistant fungi were developing thanks to heavy use of fungicides on crops.

Gee, thanks Monsanto...

Just as after a shooting, blaming the maker of the bullets instead of the person shooting the gun.

I've read your argument and I'm honestly struggling to figure out what your exact point is.

Are you playing Devil's advocate for the fun of it or do you genuinely believe Monsanto are a benevolent Corporation?

Or are you calling customers of Monsanto et al murderers?

The farmers that use their products were mislead and manipulated.

The point being when it's AG, many point blame at Monsanto first, often as a catch all for problems, just as in a shooting many people blame the gun. They should than blame the car in a wreck.

Is a single entity deserving of all the blame if it is part of the issue?

I shouldn't have even mentioned it as it is too difficult an idea for people to get past their bias.

a reply to: 727Sky

"Last spring, Jasmine Cutler, 29, went to visit her 72-year-old father at a hospital in New York City, where he had been admitted because of complications from a surgery the previous month.

When she arrived at his room, she discovered that he had been sitting for at least an hour in a recliner, in his own feces, because no one had come when he had called for help to use the bathroom. Ms. Cutler said it became clear to her that the staff was afraid to touch him because a test had shown that he was carrying C. auris.

“I saw doctors and nurses looking in the window of his room,” she said. “My father’s not a guinea pig. You’re not going to treat him like a freak at a show.”

He was eventually discharged and told he no longer carried the fungus. But he declined to be named, saying he feared being associated with the frightening infection."

They got rid of him because one he was most likely a patient that is on medicare. Two he was black or some minority and three they didn't have anybody that wanted to see to his body or functions of his body. She never said what they said about him sitting in his own feces, they just kicked him out. If this is just a taste of how unprepared we are to these possible new strains and deadly outbreaks. We are going to see a pandemic that will take out the hospitals and a lot of us.

originally posted by: DigginFoTroof
I'd be willing to bet this is a GMO. I suspect it might be from some cellulose -> ethanol/methanol research or possibly cellulose -> acid (vinegar/acetic acid - making a high tolerance yeast that lives at higher concentrations) as IIRC, this is from the same family that does this type of conversion. I know there was a lot of research into this field and they were trying to modify natural bacteria and yeasts to produce higher concentrations and even convert things other than sugars (regular cellulose like corn husks/stalks, straw, etc) into useable chemicals.

I don't believe this yeast/bacteria was never discovered or seen before until 2009, and it has show up b/c it was created in a lab.

It’s first appearance as far as we know was actually 1996 in Korea. The CDC has done a lot of work going through their isolate banks to see if there were any other pre-2009 cases, but there are only 2 that we know of.

No, this thing isn’t a GMO, and it is not a consequence of biofuel research.

originally posted by: CthulhuMythos
So how does a whole room become contaminated from one patient? Places in the room he couldn't have touched or been near. So either this is shed from his skin and wafted about as the bed covers were changed etc landing on surfaces all over the room, or it came from his breath and wafted round the room, both of there scenarios would allow this to spread to other rooms and patients via air flow or being carried by staff as it transferred to them during his care. OR it was already coating the room, and every other room, because it is in our general atmosphere, just the other rooms were not tested and he along with just about everyone on the planet has this but his immune system was not strong enough to keep it under control making it appear he was the one contaminating everything.

It is a skin commensal, so it can come from skin or from contaminated items and spread to hospital surfaces.

originally posted by: rickymouse
Well, doing a little research on how the medicines that do kill this work, I found myself doing more research to verify a few things I knew to see if they would be relevant in getting rid of these pests. Of course, if you have a serious infection with a troubled immune system, you will need to see a doctor..

A few types of cysteine proteases can destroy their covering, basically bromelain and trypsin were mentioned, but I would think papaya also will help. So, you can buy bromelain pills, We keep the 500 mgs in stock for when I get a sinus clog or thick mucus, to take to treat these infections. But pineapple does work well too. I do not like papaya much and I researched papain but believe that bromelain is better tolerated in more people.

The daughter has some Betaine Hydrochloride tablets with papain, trypsin, and bromelain in with it. She used them to get rid of digestive issues years ago but still takes one occasionally if she has meals high in meat as a digestive aid.

I think that candida is troublesome for lots of people. I did take the Betaine Hydrochloride pills for a while, they seemed to help get rid of some brain fog, but I am now out of them, they seem to swell up after opening, not good to take one that is leaking. If I get more, I think I will just get the small bottle instead of those two hundred fifty pill bottles. I used to take one sometimes if I ate too much proteine.

I actually tried a lot of different supplements to try to see if I could detect any change in anything.

The bromelain is a keeper, it is also good to get rid of a milk or ice cream headache. But it is a blood anti-agglutinating medicine, it keeps platelets from being sticky, so beware if you are taking blood thinners. I actually think it is a good blood thinner myself, almost as good as the taurine pill is.

The meds used to treat this are created from some echinocandins from GMO microorganisms. Monsanto and another research institute decided they needed to get something they could patent so they created their own strain to make more money. You cannot patent a natural product. Selling their product as unique can make others believe it is superior.

Microbes that create similar chemistry are found in nature and some are utilized in fermented products. That is about as far as I got, I get headaches from fermented products, I cannot break down some of their chemistry so I am satisfied with just the bromelain. I do like Brie cheese, it is a good antibiotic for some things. I do not know if it works for this though.

This information is meant to help those with tummy troubles, not as medical information for those with a serious candida infection. It can help to keep candida from taking hold though. If you get a bad infection, go to the doctor, I have a doctor and go to him even though I probably know more about this kind of crap than he does. He knows more about applying medicines for medical conditions, I know more about trying to change things so you hopefully do not need to take medicines. Some people need medicines no matter what though, but not nearly as many as take medicines these days.

Echinocandins are the mainline drug for auris, as there are not as many strains present that are resistant to it. However, resistance may be acquired. The CDC has found one case where a patient (I think in the US) who developed drug resistance during treatment. This particular Candida is really only a concern for people susceptible to invasive infections. That is, people who are in hospital already for serious illnesses that result in compromised immune systems.

There have been some papers published recently that have disclosed some new drugs that work well against auris. I myself am involved in one such project, although we haven’t published yet. I can find you links for these if you’re interested.

Your comment on natural products is not quite right. It is not that common that a natural product makes a good drug as-is. A lot of the time, if these compounds show activity, they are systematically modified to investigate the tolerance of different chemistries on the molecule. Regardless, you can still patent a natural product for use in drugs.

a reply to: hypervalentiodine

The theols and proteinases can control microbes pretty efficiently. And some classes of foods increase histamine levels which can help fight diseases. Consuming too much of those histamine increasing foods can cause problems too though. Plant defense system chemicals are sometimes just as strong as medicines are. Not just herbs either. Some natural plant chemicals alter enzymes just as effectively as the meds designed off of them with less side effects but some can actually have side effects that are too great because of companion chemistry in the plant that someone is intollerant to.

I actually use databases to figure out the effectiveness of some of the chemicals in food, but also check if the chemicals are bound to the food which restricts their ability to work as a medicine too. You are trained to find medicines, but they do not actually teach that some of this chemistry is readily available in amounts that can treat diseases in foods and recipes. You can get a decent dose of penicillin from a wedge of Brie cheese. But to be classified as medicine, the penicillin needs to all be made by a specific family that has been tested even though the same type is used in Brie.

I spend a lot of time researching Pharmaceuticals and looking for the stuff in nature. The oyster mushroom has levostatin in it, and you do not need much to get the equivalent of the dose in medicine. I can go on and on with hundreds of different common foods and how potent they are, in fact some are so potent that they can cause people harm if consumed other than occasionally.

A small amount of bromelain taken without food systematically can be highly effective in taking slime off that protects cancer cells. It can break down the coating on bacteria so our immune system can attack it better. When I started this research I could not believe the chemistry of some foods can cure diseases or sometimes that food chemistry can lead to a disease forming. Many foods and spices and herbs adjust enzymes in the body, some knock out enzymes just like some meds do. I used to be impressed with pharmacuticals, but since I started to identify how to do it naturally I am thinking they are just profiting off of people's lack of knowledge of food chemistry.

I have temporal lobe epilepsy and I was intolerant to all the five classes they gave me. Badly intolerant, the neurologist said she did not want to kill me, I was too nice a guy. I had to learn how to control it on my own. Two thousand five hundred dollars worth of medicine a month was initially replaced by one pound of asparagus, eating a little every day. That gets sickening, so I developed soups and identified other ways to control it without effecting my memory and cognigance. I do not want to ever have antifolate or anticholorigenic drugs again. They suck. It costs me about twenty bucks a month to replace all those antiepileptic, the thing is the insurance company paid for the meds, but not my food. I alternate all the chemistries in my diet that the meds were based off of to treat my epilepsy,,Except I will not use any sodium receptor blocker chemistry. If I did not have a genetic intolerance to everyone of those medicines, basically a low body temperature identifies that, I would not have had all the problems I had, it also gives me the ability to do small changes to control the seizures, I can get just as much antiepileptic properties off of one stalk of asparagus as some people get from a pill. But still those people just need to eat three stocks a day. Asparagus does tend to give you a dopy feeling, and it does lessen your ability to want to learn, so I go mostly with cabbage in soup these days to control my problem. By alternating the chemistries I do not get any side effects. The knowledge of these food chemistries that calms goes back thousands of years. Another calming chemistry is the cartilage of beef soup bones when I make soup, it has some really good antiepileptic properties. I suppose I could just eat short rib cartilage, but the medicines caused my teeth to push up and I had to have them all pulled out....they were in good shape before the meds.

originally posted by: Wide-Eyes

Gee, thanks Monsanto...

You're welcome!

originally posted by: rickymouse
a reply to: hypervalentiodine


I actually use databases to figure out the effectiveness of some of the chemicals in food, but also check if the chemicals are bound to the food which restricts their ability to work as a medicine too. You are trained to find medicines, but they do not actually teach that some of this chemistry is readily available in amounts that can treat diseases in foods and recipes. You can get a decent dose of penicillin from a wedge of Brie cheese. But to be classified as medicine, the penicillin needs to all be made by a specific family that has been tested even though the same type is used in Brie.

In fact, as any medicinal chemist would readily tell you, I am perfectly aware of the fact that living organisms may contain compounds with medicinal properties. Indeed, there are entire branches of chemistry dedicated to figuring out what those compounds are and what they can do. The thing is that it is not as simple as just eating a piece of brie, certainly not in this instance (not that penicillin would work anyway).

originally posted by: rickymouse
a reply to: hypervalentiodine
I spend a lot of time researching Pharmaceuticals and looking for the stuff in nature. The oyster mushroom has levostatin in it, and you do not need much to get the equivalent of the dose in medicine. I can go on and on with hundreds of different common foods and how potent they are, in fact some are so potent that they can cause people harm if consumed other than occasionally.

So can I. What's your point?

originally posted by: rickymouse
a reply to: hypervalentiodine
A small amount of bromelain taken without food systematically can be highly effective in taking slime off that protects cancer cells. It can break down the coating on bacteria so our immune system can attack it better. When I started this research I could not believe the chemistry of some foods can cure diseases or sometimes that food chemistry can lead to a disease forming. Many foods and spices and herbs adjust enzymes in the body, some knock out enzymes just like some meds do. I used to be impressed with pharmacuticals, but since I started to identify how to do it naturally I am thinking they are just profiting off of people's lack of knowledge of food chemistry.

Bacteria =/= fungi. They are entirely separate kingdoms, and you cannot compare one thing that *may* work against bacteria and infer that it would have similar activity against fungi.

Let me explain to you why your bit on food chemistry doesn't apply to this instance.

To begin, it is important to note that we are not talking about superficial infections, we are talking about invasive ones. That is, infections that target internal organs. Because we have gotten better at keeping people with serious illness alive, the number people most at risk of these infections has increased significantly. Most people who wind up with invasive infection are people who are in hospital already, and who have compromised immune systems. Moreover, treating these infections is a lengthy process and typically requires extended hospitalisation. C. auris also likes to form biofilms, which makes targeting infection inherently difficult.

All of which is to say, you cannot cure these people with pineapple extract. I am not going to go into the specifics of bromelain, but I will say that the science truly is not there for something like this. Enzymes are notoriously difficult to make into drugs because our body happens to be very good at breaking them down. The types of infections we are talking about here can not be treated by topical ointments; they have to get inside the body through IV or by oral administration. I am very happy that you have found a solution for yourself that alleviates your medical issues, but your methods don't apply here. You can't treat invasive infection with food in the manner you are describing.

a reply to: hypervalentiodine

So, I messed up and said bacteria instead of microbes in my post.

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov...

I am not sure if lauric acid would work on C. Auris, it helps to control most candida infections but it causes permeatation of the cell lining so the immune system can attack the cell of a microbe, it does not destroy the cell by itself. Coconut oil would help protect from infection to a small point. These microbes are tricky, they shield the immune system from finding them.

I doubt if bromelain would help a serious infection, but it can help to prevent them.

It is nice discussing stuff with someone actually in the field of what I have spent ten years studying. I like actual evidence, I may supply a summary by listing someone else's information after checking if it is real or pertinent. Most people cannot understand what the research articles say and do not understand how to utilize the information within the parameters of the research.

And Yes, I have found legitimate evidence that verifies that Brie cheese does contain an active penicillin. Penicillin does not kill every infection though, it is only good on some types of infections. Many people who are allergic to penicillin cannot eat that cheese.

Instead of disputing each other, why can't we work together to discuss things, I do not know everything but know a hell of a lot about some things. It takes a lot of research to hack a pharmaceutical and find equivalent chemistry, especially when the adjuvant is not listed as an active ingredient, often inert ingredients are active. I did lose my best database where I could combine chemicals to see what they form.

I am not against Pharmacology, I just went to a doctor a month or so ago and got an antibiotic for an infection on my back, I had to reduce histamine consumption and reduce histamase inhibiting foods so my body would let it heal. The Antibiotic was not working by itself, my immune system kept attacking the scar tissue.

originally posted by: rickymouse
a reply to: hypervalentiodine

So, I messed up and said bacteria instead of microbes in my post.

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov...

I am not sure if lauric acid would work on C. Auris, it helps to control most candida infections but it causes permeatation of the cell lining so the immune system can attack the cell of a microbe, it does not destroy the cell by itself. Coconut oil would help protect from infection to a small point. These microbes are tricky, they shield the immune system from finding them.

I doubt if bromelain would help a serious infection, but it can help to prevent them.

It is nice discussing stuff with someone actually in the field of what I have spent ten years studying. I like actual evidence, I may supply a summary by listing someone else's information after checking if it is real or pertinent. Most people cannot understand what the research articles say and do not understand how to utilize the information within the parameters of the research.

And Yes, I have found legitimate evidence that verifies that Brie cheese does contain an active penicillin. Penicillin does not kill every infection though, it is only good on some types of infections. Many people who are allergic to penicillin cannot eat that cheese.

Instead of disputing each other, why can't we work together to discuss things, I do not know everything but know a hell of a lot about some things. It takes a lot of research to hack a pharmaceutical and find equivalent chemistry, especially when the adjuvant is not listed as an active ingredient, often inert ingredients are active. I did lose my best database where I could combine chemicals to see what they form.

I am not against Pharmacology, I just went to a doctor a month or so ago and got an antibiotic for an infection on my back, I had to reduce histamine consumption and reduce histamase inhibiting foods so my body would let it heal. The Antibiotic was not working by itself, my immune system kept attacking the scar tissue.

Sure, some fungi can be described as a microbe, but the point I was making with bacteria =/= fungi was really that the two are so different that you cannot possibly extrapolate potency of a drug against bacteria to the same in fungi. One of the most prohibitive factors in developing novel therapeutics against fungal infections is that they share a remarkably high level of genomic similarity to their mammalian hosts. The same is not true for other microbes. As a result, there are very few molecular features that are found in fungi that are not also found in humans, diminishing the number of viable drug targets and making the issue of target selectivity and toxicity a profound one.

As far as I have seen, bromelain wouldn't be very effective for treating anything inside the body. I believe it is approved for use as a topical treatment for some things (I haven't looked into it much), but this is very different to getting an active drug to work inside a living organism. As I said, enzymes are broken down very quickly in vivo. Invasive infections are such that in order to treat them to need to get an active drug into the bloodstream, as well as into organs. I believe bromelain is able to do this to some extent, but I still very much doubt its ability to act in vivo, even were it found to be potent against isolated cultures of auris (note also that auris and albicans are genetically similar, but do have a lot of differences). The best way to prevent these sorts of infections is to practice good and consistent personal hygiene, use proven methods for sterilisation and appropriate measures for isolating infected people from those at risk.

One of the hardest things with this particular fungus is that it is very difficult to remove from surfaces once it has colonised. I think it mentions it in the article, but you can still get viable cultures from hospital surfaces 2 weeks after the first instance of colonisation, with or without moisture. That is quite incredible for something like this, and very terrifying. It also persists on skin with the same level of stubbornness. Thankfully it is a yeast and doesn't produce spores, which makes it easy enough to work with in a lab and means you don't have to worry about it moving around on the wind.

Anyway, happy to answer questions and discuss things. I don't really post on ATS at all, this thread just happened to pique my interest as I spent a large portion of my PhD working with auris and devising ways to kill it.

a reply to: hypervalentiodine
While I agree with/trust the gist of what you're saying, couldn't it also be true that, seeing as those with compromised immune systems are most susceptible to the fungal infections, that taking natural remedies which are proven to strengthen the immune system could effectively (indirectly) treat the fungal infection by allowing the body's own immune system to fight it off? This of course assumes the natural "remedies" are able to strengthen the immune system quicker than the infection is able to further diminish it... I'm no expert on natural remedies or fungal infections, just curious about whether more effort should be put into treatments that aim to strengthen the immune system as opposed to the creation of new specialized/targeted drugs.