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AR-15 & me (gun oil + cartridges)

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posted on Apr, 5 2019 @ 11:46 AM
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Hey folks, I have been doing research lately to see whether or not excessive use of gun lubricants can cause FTF. And/or whether or not specific lubricants (such as WD-40) harms cartridges more or less than purpose based lubes like Hoppes #9, Hoppes elite, frog lube, rem oil and others just to name a few.

Reports are conflicting, but so far anecdotal evidence suggests a penetrating lubricant like WD-40 may cause FTF when it gets into the primer

I am wondering if anyone has experience with that? My AR-15 and carry Glock 23 both see their fair share of lubricant (especially the AR, I run it wet) and I frequently rotate out carry ammo and magazines. With the weather clearing up, I am planning a trip to the range and will report back how various types of cartridges performed after moderate to heavy levels of lubricant running on them

The cartridges themselves are:

IMI M193 5.56x45mm 55gr
Win. Ballistic Silver Tip .223 Rem 55gr
Hornady Critical Duty .40 180gr
Hornady Critical Defense .40 165gr
Winchester PDX1 .40 180gr

Although it shouldn't matter, the 5.56/.223 is loaded into standard 30 round magazines and one shorty 20 round magazine (for loaded storage in the quick access safe) and the .40 is in standard 15 round G22 mags along with two 13 round G23 mags

Any experience with the dreaded gun lube FTF? Or is this largely a myth perpetuated out of an overabundance of caution? In any case, I rotate magazines frequently and put the "used" ones into a pile designated for practice. This lets me check things like this out, and have a chance to practice with ridiculously expensive carry ammo in addition to bulk WWB




posted on Apr, 5 2019 @ 12:56 PM
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a reply to: JBurns


Any experience with the dreaded gun lube FTF? Or is this largely a myth perpetuated out of an overabundance of caution?

I think the primers themselves have changed in construction.

If you look at the bottom of the primer, you'll see what looks like a plastic coating or barrier over the flash hole. Old time primers perhaps did not have that barrier, so oil on the outside flowed into the primer pocket and primer flash hole and killed the primer.

In one of my old reloading books an author suggested that if live primers are punched out for reasons like, case crack spotted after priming, the primer should be dropped into a container of oil. I took a primer out of the oil once to test it, primed an empty brass, chambered and fired. The primer was not dead after a week in the can. I suspect the plastic barrier was still intact.

It is still best practice to keep oil away from primers though.



posted on Apr, 5 2019 @ 01:16 PM
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a reply to: JBurns

I've used wd 40 to clean pistols for decades. It will have no effect on the rounds. If a primer is properly seated wd 40 cannot get into the primer. I will continue to use wd40 as it is just so much easier.



posted on Apr, 5 2019 @ 01:22 PM
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a reply to: JBurns

I’ve never heard of any problems, but wd-40 is also a penetrating solvent. It may break down and penetrate the primer seal if you let a round soak in it. It’s not really a lubricant as much as it is a sealant and it can build up layers if not properly cleaned up. If you do use it, you should always clean it off thoroughly. Never leave it wet. So that means don’t just spray it in your trigger mechanism and leave it.

If you like to run wet, try frog lube.


edit on 5-4-2019 by Woodcarver because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 5 2019 @ 01:40 PM
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Well, first off WD-40 is not really a lubricant, it's a water dispersal agent, hence the "WD".

IMHO, WD-40 has no place on a firearm, unless said firearm has gotten wet and there are unreachable areas (impractical w/o disassembly or impossible) which require getting the water out of. WD-40 will also gum up after a while. People get a false sense of security from WD-40 thinking it's a lubricant, and it's not. When it dries, it's gone...evaporated.

Hoppe's #9 was great stuff until they neutered it a decade ago or so. I still use it for cleaning, but not for action lubrication. Rem oil is okay in a pinch because it's easy to get. I generally use dry lubes on my pistols and semi auto rifles. This way the dust won't adhere to the oil and jam up the action. It also reduces wear on dusty conditions.

As for cartridges...why are you getting lubricant on your cartridges at all? In a well cleaned and lubricated firearm there should be no residual oil to get on the cartridges, and there's certainly no need to lubricate cartridges (other than for sizing during reloading).

As far as wet lubricants go, Ballistol, CLP and Hoppe's #9 (lube) are good



posted on Apr, 5 2019 @ 02:07 PM
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a reply to: JBurns

Did you build this AR? Or did you buy one from a manufacturer?



posted on Apr, 5 2019 @ 05:23 PM
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I don’t run hardly any oil on my ARs just good quality marine grease on the rails for the most part, tbh if you AR can’t run dry something is wrong with the build.



posted on Apr, 5 2019 @ 05:40 PM
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originally posted by: Flyingclaydisk
Well, first off WD-40 is not really a lubricant, it's a water dispersal agent, hence the "WD".

IMHO, WD-40 has no place on a firearm, unless said firearm has gotten wet and there are unreachable areas (impractical w/o disassembly or impossible) which require getting the water out of. WD-40 will also gum up after a while. People get a false sense of security from WD-40 thinking it's a lubricant, and it's not. When it dries, it's gone...evaporated.

Hoppe's #9 was great stuff until they neutered it a decade ago or so. I still use it for cleaning, but not for action lubrication. Rem oil is okay in a pinch because it's easy to get. I generally use dry lubes on my pistols and semi auto rifles. This way the dust won't adhere to the oil and jam up the action. It also reduces wear on dusty conditions.

As for cartridges...why are you getting lubricant on your cartridges at all? In a well cleaned and lubricated firearm there should be no residual oil to get on the cartridges, and there's certainly no need to lubricate cartridges (other than for sizing during reloading).

As far as wet lubricants go, Ballistol, CLP and Hoppe's #9 (lube) are good


100% spot on !!

I used LPS for everything as did just about everyone who knew anything about guns... Easy to use, works great, and stops wear on highly used guns. WD-40 to wipe the outside of a gun down when you have been in the rain or water.. That is what the WD stands for..Water Dispersent. Although I stopped even doing the WD trick because LPS worked great..No rust, no fuss...

There used to be a YT video where a guy sprayed different lubs onto metal sheets he had submerged in salt water...no wipe down just drip dry and spray. Some of the stuff people claim to be great was worthless for preventing corrosion/rust..
edit on 727thk19 by 727Sky because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 6 2019 @ 01:54 AM
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Use two drops of sunflower oil instead...



posted on Apr, 6 2019 @ 05:55 AM
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a reply to: 727Sky

I forgot to mention Breakfree CLP.. A friend of mine used to rent guns at his shooting range.. Larry never cleaned his rental guns.!!!!. If they started having FTF problems he would grudgingly pull out a spray can of Breakfree CLP and give the gun some spray in important places.. This system for him worked on everything from full autos down to the .22 plinkers.. I used it too on many occasions with no problems. It is cheap and works great.



posted on Apr, 6 2019 @ 11:07 AM
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a reply to: JBurns

It stands to reason that a penetrating oil will find its way into the powder via the cartridge crimp.
edit on 6 4 19 by projectvxn because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 6 2019 @ 11:36 AM
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a reply to: 727Sky

Did you know you can make your own break free at home for way cheaper?

It's just ATF and Acetone in a 50-50 mixture. Just don't mix a lot at one time because the acetone evaporates when exposed to air (but not in a sealed container). You also have to shake it before use because ATF and acetone separate.



posted on Apr, 6 2019 @ 01:34 PM
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I've had a FTF with a Tula 7.62x39 round in one of my AK's. The primer went off but the main charge didn't...causing a squib load. The unburnt powder was clumpy looking.

I also had a squib load in my SA 22lr revolver using a Remington Thunderbolt round.

My biggest FTF occurred while I was taking a broadside bead on a 7 point whitetail buck 10 yards away, with a 30-06 bolt rifle using commercial ammunition. The buck was mortally wounded by another hunter --- but I didn't know it at the time. That's when I heard the 'loudest sound in the woods' (click) when I tripped the sear. The buck crossed the creek and fell dead directly beneath the stone boulder I was laying on. But the hunter that shot him saw a doe (illegal to shoot at the time) across the creek (thinking it was the wounded buck) an shot her dead and left her lay.


My only explanation for the FTF...was that I left excess oil inside the bolt and it penetrated the primer pocket.

Most military ammo have sealed primers.

edit on 6-4-2019 by Erno86 because: spelling



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