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Unfinished Pyramids May be Evidence for Ancient Hydraulic Engineering Project

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posted on Mar, 31 2019 @ 10:39 AM
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I'm sure most of you have already heard or read about the so-called unfinished pyramids at Zawyet El Aryan and Abu Rawash in Egypt. But perhaps you'll be just as surprised as I was when considering that these structures were perhaps not even meant to be pyramids in the first place, but rather part of a huge ancient engineering project, possibly related to water management or some other fluid-involving process. There are some intruiguing hints that this may indeed have been the case, as the video below nicely demonstrates:

Interestingly, both sites share very similar layouts and both of their footprints point to the current north pole. The features they share include a huge ramp leading down to a rectangular chamber of about 25m x 12m (located 20m below surface level), forming a t-shaped arrangement when viewed from above. Both are located at an elevated position compared to the surrounding terrain. The floors are covered with multiple layers of megalithic blocks, which (in the case of the Baka pyramid at Zawyet El Aryan) are made of pink granite.

At one of the sites, there's also an enigmatic megalithic pedestal with a peculiar oval tub incl. a massive lid inside the chamber. Egyptologists assume it's a sarcophagus but allegedly no human remains have been found. Instead, a 10cm deep layer of an unknown black residue are said to have been found when the lid was first removed. It is further assumed that the site has been flooded from underground water reservoirs several times in the past. Rubble and countless limestone blocks having been thrown in from above are said to have been an attempt of the ancients to protect the site from constantly being flooded from below. More information about the great pit of the Baka pyramid can also be found in this video.

The unusual architecture and the second, very similar structure at Abu Rawash plus all the details above seem to point to yet another mystery in Ancient Egypt waiting to be solved. It's also worth mentioning that the other site, Abu Rawash, features a massive granite block showing tool marks that may be the result of a 35-foot circular saw that might been used to work the stone, despite the fact that no evidence for this (with the exception of the tool marks themselves) has ever been found.

Here go some screenshots from the video:

Similar layout of both sites:


The pedestal incl. an enigmatic oval tub:


Sketch of the pedestal incl. lid:


Unfortunately, the great pit of the Baka Pyramid at Zawyet El Aryan is used as a waste dump today and the site has been turned into a restricted military area in 1964, making research there impossible ever since. On the other hand, we are lucky that Italian egyptologist and architect Alexandre Barsanti surveyed the site over several years and left behind a rather detailed documentation of what he found.

So maybe these unfinished pyramids were not really intended to be sacred sites but rather some kind of industrial project, possibly related to water management (also see ram pump theory for the Great Pyramid), or even some other solution that the pre-pre-dynastic builders came up with to solve one of their most pressing problems. I'm aware of the fact that evidence is sparse to substantiate any of this but perhaps we can get a discussion going to see what the bigger picture might have looked like.




Sources & Links:
------------------------------------------------
01. Video: Unfinished Egyptian Pyramids or Ancient Reservoirs
02. Video: The Great Pit of Zawyet El Aryan in Egypt
03. Unfinished Northern Pyramid of Zawyet El Aryan
04. Pyramid of Djedefre
05. Egyptologist and architect Alexandre Barsanti
06. Great Pyramid: Ram Pump Hypothesis
07. Annales du Service des Antiquités de l'Egypte
edit on 31-3-2019 by jeep3r because: fixed link




posted on Mar, 31 2019 @ 11:01 AM
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a reply to: jeep3r

Oh man. I just recently found that channel. I have been watching and listening to these all week. They have a ton of great videos full of plausible alternatives to mainstream egyptian narratives.



posted on Mar, 31 2019 @ 11:19 AM
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a reply to: jeep3r

fantastic find as usual...working a convention today.
Bookmark



posted on Mar, 31 2019 @ 11:19 AM
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a reply to: Woodcarver

They do have quite a few videos that are not fringe propaganda but try to view things differently while maintaining a certain balance. Also, we know there are various underground structures and caverns but not all of them are fully explored.

Most notably there's the alleged Labyrinth at Hawara and of course the subterranean chamber of the GP. Perhaps some of those underground areas were connected in a way? In that case, a crucial part of the bigger picture may still be hidden from our view, waiting to be unearthed.
edit on 31-3-2019 by jeep3r because: text



posted on Mar, 31 2019 @ 01:15 PM
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originally posted by: jeep3r
I'm sure most of you have already heard or read about the so-called unfinished pyramids at Zawyet El Aryan and Abu Rawash in Egypt. But perhaps you'll be just as surprised as I was when considering that these structures were perhaps not even meant to be pyramids in the first place, but rather part of a huge ancient engineering project, possibly related to water management or some other fluid-involving process.


If so, it's remarkably bad engineering.

The idea of any of them being "reservoirs" is apparently something cooked up by someone who didn't actually do any conversion or measurement. A 25x12 meter space is only 300 square meters in volume, which means you could fit around 3,500 gallons of water in the pit. Sound like a lot? It's not.

That's enough water to flood 1/10th (one tenth) of an acre of land with a layer of water a millimeter in height... ONCE. So it wouldn't even water one peasant's field. It's about enough water for 10 people for one year if they don't bathe during that time.

It wouldn't be useful for farming. Your average cow drinks 12 gallons of water per day (dairy cows need more but they didn't have dairy cows) so that's enough water for about 11 months of water for a single cow (4400 gallons/year)

The "hydraulic project" makes even less sense sitting next to the Nile, which has enough water for every person, animal, and plant in Egypt (with plenty left over for transportation) and has been flowing like that for over 20,000 years. It's clear that they did not control the Nile and that their hydrology wasn't very good. The few dams that they built did not last long and they were at the mercy of the Nile flood. If they'd had large scale engineering they would have been in control of the water in the Nile and not dependent on floods of "just the right size" to fertilize the fields and water the crops.

Another weakness of the video is that it looks at each of these pyramids as if they're the only thing on the landscape there. This is not true. Each one is associated with offering temples, and is in the middle of a cemetery... which would be a remarkably bad place to put up construction.

I'm not sure why you included Barsanti in your list of references. He worked on the Pyramid of Unas and most definitely thought that pyramids were tombs. Annales du Service... is dig and research reports and none of it supports or suggests hydraulics. It specifically identifies the structures as tombs and talks about graveyards and coffins.



Bottom line: no. A video by someone who wants to "solve a great mystery" but hasn't actually taken the time to do any research.



posted on Mar, 31 2019 @ 01:46 PM
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a reply to: Byrd

Looks like we got the discussion going now!

I also don't think that the guy running the YouTube channel is an expert in Egyptology. But he does point out a few interesting things. As far as I'm concerned, I can understand how Egyptologists are in favour of a logical progression from mastabas to stepped pyramids and then to true pyramids, and I agree that context is important if we know the context refers to the same time period.

If taking the alternative perspective, perhaps this wasn't so much about irrigation but rather about pressure in the chamber(s) which might have served some other purpose. I'm also wondering about the three layers of granite flooring described by Barsanti and the flash floods (caused by rain) that allegedly disappeared overnight. And where were the responsible authorities when the military took over that hill in 1964? It's a shame it's a restricted area today, as many questions will probably remain unanswered until access is granted again.

With the unusual layout of the underground chamber of the GP in mind, I do sometimes ask myself what purpose this layout could have served, if it wasn't some kind of sancuary. I try to keep an open mind, both in terms of egyptological and fringe considerations.



posted on Mar, 31 2019 @ 04:58 PM
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a reply to: Byrd

The amounts of water that may have flowed back then could have been at a much higher rate.
It may have been a series of reservoirs acting as pump stations to continuously pump water in and out to certain points.

I know some of the Roman aqueducts had large fill stations to hold water and then be released at certain intervals to keep fountains and pumps going.



posted on Mar, 31 2019 @ 05:48 PM
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A 25x12 meter space is only 300 square meters in volume, which means you could fit around 3,500 gallons of water in the pit.


Yes...I'm nit picking. Forgive me.

Square meters do not make up volume. No such thing as a 2 dimensional volume. 3 dimensions do. In this case is there a height or depth?

Let's sat it was 10 meters deep. Then we have 3000 cubic meters. Since there are roughly 265 gallons per 1 cubic meter, that's about 7,950,000 gallons of water.

I still have no clue if that's enough.



posted on Mar, 31 2019 @ 06:03 PM
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a reply to: ABNARTY

that's about 7,950,000 gallons of water.

Nope. 795,000 gallons.

But here are the actual numbers:

11.7 x 24 x 21 = 5897 m^3
5897 x 264.2 = 1,557,987 gallons.

A bit more than 1/4 the volume of an Olympic swimming pool. A very, very small reservoir.

egyptphoto.ncf.ca...


edit on 3/31/2019 by Phage because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 31 2019 @ 10:13 PM
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originally posted by: Phage
a reply to: ABNARTY

that's about 7,950,000 gallons of water.

Nope. 795,000 gallons.

But here are the actual numbers:

11.7 x 24 x 21 = 5897 m^3
5897 x 264.2 = 1,557,987 gallons.

A bit more than 1/4 the volume of an Olympic swimming pool. A very, very small reservoir.

egyptphoto.ncf.ca...



What if it were filled with mercury? The Sunspot, NM solar observatory has 11 tons of mercury... how many tons of mercury do you reckon would 5897 m^3 be Phage? You r good at the maths



posted on Apr, 1 2019 @ 12:06 PM
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originally posted by: jeep3r
a reply to: Byrd

If taking the alternative perspective, perhaps this wasn't so much about irrigation but rather about pressure in the chamber(s) which might have served some other purpose.


The chambers aren't airtight nor are they watertight, so you can eliminate that. In fact it couldn't be used to store any gas or liquid. While you MIGHT be able to put some sort of solid in there (sand; something with that grain size) the sheer mechanics of getting your stuff down there and back is quite daunting.

I've been down in the GP. It's not easy getting down there or up out of there.


I'm also wondering about the three layers of granite flooring described by Barsanti and the flash floods (caused by rain) that allegedly disappeared overnight.

* the floor isn't watertight
* flash floods do disappear overnight everywhere in the world, particularly in desert areas. Think of dumping a bucket of water into a playground sand box (which is pretty much what happens... a whole bunch of rain comes suddenly and then stops.) Water goes into the sandbox and after you pour it out of the pail, it "disappears" (absorbed in the sand or ran off a different end.) No miracle. Ordinary natural processes.


And where were the responsible authorities when the military took over that hill in 1964? It's a shame it's a restricted area today, as many questions will probably remain unanswered until access is granted again.

If you had enough clout and money you could probably go back to digging there.


With the unusual layout of the underground chamber of the GP in mind, I do sometimes ask myself what purpose this layout could have served, if it wasn't some kind of sancuary. I try to keep an open mind, both in terms of egyptological and fringe considerations.

It's actually very similar to the interior chambers of many other pyramids. If you look at the floor plans of all the major pyramids, you can see it's kind of a "theme with variations."



posted on Apr, 1 2019 @ 12:11 PM
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originally posted by: strongfp
a reply to: Byrd

The amounts of water that may have flowed back then could have been at a much higher rate.
It may have been a series of reservoirs acting as pump stations to continuously pump water in and out to certain points.

I know some of the Roman aqueducts had large fill stations to hold water and then be released at certain intervals to keep fountains and pumps going.


It's still a trivial amount of water AND it's on the wrong side of the river.

They didn't farm the areas with cemeteries (cemeteries are on the arid west bank, not on the east bank. There's no settlements next to any pyramid in Egypt (there's tombs, though. A lot of tombs.)

Roman aqueducts were also positioned downslope from a water source. There's no water source upslope of any pyramid (i.e., no river/stream/lake higher than the pyramids.)



posted on Apr, 1 2019 @ 12:15 PM
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originally posted by: seaez

originally posted by: Phage
a reply to: ABNARTY

that's about 7,950,000 gallons of water.

Nope. 795,000 gallons.

But here are the actual numbers:

11.7 x 24 x 21 = 5897 m^3
5897 x 264.2 = 1,557,987 gallons.

A bit more than 1/4 the volume of an Olympic swimming pool. A very, very small reservoir.

egyptphoto.ncf.ca...



What if it were filled with mercury? The Sunspot, NM solar observatory has 11 tons of mercury... how many tons of mercury do you reckon would 5897 m^3 be Phage? You r good at the maths


We'd have known if it was filled with mercury. That substance would have coated all the surfaces and filled the cracks and there'd be a LOT Of it lying around even after all these years. And it'd be causing skin problems for anyone who went inside a pyramid and touched the surfaces (remember that sleeping inside the Great Pyramid to obtain spiritual enlightenment was a very popular practice.)



posted on Apr, 1 2019 @ 01:37 PM
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a reply to: Byrd

The reservoirs may have not been for agriculture. It maybe have just been for water control, what intrigued me about the video is he mentioned the hole was almost filled with rain water one day and then completely empty the next. Where did it go?

I think there might be a way to test all this theory, but unachievable with how tight Egypt is eith their old stuff.



posted on Apr, 1 2019 @ 03:43 PM
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a reply to: Phage

Roget that. Fat finger error.

If they were a reservoir, maybe that volume was sufficient for whatever they needed. I have no idea.

If they needed to hold a 200M Butterfly competition as you mentioned, they would be SOL.



posted on Apr, 1 2019 @ 04:48 PM
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originally posted by: Byrd

originally posted by: strongfp
a reply to: Byrd

The amounts of water that may have flowed back then could have been at a much higher rate.
It may have been a series of reservoirs acting as pump stations to continuously pump water in and out to certain points.

I know some of the Roman aqueducts had large fill stations to hold water and then be released at certain intervals to keep fountains and pumps going.


It's still a trivial amount of water AND it's on the wrong side of the river.

They didn't farm the areas with cemeteries (cemeteries are on the arid west bank, not on the east bank. There's no settlements next to any pyramid in Egypt (there's tombs, though. A lot of tombs.)

Roman aqueducts were also positioned downslope from a water source. There's no water source upslope of any pyramid (i.e., no river/stream/lake higher than the pyramids.)


I read somewhere water moves east at a rate of 1km per 1000 years



posted on Apr, 1 2019 @ 07:43 PM
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originally posted by: strongfp
a reply to: Byrd

The reservoirs may have not been for agriculture. It maybe have just been for water control,


That's the equivalent of using a shot glass to control water flowing in an Olympic sized swimming pool.

Far too small.


what intrigued me about the video is he mentioned the hole was almost filled with rain water one day and then completely empty the next. Where did it go?

Into the ground. It's a desert. Look at any number of videos of flash floods in deserts.


I think there might be a way to test all this theory, but unachievable with how tight Egypt is eith their old stuff.

Egypt is open to testing things IF it's done right and IF you get the permissions. Since you're unlikely to be able to get that, you can model it and test it fairly easily on some lands here in the US. The deserts here aren't quite as extreme as the Sahara, but you could model it. You'll find that water sinks into dry soil quickly and you'll find that something the size of an Olympic swimming pool isn't going to do much when you put it alongside something like the Mississippi River.



posted on Apr, 1 2019 @ 08:25 PM
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a reply to: Byrd

I have to disagree.

The underground water flow, and the Nile as mighty and influential as it was, and still is, has a major factor into testing what the ancient Egyptians could have achieved. The hydraulic theory seems plausible to me. And when you think of it in terms of the great pyramids, which does have evidence of a 'mote', it can show not only status as fountains of life, but deter grave robbers from attempting to access to the deceased people within. When these structures were built, they were built to last, and the waterways may have been built with same intention. Just, water has as mind of it's own when left unattended.
edit on 1-4-2019 by strongfp because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 2 2019 @ 11:42 AM
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originally posted by: Byrd

I'm not sure why you included Barsanti in your list of references. He worked on the Pyramid of Unas and most definitely thought that pyramids were tombs. Annales du Service... is dig and research reports and none of it supports or suggests hydraulics. It specifically identifies the structures as tombs and talks about graveyards and coffins.


I mentioned the pamphlet because it includes Barsanti's dig report which can be found on pages 260-286. I'm not sure if any other oval sarcophagi have been found, but to him it seemed unusual since he states the following (translated from French):



Excavation Report/Unfinished Pyramid by A. Barsanti

I put myself in a position to lift it [the lid]. All precautions taken made me hope that the content would be most valuable, but I was wrong once again: when the interior of the container became visible, I found it completely empty. The only thing I noticed was that the inside was lined with what looked like a black "bordure" of 10cm height.

It is probably the light deposit of some liquid enclosed in the container by way of offering or libation which will have evaporated over the years. It has been hypothesized that this container was an unused sarcophagus, but I cannot confirm this. The care with which it was protected proves that it contained something, and the blackish deposit tells us about the nature of this content.

No one would have taken such precautionary measures, and placed this stone container under an enormous quantity of massive blocks, if it would have been empty.


This means he expected to find a sarcophagus but concluded that this probably wasn't the purpose of the container. It also seems a bit odd that it was found in such a location, beneath the massive stone flooring described by Barsanti.




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