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Thomas Jefferson, next on the chopping block. racist.

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posted on Mar, 30 2019 @ 01:11 PM
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a reply to: BrianFlanders

His actions make clear he did mean to.




posted on Mar, 30 2019 @ 01:17 PM
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originally posted by: dug88

originally posted by: BrianFlanders
I think what really needs to be said about all this is that when you look at historical figures (especially ones that died ages ago) they were all products of their times. And whatever their politics and ideals, their contribution to history eventually brought us to where we are today.

The kind of racism that existed in those days is long gone in the US and Jefferson's contributions to the future helped make that happen (whether he meant to or not).


There's that...and the fact that not a single person complaining about any of this today has ever been a slave and likely has zero actual idea of what slavery is.


Well, I kind of disagree with that. I think slavery is actually still the dominant system of civilization but it's no longer based on race. It's now based on class and circumstance. Most people living today are slaves but don't know it (or won't admit it).

But this isn't about slavery. It's about racism. Slavery used to be based on racism but no longer is so it's only really relevant in that race-based slavery ceased to exist in the US over a century ago and Thomas Jefferson made a substantial contribution to history that helped make that (eventually) happen.

The problem today is not racism at all. The problem is still slavery. But more than that is the problem that at our current stage of development and technology, life without slavery is still impossible.
edit on 30-3-2019 by BrianFlanders because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 30 2019 @ 01:24 PM
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originally posted by: Lumenari
Actually, it was illegal for him to free his slaves.

Virginia laws forbid it.


From 1782 onward manumission was completely legal in Virginia, the previous law required you to receive approval from the state government.



posted on Mar, 30 2019 @ 01:45 PM
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He may indeed have been (although I do not know this for a fact). If it is true, I disagree with his beliefs. However, he was still a great President and a founder of our nation. You can be a great President/leader without necessarily being the best person.

I personally refuse to start going back hundreds of years (or any number of years) and holding this kind of stuff against people. We aren't going to white wash our Nation's history. We get it, mistakes were made people in the past = bad. Got it. Doesn't change his contributions to our young nation nor does it obligate a single living person today to apologize or "make reparations"

You are aces in my book Mr. President. And although I do not approve of racism (true racism, like we had during the slavery or segregation times) I do approve of him as a President



posted on Mar, 30 2019 @ 01:57 PM
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Didn't Obama say he had the Quran in his bedroom, which supposedly identifies with all the 76 genders somehow?



posted on Mar, 30 2019 @ 04:04 PM
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originally posted by: Specimen
Didn't Obama say he had the Quran in his bedroom, which supposedly identifies with all the 76 genders somehow?



Obama was a politician. Politicians are just glorified whores. They will say anything if it suits their needs (primarily, buying votes and asking for funds).
edit on 30-3-2019 by BrianFlanders because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 30 2019 @ 08:31 PM
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originally posted by: AugustusMasonicus

originally posted by: Lumenari
Actually, it was illegal for him to free his slaves.

Virginia laws forbid it.


From 1782 onward manumission was completely legal in Virginia, the previous law required you to receive approval from the state government.


You know, I read a book 20-30 years ago that laid out the premise that he couldn't because of the laws at the time.

You responded, I researched it and the book was crap... he actually did release 2 slaves before he died, could have for 20 years or so before he died and on his death willed 260 of them to his heirs.

Makes me think entirely differently about him... thank you for the heads up.




posted on Mar, 30 2019 @ 08:54 PM
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originally posted by: blueman12
a reply to: Cancerwarrior

Why not? Was slavery, rape, murder, pedophilia, and other atrocities okay because standards of past societies accepted it?

Those standards weren't okay for the people suffering such acts. I'm not saying we should erase history, but to i would not say that Jefferson or other slave owners were "good" men because slavery was legal.

Now if one threw their sh!t in the street, I'm not going to judge them because that was a custom back in the day. However, I believe there are universal principles of right and wrong. Inflicting suffering on others for the benefit of oneself has always been wrong.

And if we don't have some set of universal principles, then we are just slaves to the whims of society. Blowing in any direction that society decides.



So now Jefferson is not only a racist, but a rapist, a murderer, and a pedophile. Do you people actually listen to yourselves? Or better yet, Ever pick up a history book? So Jefferson owning slaves totally negates every other amazing achievement the man did in his life?

Slavery has always existed as long as humans have been around. That’s a fact. There are millions of people living in various forms of slavery today. You might like to think that you are just oh so much of a better person than anyone else in any other culture that has ever lived before you to stroke your own ego, but if you were born into and accepted it as a part of your culture, you would not pretend to be so offended by it.

www.sheppardsoftware.com...

There you go, educate yourself.



posted on Mar, 30 2019 @ 09:07 PM
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Guess this means he comes off the U.S. Nickel and $2 Bills 😆



posted on Mar, 30 2019 @ 09:23 PM
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originally posted by: Bluntone22
I think its time for the federal government to put an end to this situation.
Offer anyone with African ancestry a free ticket home to their country of origin.
A one time pass accompanied with a formal renouncing of their American citizenships.

A chance to return to the paradise they long for.
A final nail in the coffin.

This will be a boat ticket in the hold of a cargo ship too. No flights so as to stear clear of any risk of cultural appropriation of flight in white culture.

We could even do a one for one exchange for Mexican citizens. Keep the population where it is that way.


Since you are for this, I am going to guess you are also for Europeans.


Send them packing also, since they were the ones who brought slaves over and destroyed North America.



posted on Mar, 30 2019 @ 09:36 PM
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originally posted by: Cancerwarrior




So now Jefferson is not only a racist, but a rapist, a murderer, and a pedophile. Do you people actually listen to yourselves

Straw man Fallacy because what the poster actually said was "Was slavery, rape, murder, pedophilia, and other atrocities okay because standards of past societies accepted it?" and at no point was this used to reference Jefferson.




Slavery has always existed as long as humans have been around. That’s a fact.

OK, so what are you saying?

That since it has existed before and after, it is OK?

That being a slave owner does not represent you as a person?



posted on Mar, 30 2019 @ 09:40 PM
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This is a point of stupid. Hitler didn't own Slaves, neither did Stalin, Chairman Mao, Berndt Andreas Baader, or Horst Mahler. I guess these "so-called-progressives" should just put up and defend statues to those guys instead of people that made positive changes to the world.

Why don't they go after Italy's statues of the Roman Emperors? They could go and demand that these statues get torn down, while wearing their sweat-shop made, mass produced clothes all while streaming on their mass produced slave labor electronic devices. It would be a great "meme of hypocracy"



posted on Mar, 30 2019 @ 09:53 PM
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Originally posted by: Guyfriday




This is a point of stupid. Hitler didn't own Slaves, neither did Stalin, Chairman Mao, Berndt Andreas Baader, or Horst Mahler. I guess these "so-called-progressives" should just put up and defend statues to those guys instead of people that made positive changes to the world.


People on the right are idiots. Those evil bastards belonged to a party that may have the term "Socialist" in it and you link it to the left.

Nope does not work that way, the acts of these cruel men closely resemble the right-wing policies and action. They demonized another group, used propaganda to manipulate people, lied about issues or cherry picked facts to create a false narrative about what is really going on...etc.





Why don't they go after Italy's statues of the Roman Emperors? They could go and demand that these statues get torn down, while wearing their sweat-shop made, mass produced clothes all while streaming on their mass produced slave labor electronic devices. It would be a great "meme of hypocracy"


Why would they go after another countries false idols? This is about America and I am pretty sure no one has statues of Roman Emperors here, where they are loved and admired and are representations of America.



posted on Mar, 30 2019 @ 10:26 PM
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I propose a solution that will satisfy the SJW's.

We will replace every statue of Hamilton that is torn down with a statue of Mohammed.



posted on Mar, 30 2019 @ 10:53 PM
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a reply to: 0n514ught


You lefties are more Trotskyist then socialist, but that just my opinion. You can say what ever you wish about what is and what isn't, but from what I have seen and read most of the time when a leftie gets called out for something outside of their belief system they shout "NAZI, RACIST, HATEMONGER". Lefties are always looking for a fight, but never really care about discussing the issue out for a solution. It's all ways "My way or shut up".

Since you say things don't work one way, can you calmly explain to the group how "it does work". From my viewing angle you can call a spiked steel ball any fluffy name you want, but at the end of the day it's still a steel spiked ball. So to me a left or right means absolutely nothing since the philosophy of left-right is very fluid.


Why wouldn't they? They seem to not like American ideologies so much that they want to destroy any history of then founding fathers and ideas that made this country.


edit on 30-3-2019 by Guyfriday because: EDITED TO MAKE BETTER SENSE



posted on Mar, 31 2019 @ 12:19 AM
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a reply to: Cancerwarrior

I was speaking in general. It does not negate his accomplishments. However, I don't think society or culture makes slavery okay.

You're right, slavery does exist today. Jefferson seemed to be on the better side of slave owners. It's hard to give him a pat on the back though.

I get you get your point, and I'm not sure why these college activists are going after Jefferson instead of Saudi Arabia, or the UAE.

It's like if vegans went after ethical local farmers, when there is a factory farm right next door.



posted on Mar, 31 2019 @ 12:23 AM
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According to the Black Hebrew Israelites;

All the founding fathers were blek...



posted on Mar, 31 2019 @ 12:24 AM
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originally posted by: Lysergic
According to the Black Hebrew Israelites;

All the founding fathers were blek...




But Nation of Islam Farrakhan sez;

Abe Lincoln didn't free the slaves and George Washington was slave owner.




posted on Mar, 31 2019 @ 12:46 AM
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a reply to: blueman12


Case in point: This restaurant in Toronto was boycotted by animal rights activist for serving meats that have to be gained by hunting and animal population control measures.
newsx.com


The restaurant named Antler in Toronto is known for serving interesting and controversial cuisine that includes the meat of bison, boar, rabbit, duck and deer, as well as serving foie gras, which has long been condemned as especially cruel for ducks and geese.


But wait! From: blogto.com/eat drink


"Antler has always and will continue to respect the vegan diet and we have several dishes on our menu that showcase that. These have been on our menu since we opened in 2015."


So it's not like these people research much, if anything outside of their point of view.


edit on 31-3-2019 by Guyfriday because: edited to add some stupid god name possiblities.



posted on Mar, 31 2019 @ 01:00 AM
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a reply to: Guyfriday

Yea.. I'm a vegan and I don't understand why people go after ethical farmers or in that case, hunted / population control meat.

Maybe once we fix all the serious problems and attain utopia status, we can debate Jefferson or hunting..

I debate on ATS for fun and to be a contrarian. Even though I've questioned Jefferson's morals, I would never consider vandalizing a statue. Or even protesting.

It's like the new ultra-feminism movement. Ignoring worldwide abuse of women, while bloggers criticize men for spreading their legs too much.




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