Another night of Brexit drama

a reply to: UKTruth

At least I'm not going around calling those that don't agree with me traitors.

Traitors to who exactly would that be? LoL

My true colours have always been known and my nation never voted for Brexit.

And you are lucky your just a silly keyboard warrior offensive little cowboy. x

Traitors indeed, maybe you should threaten to don khaki and pick up a rifle with Nigel Farage when Theresa May fails to deliver Brexit and come find some traitors?

48.11% of the people of the UK can hardly be considered to be traitors else that's a real dilemma you and Nigel have to contend with, thats a given.

originally posted by: paraphi

They're not traitors. That's too strong and unhelpful. They are just people with a different opinion than you,

Traitor Definition of Traitor by Merriam-Webster

Definition of traitor. one who betrays another's trust or is false to an obligation or duty.

Surely ^^^that^^^ IS the way the politicians are behaving they were voted for

to represent the majority?

Of course many MPs who never wanted to leave the EU, are swayed by their own narrative

They are not in power for themselves...... they are PAID to represent those

who elected them.

originally posted by: oldcarpy
That is all true enough but the bottom line is that they are ignoring the vote of the people to leave the EU which to me is quite disgraceful. They are meant to be public servants and this is meant to be a democracy.

Yes, I get that. But there are different flavours of "leaving". Hard, soft, flaccid, deal or no deal, fat one with star dust, Norwegian, hybrid, Common Market 2.0, Canadian, Brazilian, pie in the sky, and all the rest. It’s an industry of ideas, most of which are silly, but which divide opinion. But there is a final “no deal, just get out” which is the bottom line, as you say.

While I don’t think it’s a legitimate argument, there’s a view that we (apparently) know about the consequences of leaving so a second referendum would help people take that on board. Of course, the second referendum crowd have made sure the negative narrative would ensure a change of the outcome, otherwise what’s the point? This is of course the last gasp of the Remainers, who are clearly a bloc of MPs.

Sadly, though, our MPs are failing to come up with the goods because they are fixated on their own politics rather than the fact in hand, that is a referendum outcome to leave.

I think I'm lucky my conservative MP voted against all of last night's debates and wants to leave like the majority of the referendum voters.
I may have to vote conservative for the first time in my life.

originally posted by: paraphi

Yes, I get that. But there are different flavours of "leaving". Hard, soft, flaccid, deal or no deal, fat one with star dust, Norwegian, hybrid, Common Market 2.0, Canadian, Brazilian, pie in the sky, and all the rest. It’s an industry of ideas, most of which are silly, but which divide opinion. But there is a final “no deal, just get out” which is the bottom line, as you say.

There is only one form of Leave...... leave with NO ties. There is plenty

of time in the future to get all touchy feely if wanted.

'Soft Brexit' is a synonym for staying in in all but name.

While I don’t think it’s a legitimate argument, there’s a view that we (apparently) know about the consequences of leaving so a second referendum would help people take that on board. Of course, the second referendum crowd have made sure the negative narrative would ensure a change of the outcome, otherwise what’s the point? This is of course the last gasp of the Remainers, who are clearly a bloc of MPs.

Funny the view for a second referendum or peoples vote seem to come mainly

from 'remainers' I am all for it except the first one hasn't been implemented

yet and its already three years gone. However I am very confident that the result

would be very different to what the remainers think.

Sadly, though, our MPs are failing to come up with the goods because they are fixated on their own politics rather than the fact in hand, that is a referendum outcome to leave.

originally posted by: eletheia
Funny the view for a second referendum or peoples vote seem to come mainly from 'remainers'

I would be OK for a second referendum in (say) six years. In that way there will be a proper discussion on the virtues of joining an EU, perhaps for good. I say this because none of the discussion to "revoke Artcle 50" has highighted why the EU is such a good place to stay in. Yes, I get the EU is good for German manufacturing, and French wine, and keeping the Greeks down and the Republic of Ireland as a tax dodgers paradise, but what good is the EU really?

I would love a post Brexit discussion on re-joining the EU because I am genuinely interested to know the benefits of being a part of an undemocratic federal Europe.

a reply to: eletheia

You say the only form of leave is to leave with no ties but i honestly do not believe the majority of the population would agree with you there. Remainers obviously want a deal of some description and even many leave voters don't want to cut off their nose to spite their face.

I will not deny that a hardened minority do wish to leave with no deal but you have to ask - "does the dog wag the tail or does the tail wag the dog?". No deal is definitely a case of the tail wagging the dog and would impoverish the poorer in society. People keep talking about treason - well that is an active example right there.

originally posted by: paraphi
I would be OK for a second referendum in (say) six years. In that way there will be a proper discussion on the virtues of joining an EU, perhaps for good.

I would say maybe a bit longer as that is barely one of our Parliamentary

secession, and Its already the best part of three years and we still havent

managed to extricate ourselves from the EU.

I say this because none of the discussion to "revoke Artcle 50" has highighted why the EU is such a good place to stay in. Yes, I get the EU is good for German manufacturing, and French wine, and keeping the Greeks down and the Republic of Ireland as a tax dodgers paradise, but what good is the EU really?

It is a a Franco/German enterprise after all ...... the other minion nations

just make up numbers .... like quantity rather than quality

I would love a post Brexit discussion on re-joining the EU because I am genuinely interested to know the benefits of being a part of an undemocratic federal Europe.

I for one think its already on the slippery slope, its only a matter of time.

originally posted by: Flavian
a reply to: eletheia

You say the only form of leave is to leave with no ties but i honestly do not believe the majority of the population would agree with you there. Remainers obviously want a deal of some description

I wonder where remainers would be if it wasn't for the innovators, explorers

and inventors of the past...... an ommlette cannot be made without breaking

egg. Remainers are like scared children with the constant need to have their

hands held.

and even many leave voters don't want to cut off their nose to spite their face.

I don't think you will find any leavers think/feel like that on these boards or even

in RL. Do you have any stats on that?

I will not deny that a hardened minority do wish to leave with no deal but you have to ask - "does the dog wag the tail or does the tail wag the dog?". No deal is definitely a case of the tail wagging the dog and would impoverish the poorer in society. People keep talking about treason - well that is an active example right there.

Thats only hearsay and your opinion...... not fact!!

a reply to: eletheia

These threads are full of hyperbole and opinion from Leavers - so why not remainers too? And it isn't hearsay that the poorest would impoverished. That is what is being planned for with no deal as that is what is expected to happen. Never mind all the other claims, food costs 10% higher immediately following Brexit is a huge issue for millions in this country and will cause real hardships and suffering. Many people are barely getting by as it is.

And do you genuinely believe that ATS, a conspiracy site, is representative of the public at large? That is risible.

Treason is absolutely the right term to describe all who seek closer ties with any foreign entity, including the EU. This has been demonstrated by the various EU Treaties that undermine British constitutional law.

The Crown has the legal right to remedy this and must do so if the people petition for such.

Parliament (both Houses) are servants under the Crown (1st House) and govern only by mandate of the people (democracy), authorised by Royal Assent.

It is not a matter of opinion. It is the legal position that empowering the EU to override British rule of law is breach of sovereignty and an act of treason.

www.ukcolumn.org...

originally posted by: eletheiaI wonder where remainers would be if it wasn't for the innovators, explorers

and inventors of the past...... an ommlette cannot be made without breaking

egg. Remainers are like scared children with the constant need to have their

hands held.

Remainers are happy with the current situation whereby we have come together as humanity and joined together to make a single whole coomunity. All this Brexiteer divide us up is no different from the dreamers of apartheid and the results will be the same total division leading to no good for anybody.

The best of it is those who voted us out are the most likely to feel the post Brexit squeeze. Japanese and German plants are readying to flee these shores in an exodus unseen in the past and whole regions will be consigned to third world levels of poverty in the long term. Whole regions of our nation are already on their backside, throw in Brexit and the decline in tax revenues and you can consign much of Britain to appalling decline in living standards and all the crime and social decline that will come with it.

Brexit is proving to be a total farce and nothing good will come of it bar the segregation that Brixiteers so desire

originally posted by: ufoorbhunter
Remainers are happy with the current situation whereby we have come together as humanity and joined together to make a single whole coomunity. All this Brexiteer divide us up is no different from the dreamers of apartheid and the results will be the same total division leading to no good for anybody.

I'm not sure what planet your on...... I dont know of anywhere where its all

'kumbaya' and group hugs etc. There will always be takers and givers and

people always herd with those who they have something incommon with;

there will always be go-getters and those simply happy to take without

contributing......c'est la vie.

The best of it is those who voted us out are the most likely to feel the post Brexit squeeze. Japanese and German plants are readying to flee these shores in an exodus unseen in the past and whole regions will be consigned to third world levels of poverty in the long term. Whole regions of our nation are already on their backside, throw in Brexit and the decline in tax revenues and you can consign much of Britain to appalling decline in living standards and all the crime and social decline that will come with it.

Oh not again...... Like all industries keep up or get left behind. The much

lauded diesel saving the planet, found worse than the petrol, The electric

car, the driverless car, people keeping their cars for longer, too many cars

on the road? People used to talk about 2 car families I drive pass ordinary

family houses with 4 or 5 cars in their drives. Oh!! didn't I read somewhere

that mercedes were calling back a batch of cars that had been catching fire

Hmmm....German engineering standards dropping??

Brexit is proving to be a total farce and nothing good will come of it bar the segregation that Brixiteers so desire

I have to agree totally badly handled, However things are not all hunky dory

on the EU front, they are having more problems than the UK and than they are

admitting to despite Brexit.

To the future.

a reply to: ufoorbhunter

Remainers are happy with the current situation whereby we have come together as humanity and joined together to make a single whole coomunity.

Are you for real.
We still have the social divides that have beset this country for centuries.

Brexit is proof of that.
A minority elite dictating to the majority people.

All this Brexiteer divide us up is no different from the dreamers of apartheid and the results will be the same total division leading to no good for anybody.

All we are going to have now is at least 17.4million people feeling utterly betrayed and disenfranchised.

The problem arose when the Remainers refused to accept the result of a democratically held referendum and then did everything possible to derail it, promote friction and simply be as divisive as possible.

The problems we may face down the road lie solely at the feet of the Remainers and the political elite whose wishes the Remainers have furthered.

Brexiters : do not read any further, you might all choke on your Horlicks !
Sir Mark Sedwill, the gvt’s national security adviser, has sent out a 14 page letter
to cabinet ministers about the dangers of a no-deal Brexit.

The proviso being that letter stays on the gvt’s files
in the event of a public inquiry into the handling of Brexit..

Top mandarin's bombshell No Deal warning: Food up 10%, police unable to protect public, direct rule in Ulster, worse recession than 2008 says leaked letter

No-deal would result in a 10 per cent spike in food prices and the collapse of some businesses that trade with the EU
The government would come under pressure to bail out companies on the brink

It would hamper the ability of the police and security services to keep people safe
It would lead to the reintroduction of direct rule in Northern Ireland for the first time since 2007;
A recession will hit the UK and the pound’s depreciation will be ‘more harmful’ than in 2008.
Our legal authorities and judicial system would be put under ‘enormous pressure’

... snip ...

Sir Mark warns no-deal could lead to the break-up of the UK, saying: ‘The stability of the union would be dislocated.’

It is not in the national interest,
security-wise or otherwise,
to quit the EU

What was Brexit about again ?

Ahhh, mais oui, bien sûr !

a reply to: Cassi3l

another monger of fear sir sedwell hmmmm..

harmonisation of vat on food across the europe project kicking in 2020? 5%? that's just food lol.

i'd take 10% anyday without the eu shaft, besides, when more people realise the length of shaft inserted, perhaps parliament will
understand the need to cull the benches and expenses.

f.

a reply to: OtherSideOfTheCoin



She just canny get that plan tae shift.



That laxative will not won't nether.

a reply to: andy06shake

no gloryholes ta, although next cubicle, full of cross-party support augering
a hole through the partition with a bellybrace at belly height.

topcat first lol!

f.

a reply to: fakedirt

"An investigation has been launched after two ‘pro-Brexit’ devices were placed on railway tracks in a ‘deliberate’ sabotage attempt, police have said."

"show a length of yellow wire across a railway line, along with a laminated note that reads: ‘GOVERNMENT BRETRAYAL: Leave Means Leave – We will bring this country to its knees if we don’t leave."

If peaceable remainers are getting called the likes of a traitor, for simply voicing their discontent at this whole debacle.

Then i guess, following the same spurious logic, that makes the pro-Brexit halfwit moronic bastards responsible for the likes of this terrorists.

metro.co.uk... s5erqH7trfhA6aMdd6WXvgV1a8

originally posted by: andy06shake
a reply to: fakedirt

If peaceable remainers are getting called the likes of a traitor, for simply voicing their discontent at this whole debacle.

Then i guess, following the same spurious logic, that makes the pro-Brexit halfwit moronic bastards responsible for the likes of this terrorists.

metro.co.uk... s5erqH7trfhA6aMdd6WXvgV1a8

strange it was in a place called yaxley

bozos doing this better have a fat bank account but it seems stupid may start pulling overtime.
the rail rozzers gonna get em without a doubt. devices on live lines will carry a severe cost.

the only traitors I can perceive are the ones in the halls of power who willingly enshrined an act into law
only to pull out all the stops to suicide it whilst people suffer austerity and poverty daily.

f.