Establishment Democrats against transparency for FBI but for it for Mueller report

There is a lot of buzz in the media and elsewhere about the need for Trump to allow the public to see the Mueller report as unredacted as possible.

From the outset, let me say I agree with this. I have called for as much transparency as possible throughout this while investigation, and continue to do so here.

But there are some things I find fascination about the media and establishments Democrats wailing about the need to release the report.

The first is, Trump has indicated that he too wants the report released. Now granted this is just lip service, but the hyperbolic reaction from some Democrats and their allies, that evil Trump will hold back the report, despite him saying he wants it released, is absurd. What this really is is the media and establishment dems trying to deflect from their own sources telling them their wont be more indictments recommended by Mueller.

And its is definitely interesting to see how these dems think not having transparency and releasing the report will be damaging for the country. There are countless examples, but just to pick one out, check out this thread about Beto saying the country may be destroyed by next year if its not released.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

However, the real reason of this thread is the other reason I am amused by these Democratic calls for transparency.

Remember when Trump wanted to declassify Nunes and Grassley's memo? Remember when he wanted to declassify statements from Bruce Ohr, the FISA warrant on Carter Page, and much more material?

I do. And I remember many of these very same establishment democrat, intel agencies allies in washington and the media screaming that these sorts of declassification would hurt intel agencies sources and methods, was only being done for political reasons, and would jeopardize the country.

Here are just a few articles where Dems are saying stuff like this.

www.cnbc.com...

www.npr.org...

www.politico.com...

First, sensitive sources, human and technical, would be exposed. The message to other intelligence services and to specific sources would be that you can’t trust the United States to protect secrets. Our own intelligence and law enforcement services would be demoralized by the president’s political use of their hard-won intelligence.

Second, the nature of these warrant requests is such that revealing this one would not quell controversy. Few people understand that these are investigative tools, not prosecutorial documents. They are not designed to prove guilt or innocence. They pull together reports that suggest a concerning pattern, and the judges have to decide whether the information is sufficiently compelling to justify further investigation with tools, including wiretaps, that require court approval. In other words, law enforcement is not saying it is absolutely certain — it is asking for permission to find out.

Third, tossing such a sensitive, complex and lawful investigative tool into a hot political controversy would be totally irresponsible. Coming in the midst of a law enforcement investigation that involves the president himself, it would amount to his most damaging attack so far on our judicial, law enforcement and intelligence systems.

www.washingtonpost.com... ml?utm_term=.5cbd6196dfe5

I and many others said these arguments were ridiculous back then, that due to the incredible implications on all sides of the russia investigation, we should demand as much transparency as possible.

And now we know many of the people agreeing with these arguments against transparency were lying, because they now are all for it when it comes to the Mueller report.

So just to sum up; many of the establishment Democrat voices thought that RELEASING info from the FBI about the russia investigation that potentially showed wrong doing by the FBI would harm the FBI, hurt the country, and possibly lead to people being killed.

And many of those same people feel NOT RELEASING the Mueller report that may make Trump look bad would possibly destroy the country or severely harm it.

Just another in a long line of hypocrisy for these establishment democrats and their allies.

Here is what Trump should do.

Release the Mueller report as unredacted as possible.

Then immediately say he was moved by all of the Democrats on why transparency is so important on this issue, and he will shortly be releasing as much info from the FBI investigation into russia as possible.

MAke the establishment Democrats and their allies argue on one day why transparency is so important into the russia investigation, and then why it is so dangerous the next day, just so the people can see how hypocritical they are.

And finally we may be able to see just how legitimate or corrupt the FBI was in their investigation.

What is happening now.... Will taint elections for decades as peeps just look for payback as opposed to what is best for the majority of peeps.

It doesn't matter what the report says, they'll continue on.

It's been reiterated many times in the hours since the finishing of the investigation.

Barr is required by statute to withhold certain information (Grand Jury testimony, for example). They know this! They are just setting the narrative for the next stage of the drama.

"Look! Barr redacted things! We told you, they're dirty! What are they hiding?!"

And because the media is complicit, and noone will print (or bother to read) the legal explanation, half the country will become convinced the only reason there are redactions is because Trump is "obstructing justice" or whatever the next nonsense buzzword.

They are just setting the stage for more drama and outrage in their base that they can use to fuel their next series of congressional investigations.

a reply to: Grambler

There is a definite need for complete transparency, not just to vindicate or damn individuals. People need to know who wasted their tax dollars and why. It's not the government's money these clowns are wasting, it's the people's money.

Cheers - Dave

The Democrats do not want transparency for FBI stuff that way they can twist their leaker's information how ever they want to and people cannot see the information to see their interpretation of the leaked info is BS.

It is that simple.

Have any of the louder "progressive voices" here acknowledged any of the hypocrisy? I'm in and out of ATS these days so it definitely could've happened without my noticing. Surely one or two of them have?

I know in RL that many dems and independents have walked--if not run--away...but what about here?

a reply to: Grambler

im ready to absolve Trump and everyone on his team of any guilt or wrong doing no matter how small or insignificant or even if prior to or unrelated to the elections.


trump releases the unredacted report and then force the dems to releade unredacted findings on Hillary and Obama.

what's fair is fair.

If there is nothing to hide by the trump WH, they should welcome complete transparency. Show the taxpayers that it's all just a big "nothing burger".....

Let's not forget what the SAME people who are pushing for full transparency into all the non supported accusations that would make up the detail behind the Mueller report actually said when the shoe was on the other foot.

Benghazi?
IRS scandal?
Fast & Furious?

The EXACT same people did NOT want all the documents provided to the public.

These hypocrites should simply be ignored and mocked as the partisan hacks that they are.

originally posted by: olaru12
If there is nothing to hide by the trump WH, they should welcome complete transparency. Show the taxpayers that it's all just a big "nothing burger".....

Because the documentation dump in the SC investigation would include all the salacious and unverified rumours and accusations against the people being investigated. There is no basis to provide all that information. A person or people being investigated are indicted or not indicted. The source materials are completely and utterly irrelevant. Why should you, or CNN or MSNBC be allowed to re-investigate and do the SC's job?

You got your answer. No indictments. So Trump and his entire campaign have committed no crimes relating to collusion/conspiracy with Russia in the 2016 election. Why are you not happy about that????

originally posted by: The GUT
Have any of the louder "progressive voices" here acknowledged any of the hypocrisy? I'm in and out of ATS these days so it definitely could've happened without my noticing. Surely one or two of them have?

I know in RL that many dems and independents have walked--if not run--away...but what about here?

Many of them smelled the coffee some time ago and we've not seen sight nor sound of them.
A few of the brainwashed are still here and they are doubling down, in line with the corrupt MSM and Democrat party.

originally posted by: olaru12
If there is nothing to hide by the trump WH, they should welcome complete transparency. Show the taxpayers that it's all just a big "nothing burger".....

And so by that logic all of the dems and fbi that fought against transparency with things like the FIsa warrant against page and many other documents must have had something to hide.

originally posted by: Grambler

originally posted by: olaru12
If there is nothing to hide by the trump WH, they should welcome complete transparency. Show the taxpayers that it's all just a big "nothing burger".....

And so by that logic all of the dems and fbi that fought against transparency with things like the FIsa warrant against page and many other documents must have had something to hide.

All findings should be released. Total transparency with no favoritism shown to either party. I would think if the Mueller report shows a clean WH, it would insure a trump reelection and a clear path for his investigation into dembs criminality. Why the resistance by the GOP.

originally posted by: olaru12

originally posted by: Grambler

originally posted by: olaru12
If there is nothing to hide by the trump WH, they should welcome complete transparency. Show the taxpayers that it's all just a big "nothing burger".....

And so by that logic all of the dems and fbi that fought against transparency with things like the FIsa warrant against page and many other documents must have had something to hide.

All findings should be released. Total transparency with no favoritism shown to either party. I would think if the Mueller report shows a clean WH, it would insure a trump reelection. Why the resistance by the GOP.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Play dumb all you like, no one is buying it.
The old leftist tricks don;t work anymore.
Find some new ones.

a reply to: Grambler

There is a lot of buzz in the media and elsewhere about the need for Trump to allow the public to see the Mueller report as unredacted as possible.

The buzz in the liberal media and from prominent democrats today is that even full disclosure of the Mueller report is NOT enough.

They want ALL documents and evidence from the entire Mueller probe/investigations in addition to the full disclosure of the report. And they intend to do everything within their powers to get it.

The level of hypocrisy in the Dem party is sickening and criminal. I hear Nadler and Schiff refusing to believe Mueller's report, talking of a DOJ cover up and that they'll continue to investigate into Mueller's report because they know without a doubt there was collusion. Yet they were dead silent about all the corruption with HRC, Obama, Comey, Rice, Page, Strzok, Podesta, Wasserman, Awan....and the list goes on and on....... They couldn't define or spell the word transparency if their life depended on it.

The deceit and flat-out lies from these people is incomprehensible. How can any true American support the DNC anymore? Is this the government some of you want? Their crimes and corruption make anything Trump has ever done look like child's play and I say that with the upmost sincerity. I can deal with some of Trumps lil fibs but the depth of corruption from the DNC is some scary stuff. These people are literally an enemy of this country and how people cannot see this and continue supporting them is baffling. They don't hide their blatant hypocrisy, matter of fact it appears to be highly encouraged.

originally posted by: mtnshredder
The level of hypocrisy in the Dem party is sickening and criminal. I hear Nadler and Schiff refusing to believe Mueller's report, talking of a DOJ cover up and that they'll continue to investigate into Mueller's report because they know without a doubt there was collusion. Yet they were dead silent about all the corruption with HRC, Obama, Comey, Rice, Page, Strzok, Podesta, Wasserman, Awan....and the list goes on and on....... They couldn't define or spell the word transparency if their life depended on it.

The deceit and flat-out lies from these people is incomprehensible. How can any true American support the DNC anymore? Is this the government some of you want? Their crimes and corruption make anything Trump has ever done look like child's play and I say that with the upmost sincerity. I can deal with some of Trumps lil fibs but the depth of corruption from the DNC is some scary stuff. These people are literally an enemy of this country and how people cannot see this and continue supporting them is baffling. They don't hide their blatant hypocrisy, matter of fact it appears to be highly encouraged.

I get the real sense that what IS transparent is the hypocrisy you speak of. The voting public are seeing it play out in front of their eyes.
Trump really has drawn these swamp creatures into the light for all to see.

originally posted by: olaru12

originally posted by: Grambler

originally posted by: olaru12
If there is nothing to hide by the trump WH, they should welcome complete transparency. Show the taxpayers that it's all just a big "nothing burger".....

And so by that logic all of the dems and fbi that fought against transparency with things like the FIsa warrant against page and many other documents must have had something to hide.

All findings should be released. Total transparency with no favoritism shown to either party. I would think if the Mueller report shows a clean WH, it would insure a trump reelection and a clear path for his investigation into dembs criminality. Why the resistance by the GOP.

What resistance?

Trump said he wants it released, so do I.

Some are saying there will have to be redactions, I hope they are limited, but that is normal.

Those saying they dont want it released are wrong.

Now i assume that you feel all of the FBI and dems that still to this day fight to not release material into the FBI inevstigation must be hidning something.

Were you as vocal during those times about how they were hiding something?

I have called for transparency in all situations

Mr. stapled-stomach NADLER just said that the Mueller Report is a "cover-up" and he'll keep investigating the President because only Congress can impeach him.

A-Hole on Steroids: www.foxnews.com...