Democrats Green New Deal + Medicare 4 All - Cost 93 TRILLION Dollars. Its Not About Cost Though.

originally posted by: Boadicea
a reply to: carewemust

The entire problem with healthcare is that the system is designed for maximum control and profit... not our health. Sure, they want to keep us alive so that they can keep gouging us

The cabal of billionaires gouging us is paying huge sums of money to lobbyist making sure no law is passed breaking up the monopolies and cartels. This is the American way. This is what politicians mean when they talk about "Freedom". Freedom to screw the American people.



"It's a big club, and you and I are not in it! It's the same club they beat us over the head all day telling us what to think."

a reply to: dfnj2015

USA's population is almost 4 times Germany's population

a reply to: dfnj2015

The cabal of billionaires gouging us is paying huge sums of money to lobbyist making sure no law is passed breaking up the monopolies and cartels. This is the American way. This is what politicians mean when they talk about "Freedom". Freedom to screw the American people.

That's exactly what it is. And we see it every day in the crap slammiches they give us under the guise of "policy" and "reform"... we've got the left's crap on one side and the right's crap on the other side and they slap it together and slam it down our throats. Crap slammiches.

a reply to: Boadicea

The entire problem with healthcare is that the system is designed for maximum control and profit

No it's not.

The entire problem is because of left wing programs medicare/medicaid have taken 120+million people out of the game.

The largest single insurance provider is the STATE.

Which is not how a free market is suppose to operate.

Medicare 4 all is created to do one thing.

Kill off the competition completely.

a reply to: neo96

No it's not. The entire problem is because of left wing programs medicare/medicaid have taken 120+million people out of the game.

Um... uh... gee... how did they do that except by exercising POWER AND CONTROL OVER THE FREAKING SYSTEM??? I don't give a damn if they had/have an "R" or a "D" by their name... and I don't believe for a minute that the critters aren't playing "good cop bad cop" for the desired public show. They are ALL part and parcel of the problem, and every damn one is complicit either by commission or by omission.

The largest single insurance provider is the STATE. Which is not how a free market is suppose to operate. Medicare 4 all is created to do one thing. Kill off the competition completely.

Competition is competition... a public option is also competition for a private option. Private insurers would have to offer a better product for their bucks. They would actually have to offer and provide a real value to their clients, over and above the available public option -- not whatever crap they can get away with.

It's no different than schools or a gazillion other things. Private schools have managed to thrive and flourish right alongside public schools. There is still a place for private security companies and bodyguards right alongside public police and sheriffs. It's about offering a better product or service. That's also a HUGE part of competition and the free market.

a reply to: Boadicea

Um... uh... gee... how did they do that except by exercising POWER AND CONTROL OVER THE FREAKING SYSTEM???

By electing people to REGULATE it.

Big bad insurance companies do not have the kind of power your making it out to be.

The STATE is the alpha and Omega.

a reply to: neo96

Oh dear... I really hope you're just playing dumb...

By electing people to REGULATE it.

And regulations are power and control!!!

Big bad insurance companies do not have the kind of power your making it out to be. The STATE is the alpha and Omega.

And the state is bought and paid for by the corporations!!! Sheesh!

From Insurance Business Mag: The insurance industry is spending millions in politics – but where is it going?

As Americans come to terms with their likely presidential candidates for the 2016 election cycle, the insurance industry is on track to outstrip the record $58.7 million it spent on federal parties and candidates during the 2012 season.

Comprised of health, life, property and auto insurance companies, agents and brokers, the industry is a major contributor to federal campaigns. In 2013, it spent more than $154 million on federal lobbying efforts, including on flood insurance, terrorism risk insurance, data security and various tenets of the 2010 Affordable Care Act.

Here's How Much Money Every Senator Received From Health-Insurance Companies in the Last Election Cycle

On average, senators who don't support Bernie Sanders' single-payer plan received more money from insurance companies.

It's very difficult to track all the ways a company can donate to a political candidate. MapLight analysts sought to identify donations from companies, company employees, and relevant political action committees, but they may have missed some major contributions. "The money is more than likely grossly undercounted," says Paul Jorgensen, a political scientist who studies campaign finance at the University of Texas–Rio Grande Valley and is not involved with MapLight. "What it may not account for are the other committees that those sitting senators will be a part of that receive cash. The committee system in Congress is very complicated and the flow of money is very complicated. Just looking at the primary campaign committee is not sufficient for looking at an aggregate of campaign donations." Candidates may receive support from super political action committees, or super PACs, run by their party leadership, for example, which wouldn't show up in the data MapLight uses, which is drawn from the Center for Responsive Politics.

a reply to: carewemust

The US is $22 trillion in debt. Yet we carry $200 trillion in assets on the books . So technically we’re in the black .

Using those assets as collateral or selling them outright is unrealistic and impossible. Anyone with a brain can recognize that .

“ Brain “

I certainly hope AOC never finds out .

www.forbes.com...

You guys are hilarious.

It will not cost nearly that amount.

They would be basing it off the European standards whereas your healthcare costs per person come out to around $20-$40 per month (Or around $500 a year) in additional taxes. The tax rates for he lower and middle class would remain mostly unchanged (outside of that cost prescribed above). Corporate and taxes on those who make 10+ million would drastically increase.

The FUD in here when it comes to liberal policies is ridiculous.

Why are conservatives always against everything that is a positive for the masses? Dont conservatives believe in community?

My question to conservatives is...

When Universal Healthcare in the US is brought up... why automatically say NO, NO WAY, WE DONT WANT IT, NO MORE TAXES, ETC.. when everyone having healthcare is a GOOD thing?

Why cant conservatives say, okay how CAN we make this work and give everyone healthcare efficiently? Lets work together to find a way to do it that is fiscally responsible and provides for everyone.. doesnt that sound good?

Instead of coming up with reasons for "NO", how about you come up with new ideas for YES

Everyone here knows that Medicare is not generally free, right? Everyone here also knows that Medicare is run mainly by for profit companies? The purpose of a single payer health care system is that having everyone in one group lowers the average cost of care per person. Americans would still be required to fork over the actual cost of their medicare benefits and for profit providers would still be responsible for administering the care.

originally posted by: Dr UAE
a reply to: dfnj2015

USA's population is almost 4 times Germany's population

Are you math illiterate or something. You should study the concept of "percentage".

originally posted by: dfnj2015
a reply to: carewemust

Obviously, the healthcare cartels and monopolies will need to be broken up.

I read some article where some $3000 procedure outside the United States cost the healthcare provider $65000 in the United States. This is making the Pentagon purchasing corruption of the 80s and 90s look like chump change.

The US government should setup a system where we get hospitals in other countries to fulfill healthcare services. My healthcare premium cost more than my mortgage per month. The Americans would save trillions through competition.

a reply to: generik

Alchemy at it's finest, these big prices and the alchemists actually giving people treatments that formed addictions is why our ancestors would periodically go wild and kill off the alchemists and witches. Alchemists were also called warlocks in some places. The thing is that often good witches, herbalists that were trying to help people, were also killed off by the mobs.

Hell no.

Our taxes are already anywhere from 5000% to 25000% too high.

We need significant reduction, even staying what they are now is out of control. Any raises on any person or group whatsoever is simply out of the question and not up for discussion

a reply to: Lucidparadox

When Universal Healthcare in the US is brought up... why automatically say NO, NO WAY, WE DONT WANT IT, NO MORE TAXES, ETC.. when everyone having healthcare is a GOOD thing?

Because the way you go about it is unacceptable. Voluntary association with our fellow citizens and government, along with the right to remain free from government interference is a hallmark of American culture.

We don't want the healthcare because we are already taxed to death. And no, in my person opinion, every body having healthcare is not a positive thing. Many folks do not need healthcare. This "run to the Dr. for every runny nose and muscle ache" BS is why we have so many super-bugs and sissies these days.

The simple fact is this: take responsibility for YOUR OWN healthcare, success, survival, etc. Whether ABC person is responsible/capable enough to provide for themselves is not my problem.

And most of all it is this: healthcare is not a Constitutional right. Further, nobody knows how to spend my money better than me.

my suggestion to those without healthcare? Instead of buying the latest IPhone every time one comes out, shopping 24/7 on the Internet or going out at all hours of the day... work hard, save money, live responsibly. THAT is conservatism.

Whether or not an individual has healthcare or not is their problem, not mine. And the government is not going to tell me I have to spend a dime just to make sure some low-life is provided for. I despise ~40% of this population and regret sharing the same air with them - you really think I want to pony up money for them to run to the ER over every boo boo? Not a chance.

My answer: "Deal with it yourself" We're individuals - not a community - who voluntarily associate with one another when it is mutually beneficial. How does providing every Tom, Dick and Harry with health insurance (no doubt covering things I completely oppose, such as abortion) help me in the least? It doesn't.

a reply to: JBurns

That’s because you fail to understand the basics of societal cooperation. Having a single payer system actually does benefit you. Because it breaks up the price fixing cartels, and drives the prices down for everyone. So you would actually wind up paying less for yourself, for a better product. This is similar to how Walmart or amazon is able to be massively profitable while offering cheaper prices.

a reply to: JBurns

You are, all of us are, in fact, only a single serious accident or illness away from bankruptcy for yourself and your family. And that accident or illness is absolutely coming for you one day. In your old age or hospice the hospitals can extract almost every last penny or asset you’ve accrued over your whole life and leave your family with debt. Want to talk about inheritance tax? Geriatric care is the 100% inheritance tax for the working class. Single payer would end that.

I hear people whining because the government didn't take enough out of their paychecks, so their refund is smaller.

Imagine how they'll moan when the Green New Deal/Medicare-for-all taxes kick-in. 30% more in taxes deducted and 0$ refunds.

a reply to: carewemust

The administration indeed may have finished their audit, but they only were looking at foreign 'hacking'.

That did not really address local election poll and ballot counting voter fraud.

An independent watchdog said that the Dept. of Homeland Security didn't do enough, regardless.

Link:

techcrunch.com...

There is so much fraud in the medical field, it seems impossible to even imagine where to begin the cleanup.

One of the simple things we could do that would start reform, would be to require that all medical establishments produce a price menu of all services. Simple. Shouldn't cost much. Just throw it up on a website.

The only stickler would be that establishments would need to adhere to their published prices.

You know the entire structure is a fraud if simple clarity would cause huge headaches.



"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act."