Do you think we are alone in the Milky Way?

a reply to: Blue Shift

There is life on Earth, on Mars, and some of the space in between.

We aren't really a self contained unit here.

If you count micro organisms, we spill a bit here and there.

originally posted by: rigel4
its a mathematical certainty ...
that we are NOT alone.

A good scientist would say there "almost surely" or "almost certainly" is life elsewhere. Technically since we have never found life elsewhere, there is a non-zero chance that we are the only ones. Non-zero chance means it is not a mathematical certainty.

Granted, I personally feel that non-zero chance is pretty low -- I'd say virtually non-existent. But until we find real proof of life elsewhere, that chance still exists in science, no matter how low it is.

And even then when science finds proof of other life, that might not tell them anything about the chance of other technological civilizations, which is what this thread is about -- not simply "other life", but "other civilizations".

Civilizations might be a very rare thing, and maybe only a few exist at the moment in our galaxy, which might be the reason we haven't come into contact with any.

Good thread, but again, lots of comments but very few which define the question.

What is 'are we alone'? If you're on an island on the other side of the Earth and there is one other person, also on an island 12,000 miles away (other side of the Earth), and no way to get from their location to the other are they each 'Alone'?

I would say they were for all practical purposes 'Alone' on the Earth.

What if the other island just has one bacteria (single-celled organism). Is that 'Alone'? Sure it is. Unless the 'other' is like "us" it isn't part of the question.

What if there is one non-spacefaring civilization on the other side of the Universe, 92 billion light years away. Are we alone? What if they can fly around in their solar system. We're still 'alone'.

So you have to define 'are we alone' to mean:

Are there any other sentient races who we could 'understand' and communicate with who are space-faring and could come here, NOW, and are they motivated to do so.

If all of those conditions are not met, IOW, if they can visit but they are tiny microbe-sized creatures, then we are for all practical purposes 'alone'.

If they existed in the teeming billions but they're NOW all dead, then guess what? We're alone.

Vast size does not mean prevalence.

Vast size and prevalence does not mean 'intelligence' is common.

Intelligence could be SO DIFFERENT that we can not communicate (such as a hive mine) that it without common ground we are effectively alone.

So please, define your terms and say what you are really hoping is true, and that is that human-like or human-compatible sentient creatures who want to come here, can do so and are alive during the current time. Otherwise it's not a meaningful question.

nvm

Are we unique in the Galaxy.... Certainly Not !

my short answer is that every life form which ever existed here-on-Earth is Guaranteed to be present/or became extinct on some 'Home World'-of-their-Own... Somewhere & Sometime in the Milky Way Galaxy

But the likelihood of really exotic beings, that have no physical bodies, is -> in my mind -> very Iffy

a reply to: alfa015

Do you think we are alone in the Milky Way?

YES...undoubtedly!

originally posted by: Flyingclaydisk
a reply to: alfa015

Do you think we are alone in the Milky Way?

YES...undoubtedly!

What optimism.

originally posted by: Nickn3
I don’t even think we are alone on Earth.

Were not!

Going off the example of one, I would say the same forces which propel a civilization into an advanced technological state, are also the forces that can propel it into trouble.

It is very possible to colonize space without FTL travel, all it takes is time.

The first thing that should be easy to answer is can we travel vast distances in a reasonable amount of time.

the answer now is YES. Our own science has now advanced that it isnt science fiction, but rational science theory of FTL travel.
we now can quantify and attempt to achieve things like space folding, worm holes, ect where that wasnt even theoretical before.

Now you may be asking why did I lead off with this.

well because for us to either find or communicate with other beings we need to have some very advanced science.

Like above FTL travel, ability to function in space, live it space, land and live on other worlds, ect.

In most simple terms we as a species need to GROW UP.

If we want to find and communicate with other world beings we need at least a knowlege level that they would understand or find interest in.

Otherwise we are in a practical nature no more worth communicating with that we are with the animals of our planet.

Yes I know I may be going off topic but enterain me one more idea.

maybe using us with animals as an example the "aliens" view us as animals to be studied,
think about it

we drug, experiment, tag, and even put tech on other animals (pick one) that would be as frightening and alien to them .

that would then match the abduction, "implants" , ect claimed by a growing amount of people that claim this happened to them by aliens.

I could go on but I hope this opens up a few minds along with some much needed discussion on compare / contrast of us viewing "lesser" life.


Scrounger

originally posted by: scrounger
the answer now is YES. Our own science has now advanced that it isnt science fiction, but rational science theory of FTL travel.
we now can quantify and attempt to achieve things like space folding, worm holes, ect where that wasnt even theoretical before.

Nonsense. There is no "rational science theory of FTL travel".

originally posted by: kelbtalfenek
a reply to: alfa015

Civilisations? Probably there's a bunch of them in our galaxy.

Other than that I'm sure there are tons of planets and planetoids with microbial life forms.

I'm not really sure we should be actively seeking interaction with other civilisations. We haven't even sussed out our own differences enough to stop killing each other and work together. Maybe we should figure that out first? Just a thought.

Wow, what a mature perspective. Can't argue much with that.

On second thought though, just imagine what that would do to us collectively to have the realization we are being watched by others who have at least some understanding of what we are "up to" so to speak... it could be what we need.

Or it could be the last thing we need. I guess it all depends on the civilization we make contact with...

originally posted by: moebius

originally posted by: scrounger
the answer now is YES. Our own science has now advanced that it isnt science fiction, but rational science theory of FTL travel.
we now can quantify and attempt to achieve things like space folding, worm holes, ect where that wasnt even theoretical before.

Nonsense. There is no "rational science theory of FTL travel".

Um this was given in .021 sec google search

www.space.com...

That was just ONE REPUTABLE article of many.

how would you like your crow

bbq, sautéed or in a humble pie?




Scrounger

a reply to: JourneymanWelder

I agree! There is indeed an exoplanet like that, 55 Cancri e

We have the visible spectrum -- light wavelengths from violet to red -- is the light that typical humans can see. But many animals, such as birds, bees, and certain fish, perceive ultraviolet (beyond violet). And they see a totally different world. There are group of people who live on this planet who posses the abilty to see beyond Ultraviolet.There is not many of them 8 people in total who can see Another layer of light ontop of Ultraviolet and the spectrum of what the human eye can see.A very different type of family with an ability that allows them to see and interact with other forms of life that exist and co-habit this planet...It's a world where " a creator gods,ANgels and Demons" exist.There is some truth in those old tales about the tuatha de danann. We are not alone on this planet never mind the Universe, the problem is you cant see it. I will leave it up to you to believe me or not
In the meantime here is a great sound system tune about the sun
www.youtube.com...

originally posted by: moebius

originally posted by: scrounger
the answer now is YES. Our own science has now advanced that it isnt science fiction, but rational science theory of FTL travel.
we now can quantify and attempt to achieve things like space folding, worm holes, ect where that wasnt even theoretical before.

Nonsense. There is no "rational science theory of FTL travel".

It's rational enough for me to assume that the otherworlders who occasionally visit our planet, have broken the speed of light barrier with their fantastical flying machines; just by the fact of there very presence.

And since I don't believe in the feasibility of warp drive or wormhole travel. The only viable and reasonable method of propulsion for these interstellar travelers...would be an infinite fuel source that can provide constant acceleration; such as a photon engine of the micro-mini black hole variety.

Cheers...

Erno

originally posted by: DoctorX11
Well done on the video. Always appreciate people going the extra step to share and explain their input.

Does the number matter? I mean realistically there just aren't enough variables in those equations to get an actual number, and if so... how does it affect us?

It seems to me that even humans aren't as advanced as they once were. There have been millions of years for advanced civilizations to rise and fall and disappear without off planet species even realizing.

Since we're all here projecting personal opinions; we've probably been visited many times, most shooting stars are probably ETVs, and there are more than likely off-planet species here on earth at this very moment. Totally agree with whoever pointed out humanity wouldn't exactly be a species to do well in an intergalactic community considering we still haven't gotten over our own ego's and pick fights with anyone different from us.


PS, there's lots of information about secret space branches of the military out there, highly recommend giving it a read. It's a fun trip at the very least. Quite possible we've already established relations with other species in space through high class operations well beyond public knowledge. Just saying.

Thanks a lot!

I agree with you.

I hope some advanced alien civilization moved to another exoplanet once its planet died. Or maybe that civilization is right now travelling through space in an interstellar generational ship powered by an infinite source of energy.

originally posted by: VoiceOfTheEmperor
a reply to: alfa015

No, I think it would be extraordinarily unlikely that we are alone. Enrico Fermi considered the seeming contradiction between the high probability of extraterrestrial life yet the lack of evidence and contact in his famous "Fermi's Paradox".

Here are a couple of fun and interesting videos by "Kurzgesagt – In a Nutshell" that explore possible solutions to the paradox.

I also think it's important to consider that we've only been able to detect and emit radio waves and other electromagnetic emissions in the last couple hundred years. The universe has been operating on a time-scale of billions of years, something we can't even really comprehend. It might just be that contact takes a little bit longer than we'd all like.

Those videos are awesome, thanks!

a reply to: alfa015

Yes. But here's another question. Science shows the milky way as billions of galaxies rotating around a huge star that is bigger and brighter than 1,000,000 of the other galaxies... Why can't we see the bright center of the milky way galaxy from earth?

At the centre of all major galaxies is a black hole, not a live giant star. There are usually several million stars orbiting the black hole though, which may look like one giant star to the casual observer.

Edited to add; you can indeed see the Milky Way from Earth. I’m not sure why you think you can’t...