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Beyond Bigelow & BAASS, After AATIP and on To the Stars...

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posted on Mar, 5 2020 @ 11:38 AM
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a reply to: Outrageo


TGIF, eh?


No, its Thursday😉.





posted on Mar, 5 2020 @ 12:49 PM
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The creation of TTSA had a mythology embedded into its origin: TDL going to some Skunkworks affair and hitching up with one of their big shots. Consequently, he went around to mysterious meetings with mysterious IC people to set-up some kind of organization to we all thought expose ("we saw a life form") some truths about UFO's...."

That didn’t occur, only the creation of TTSA. Which has been exposed here, and exposed by their actions, as having nothing to do with exposing UFO secrets.


I contend we have no proof of the legitimacy of the TDL mythology, only his word which isn’t reliable.


I contend that this is a Psyop IC sponsored disinformation program and that not only is the TDL mythology very suspect but also the mythology surrounding Zondo, and his supposed resigning with an attitude, is also suspect, as been proven here.

This is indicated as true by the strange statements from the Military that on one hand, at one point they said, sure Zondo is an ATTIP guy and sure, Zondo studied UAPs.


Then, later, they announced through a Ms. Gough, NO, Zondo was NOT studying any UFOs, NO, ATTIP was not about UAPs.

Oh, really…


What is the truth?


We’ll NEVER get from them. You don't get the truth from liars!



So, the creation of these little mythologies: TDLs and Zondos, went perfectly along with the 2017 massive publicity about TTSAs beginning. Everything so perfect, so in line but the consequent output of this organization.

This in itself, the mythologies along with the perfectly timed publicity, and the members of TTSA and their backgrounds, is in itself proof of a government disinformation operation.


edit on 5-3-2020 by Willtell because: (no reason given)

edit on 5-3-2020 by Willtell because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 5 2020 @ 12:56 PM
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a reply to: Willtell

Very well put Willtell



posted on Mar, 5 2020 @ 01:24 PM
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originally posted by: Willtell
This in itself, the mythologies along with the perfectly timed publicity, and the members of TTSA and their backgrounds, is in itself proof of a government disinformation operation.


I second Karl's praise, Will.




A giant disinfo campaign that extends back to 1989 and Bigelow's first liaisons with the newly minted Mr Lazar, leading to thirty-one years of manipulation; distortion; the personal hoovering-up of UFO information; the recruitment of an ageing hipster filmmaker to reinforce extant myths such as S-4 and Skinwalker Ranch; the discomforting exploitation of a respectable Las Vegas journalist; and ending with the 2017 formation of TTSA as the rancid cherry on a rather indigestible cake - all pumped up by strange new characters in the field such as the Young Guns' go-to non-physicist hero Deep Prasad.

Whatever the hell is going on, 'real' UFOs have very little to with it.


edit on 5-3-2020 by ConfusedBrit because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 5 2020 @ 03:01 PM
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a reply to: ConfusedBrit

The real study of anything genuinely anomalous, that doesnt have a prosaic explanation, is the biggest loser in all of this.

If there wasn't any true scientific interest in the topic to start with, involvement by groups like TTSA and the usual suspects associated with, may well have put the final nail in the Ufological coffin of the hope of that ever occurring.

Remember folks, just because someone who is interested in the subject or involved already that has a PhD or other letters after their name; doesn't make them smarter than anyone else. Nutty people can get PhDs and as evidenced by those already in ufology, having those credentials usually means they are even more nutty than the average Joe.



posted on Mar, 5 2020 @ 03:28 PM
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Thanks for the kind words folks.

But they're going to win, unfortunately. Because the new folks are too uninformed

Many of us, unlike the new guys, are old-timers, not necessarily old, but we’ve been marinated in the information, you know like a good brisket overnight marinated in barbeque sauce.

We can’t be fooled or deceived by this weak disinformation scheme.

So, the people who don't research and only know this stuff superficially and the raw researchers are enough to get them over.

The raw researchers, some of these journalists I've read here are just too new to the information. One has to go back and study the history( let it settle in you) to really be qualified to get a handle on what is really going on. Unfortunately, many qualified journalists and ufologists who can tell the truth have sold out.

edit on 5-3-2020 by Willtell because: (no reason given)

edit on 5-3-2020 by Willtell because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 5 2020 @ 04:15 PM
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originally posted by: Kahana1
#5) they are stealthy.

Hahahhahahah. That one really lol’s me. Hilarious indeed considering TTSA selling itself as scientists just following the data and not full of the obvious bias they are obviously full of.

If one were an actual scientist without bias on this subject, the singular, stand alone, most entirely significant data point is the only data point widely scientifically accepted and known.

#1) there is no scientifically verifiable physical proof of alien (from future, multidimensional, etc.) ufos in all of human history!

The science STARTS RIGHT THERE...at the most significant verifiable #1 data point. Not in barney and betty hill describing an unknown event in their lives. Not from anything a pilot says he saw. Both of those events can only be verified as part of the human perception/psyche. Shamans also have perception and psyches. Science doesnt say their visions are “stealthy”.

This #1 is a pretty significant data point no scientist could possibly overlook. And what is TTSA’s version of that widely accepted #1 scientific fact...in TTSA’s own words, that “UFOs are stealthy”. Not that there is “no physical proof”...just that UFOs are so, so super excellent at hide and seek throughout all of human history that they never even lost a boot or a screw. That is unbiased science in TTSA’s book? Skipping that fact?

there is no scientifically verifiable physical proof of alien/etc. craft... A photo or account of a light is no verifiable proof. Ghost radar is not repeatable proof. What is scientifically repeatable is that there is no physical proof anywhere in all known human history. That is the #1 data point from which theory and hypothesis must be drawn. Not an assumed “stealth”, which implies alien motives, which only proves bias is TTSA’s core narrative.


UFO's are stealthy. That's why they are called UFOs. Unidentified kinda gives it away.



posted on Mar, 5 2020 @ 04:48 PM
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originally posted by: Willtell
The creation of TTSA had a mythology embedded into its origin: TDL going to some Skunkworks affair and hitching up with one of their big shots. Consequently, he went around to mysterious meetings with mysterious IC people to set-up some kind of organization to we all thought expose ("we saw a life form") some truths about UFO's...."

That didn’t occur, only the creation of TTSA. Which has been exposed here, and exposed by their actions, as having nothing to do with exposing UFO secrets.


I contend we have no proof of the legitimacy of the TDL mythology, only his word which isn’t reliable.

I contend whatever was in the works and supposed to come to light, ran face first in to a wall when the presidential campaign Podesta was the chairman of, lost the election.



posted on Mar, 5 2020 @ 09:58 PM
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I think the worst thing with TTSA is that they don’t do anything. They wrote a couple of books and released an old passed around video of some opaque craft and brought some rocks for 35 grand. The documentary on History cost nothing to produce. No CGI, no art direction, nothing in the documentary. It cost zero to produce because it was nothing in it! That’s why they let it back on!

What are the results of the test of the 35 thousand dollar rocks?

Here an old story about the so-called metamaterials. Where are they? Where are the results of testing these things?




posted on Mar, 6 2020 @ 03:21 AM
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Talking of Metamaterials- this weirdly appeared in a google search that I've run a thousand times before.

epjam.edp-open.org...

Part of an interesting series of papers (see citations) which highlight how after coining the word "Metamaterial" and running invitation only events on the subject in '99 - the US govt. then suffered terminal Metamaterial memory loss - which ultimately resulted in them contracting R&D out to dudes who found bits of alien spaceships.

edit on 6-3-2020 by Jukiodone because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 6 2020 @ 01:22 PM
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I have questions about how reflective this game of shadows and mirrors is; specifically concerning ATS memes.

Also Vallee's papers are under lockdown for several years:
twitter.com...
edit on 12020f3101America/Chicago9 by 1ofthe9 because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 6 2020 @ 02:49 PM
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originally posted by: 1ofthe9

Also Vallee's papers are under lockdown for several years:
twitter.com...


My guess is because they will reveal how much of a woo-woo whack-a-doodle he really is---while he's still alive or alive enough to care.

And I say that with great respect for some of his work. But he definitely had seconds of the Kool-aid at more than one Esalen hot tub party.



posted on Mar, 6 2020 @ 04:52 PM
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a reply to: The GUT

That and being fooled more then once...



posted on Mar, 7 2020 @ 12:44 AM
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a reply to: The GUT

I feel like am in the twilight zone when I observe Twitter...

I see Donut man still holding that big bad donut in that mix😁.

What's this about hot tubs.







posted on Mar, 7 2020 @ 12:59 AM
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originally posted by: Sublant

originally posted by: Kahana1
#5) they are stealthy.

Hahahhahahah. That one really lol’s me. Hilarious indeed considering TTSA selling itself as scientists just following the data and not full of the obvious bias they are obviously full of.

If one were an actual scientist without bias on this subject, the singular, stand alone, most entirely significant data point is the only data point widely scientifically accepted and known.

#1) there is no scientifically verifiable physical proof of alien (from future, multidimensional, etc.) ufos in all of human history!

The science STARTS RIGHT THERE...at the most significant verifiable #1 data point. Not in barney and betty hill describing an unknown event in their lives. Not from anything a pilot says he saw. Both of those events can only be verified as part of the human perception/psyche. Shamans also have perception and psyches. Science doesnt say their visions are “stealthy”.

This #1 is a pretty significant data point no scientist could possibly overlook. And what is TTSA’s version of that widely accepted #1 scientific fact...in TTSA’s own words, that “UFOs are stealthy”. Not that there is “no physical proof”...just that UFOs are so, so super excellent at hide and seek throughout all of human history that they never even lost a boot or a screw. That is unbiased science in TTSA’s book? Skipping that fact?

there is no scientifically verifiable physical proof of alien/etc. craft... A photo or account of a light is no verifiable proof. Ghost radar is not repeatable proof. What is scientifically repeatable is that there is no physical proof anywhere in all known human history. That is the #1 data point from which theory and hypothesis must be drawn. Not an assumed “stealth”, which implies alien motives, which only proves bias is TTSA’s core narrative.


UFO's are stealthy. That's why they are called UFOs. Unidentified kinda gives it away.


You dont have to be a genius to determine that if there is now no accepted physical proof of alien/etc. UFOs, and there never has been any proof of any scientific evidence of physical nuts and bolts alien UFOs...but humans have been experiencing them (even as “alien”) throughout history...Then the data points to the obvious: ALIEN UFOs ARE PROBABLY NOT PHYSICAL, and are intimately connected to the human psyche. TTSA has no profit potential if that is the case. For contracts and fans They need UFOs to be physical and real or THEIR paradigm (both corporate and i believe personal-belief for many of them) crashes like a house of cards. Boo hoo. Non-physical is not stealthy, btw, but i know you have that need to believe, subby. *shrugs
edit on 7-3-2020 by Kahana1 because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 7 2020 @ 01:29 AM
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The relevant aspect of Bigelow/skinwalker stuff wasn’t what “the entertainment division” put out. That is just so much cover and revenue generating BS. The relevant point of all that skinwalker/mufon stuff is what Bigelow’s crew DID NOT put out to the public, and instead provided to the military who contracted them. The classified stuff. Since the classified stuff is the relevant stuff, then disinformation (the entertainment division) is unlikely the primary motive. TTSA fits that same bill.

Here’s the joke, and it really is on TTSA and their fanbase. Since there is no scientifically acceptable hard physical proof of alien/etc. UFOs in all known human history, and since, like ghosts, UFOs, nature spirits, bigfoot, etc. all have the same thing in common (no physical proof), yet all these things are supposedly photographed and have been experienced in the human psyche throughout human history...then TTSA is studying the equivalent of friggin GHOSTS or nature spirits. NO PHYSICAL!PROOF.

Yet TTSA NEEEEEEDS the UFOs to be physical and alien/etc. for legitimate fanbase media sales and to procure their classified military contracts. Not to mention, at least a few of TTSA’s boys are true beliebers. Ok, well, then we have Physicists and biologists and other high level scientists on TTSA’s team who are literally writing their “magnetic field space time warp BS” papers regarding their PROJECTED ASSUMPTIONS of physical nuts and bolts craft.

For me, since these UFOs exist on the human historical timeline and within the human experience/psyche along the same lines as GHOSTS AND NATURE SPIRITS i find it absolutely HILARIOUS that these scientists are writing their physical-craft theory papers about...essentially...ghosts. I mean, its kinda ludicrous to postulate how supposed nuts and bolts “ghosts” “propel themselves through space time” using human type tech...so covert! but thats what these guys are theorizing about. Nuts and bolts mechanical ghosts...and physics papers on thrust based on UFO flight assumptions. Honestly, “lol” is an understatement for a systems analyst looking at this.

Imo, TTSA has too little analytical capacity to have run this media/contracting scam as some totalitarian psy op. They just arent talented enough. Its hard not to take them at close to face value given that hard fact.


edit on 7-3-2020 by Kahana1 because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 7 2020 @ 02:13 AM
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I have enough data at this point to be comfortable with my analysis to a point where i will take a recess from the subject (of TTSA) for awhile (or forever...yawns). many thanks to the contributors here for all the data and humor shared! Many hands painted this picture.

One last thought. When it comes to UAP and TTSA’s entertainment division, it has become pretty clear that building an oblivious and worshipful fanbase for media/merchandise revenue is a core, stated TTSA goal. Rock bands have a similar fanbase. It can be truly lucrative and rock “stars” dont have to be scientists. In fact, in a truly Doty-style way, BECAUSE alien UFOs are unproven, absolutely ANYTHING can be claimed about aliens...as entertainment...legally. Purple mushroom men from zetahorse nebula abducted you, and you made $1,000,000 with book deals and movie rights? THAT IS LEGAL. Since Aliens are unproven you can legally say any damn thing you want about aliens, just like any other personal experience within your psyche. even if fools believe it was real, and even if it was only to play people as tools and make money... It IS legal. Because physical aliens dont exist as of yet according to science and the courts. So no, dont expect any grand (or tech classified) revelations from the entertainment division. They can and will (and already have) say anything they want for their rock star fanbase.

As far as meta-materials, the science division, lobbying congress and classified contracts? Do you notice TTSA’s scientists lay low? Once TTSA has that contract, the hidden science division will continue to be largely hidden and they will do their classified work. The public lobbying will likely decrease at that time. $22 million is a good payday. But if it classified it cannot be public entertainment. If the meta materials are valid alien aftifacts, it will be classified. If not, the metamaterials will appear in the history series as “likely artifacts”.

What did Bigelow/skinwalker make for Bigelow and our intrepid scientists? $22,000,000 to produce the classified study. How much did licensing the rights, and selling the media about skinwalker ranch gross from the audience, without releasing the classified info? Another $22,000,000? I wouldn’t be surprised. That, unsurprisingly fits the old CIA model of having a real business front which can produce significant cash flow, and classified activity behind the scenes, also taking care of business.

At this point I believe we have a group of true beliebers (TTSA crew and their sycophants) doing what they do... the rest is just follow the money. Ciao until next time.
edit on 7-3-2020 by Kahana1 because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 7 2020 @ 06:08 AM
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Not sure what folks think.



youtu.be...





posted on Mar, 7 2020 @ 08:45 AM
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originally posted by: Kahana1

originally posted by: Sublant

originally posted by: Kahana1
#5) they are stealthy.

Hahahhahahah. That one really lol’s me. Hilarious indeed considering TTSA selling itself as scientists just following the data and not full of the obvious bias they are obviously full of.

If one were an actual scientist without bias on this subject, the singular, stand alone, most entirely significant data point is the only data point widely scientifically accepted and known.

#1) there is no scientifically verifiable physical proof of alien (from future, multidimensional, etc.) ufos in all of human history!

The science STARTS RIGHT THERE...at the most significant verifiable #1 data point. Not in barney and betty hill describing an unknown event in their lives. Not from anything a pilot says he saw. Both of those events can only be verified as part of the human perception/psyche. Shamans also have perception and psyches. Science doesnt say their visions are “stealthy”.

This #1 is a pretty significant data point no scientist could possibly overlook. And what is TTSA’s version of that widely accepted #1 scientific fact...in TTSA’s own words, that “UFOs are stealthy”. Not that there is “no physical proof”...just that UFOs are so, so super excellent at hide and seek throughout all of human history that they never even lost a boot or a screw. That is unbiased science in TTSA’s book? Skipping that fact?

there is no scientifically verifiable physical proof of alien/etc. craft... A photo or account of a light is no verifiable proof. Ghost radar is not repeatable proof. What is scientifically repeatable is that there is no physical proof anywhere in all known human history. That is the #1 data point from which theory and hypothesis must be drawn. Not an assumed “stealth”, which implies alien motives, which only proves bias is TTSA’s core narrative.


UFO's are stealthy. That's why they are called UFOs. Unidentified kinda gives it away.


You dont have to be a genius to determine that if there is now no accepted physical proof of alien/etc. UFOs, and there never has been any proof of any scientific evidence of physical nuts and bolts alien UFOs...but humans have been experiencing them (even as “alien”) throughout history...Then the data points to the obvious: ALIEN UFOs ARE PROBABLY NOT PHYSICAL, and are intimately connected to the human psyche. TTSA has no profit potential if that is the case. For contracts and fans They need UFOs to be physical and real or THEIR paradigm (both corporate and i believe personal-belief for many of them) crashes like a house of cards. Boo hoo. Non-physical is not stealthy, btw, but i know you have that need to believe, subby. *shrugs


It was you who originally wrote both aliens and UFO as if they were interchangeable. They are not.

UFO phenomena is real, it is more than just lights in the sky and they are unidentified.



posted on Mar, 7 2020 @ 12:18 PM
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originally posted by: Baablacksheep
Not sure what folks think.

youtu.be...



A strangely docile interview, both participants looking bored as hell - causing me to almost fall asleep. Despite the extensive list of the Hoff's antecedents at the start, I could almost imagine Basil Fawlty whispering from the sidelines:


"Whatever you do, don't mention the Hubbard!"




originally posted by: Sublant

UFO phenomena is real, it is more than just lights in the sky and they are unidentified.


Well, that is pretty inarguable - even Project Blue Book's 27-year-old study left a 5% residue of unidentified lights. After all, nothing is ever just a "light in the sky" since every light must have a source. We all hope for a truly anomalous and glamorous source for the unidentified quota since we're all romantics on ATS to some extent.

We will just keep exposing scammers whilst waiting for the real proof... waiting... and waiting... just as the next generation will continue waiting... and waiting...

We deserve a bloody medal for patience, to be honest.



edit on 7-3-2020 by ConfusedBrit because: (no reason given)




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