Beyond Bigelow & BAASS, After AATIP and on To the Stars...

Here's what the mission statement of TTSA is

We are working to achieve our mission via an entertainment, science and aerospace consortium that engages with global citizens to investigate the outer edges of science and unconventional thinking in order to push human knowledge and ultimately, our collective capability forward.

So how does one investigate the outer edges of science and unconventional thinking? Sounds a bit new agey to me. A little bit cultish in fact. But I guess they've got a $cientologist on their board and they've built a cult following.

So what is this different conversation we are supposed to be having now? We seem to be stuck with the same old same old. TTSA do not operate like a bonafide responsible organisation.

Here I guess is what TTSA would list as their achievements

1. ■Getting the MSM to pay attention and publish rather sober pieces in December 2017 about UFOs
   
2. ■Putting the NImitz case 'and later Roosevelt UFO encounters out there to a wider audience
   
3. ■Releasing 3 Official Pentagon videos of UAPs
   
4. ■TTSA managed to get the Navy to change their policies for dealing with UFOs
   
5. ■Their TV Series was a massive success...
   
6. ■There is so much more to come....there always is more to come.
   

Now those people who support TTSA seem to ignore various issues that others see with this strangest of organisations and see that list as hugely impressive. They are easily pleased.

I think the biggest problem is the fact that TTSA create "illusions". We've gone over these things many times before.

■ Did they get the MSM to take UFOs seriously? We know Zondo (finally) spoke to Fravor in Dec 2017 to give some gravitas to the reporting. But I suspect that others were involved to ease that process through.

■ The Nimitz case is a genuine mystery as is the later Roosevelt case. Yet it seems strange that Zondo as supposed head of AATIP did not even speak to witnesses until after he'd left the Pentagon. The report on the Nimitz case has not been released via FOIA. It was 'leaked' by George Knapp with no details stating originator, nor recipient and was undated.

■ Similarly the 3 UFO videos were not released by the Pentagon according to their spokespeople. TTSA claimed they had a verifiable chain of custody for these videos. Again George Knapp 'leaked' a DD1910 form which was left unauthorised and not filled in correctly according to the requirements on the back.

■ We have no real proof TTSA encouraged the US Navy to 'clarify their process for reporting of UFOs. If the sequence in the TV series was anything to go by then why would you take Tom DeLonge along. He has no security clearances. So no one could talk to him about these policies. Or is he working for the government now?
■ TTSA supporters would claim the TV series was a success but all it did was reinvent the wheel by repeat anecdotal evidence (we've heard for 70+ years). Even Naval cases are nothing new. (checkout Operation Mainbrace) and hammer home the THREAT factor.

Another big red flag is the CIA operatives that occupy the TTSA team. One of whom, Hal Puthoff, has history of scamming ufology before in the part he played in the SERPO hoax.. Strange how he also features in the latest documents leaked regarding alien autopsies and

Of course there are many other issues like whether Elizondo even ran AATIP, what George Knapp has got himself tied into. Especially with the very obvious cast of characters assembled to push forward this agenda via social media. A sort of pyramid scheme where information has been cascaded downwards for them to feel important about and 'build up' before announcements.

These are all real issues that 'supporters seem to ignore and brush off as disinformation. Although I would add that the Pentagon have put out contradictory statements at times too and still not issued much via FOIA regarding AATIP and Elizondo.

The TV series is over with no real big announcement.

Prepare for yet another recycling of the same pattern. More books, more George Knapp promotional slots disguiesed as interviews, more TV shows with interviews with witnesses......And then Hal Puthoff blowing his head off in an accident with experiments involving Element 115 after a night out with Bob Lazar. And that really will have been "Unintended"

a reply to: mirageman

We are working to achieve our mission via an entertainment, science and aerospace consortium that engages with global citizens to investigate the outer edges of science and unconventional thinking in order to push human knowledge and ultimately, our collective capability forward.

The very concept of mixing entertainment with science just doesn’t sound to Kosher to me, it never did.

The two don’t really mix, IMO. The science can easily get polluted or corrupted by the entertainment, which, here, of course, is a replacement term for profit.


I guess there’s nothing wrong with science mixing with the profit motive the only thing is one has to do some real science first.

Indeed, entertainment can be produced form science, but I think science from entertainment and profit is very problematic.

a reply to: The GUT

Yes indeed GUT. A lot of things seem to begin in places like Esalen where the rich and powerful begin to believe in their own form of reality and often lose touch with everyone else's and quite often their own sanity.

.....Not long before Esalen was founded, one of its co-founders, Dick Price, had suffered a mental breakdown and been involuntarily committed to a private psychiatric hospital for a year. His new institute embraced the radical notion that psychosis and other mental illnesses were labels imposed by the straight world on eccentrics and visionaries, that they were primarily tools of coercion and control.

This was the big idea behind One Flew Over the Cuckoo’s Nest, of course. And within the psychiatric profession itself this idea had two influential proponents, who each published unorthodox manifestos at the beginning of the decade—R. D. Laing (The Divided Self) and Thomas Szasz (The Myth of Mental Illness). “Madness,” Laing wrote when Esalen was new, “is potentially liberation and renewal.” Esalen’s founders were big Laing fans, and the institute became a hotbed for the idea that insanity was just an alternative way of perceiving reality.

The Atlantic - How America Went Haywire

If TDL and Zondo aren’t the Laurel and Hardy, or Abbot and Costello of Ufology then there never will be any.

More and more this caper seems like some kind of joke to me. An empty vessel gone to sea without even a boat, just floating along the sea of mediocrity and… comedy.

That must be it, TDLs ufo entertainment complex. Maybe if they don’t get renewed for another season on the History channel, they can try the comedy channel.

a reply to: Willtell

The very concept of mixing entertainment with science just doesn’t sound to Kosher to me, it never did. The two don’t really mix, IMO. The science can easily get polluted or corrupted by the entertainment, which, here, of course, is a replacement term for profit.

I think that's already happened (science can easily get polluted or corrupted by the entertainment) and they're firmly in the realms of Science fiction not science fact.

The company’s Science Division is a theoretical and experimental laboratory that seeks to challenge conventional thinking and discover the next-generation of physics. We have access to world-renowned scientists with advanced knowledge to pursue the company’s research projects, which include quantum communication technology, the A.D.A.M. (Acquisition & Data Analysis of Materials) Research Project, and THE VAULT (formerly the Community of Interest).

So TTSA with all their issues, including considerable financial ones, are the ones to "discover the next-generation of physics" and "pursue...quantum communication technology". Not the top universities and research centers, but TTSA.

They're in the realms of sci-fi imo. If they were in any position to do any research of substance they would be getting grants from government and/or private institutions. Not looking to sell worthless shares to joe public.

I could be wrong (but i really don't think i am), but just in case, as i said in another thread, if they produce any tangible results from their science division;

i'll eat TDL's Atticus hat

a reply to: mirageman

Seemed appropriate, all things esalen anyway;

Not to be disagreeable, but I just don’t see a lot of any woo, sci-fi, or anything from TTSA but pedestrian, FAKE research, and investigatory low energy and low information output.

They don’t have a research arm, a qualified investigatory arm, a database, I mean they're not even faking it right.
These old tired men you look at them and you don’t see any energy, excitement, curiosity, nothing in them.
For example, look at them in comparison to the investigators on AA. All right we know those at AA are kind of out of it but they have real energy. Real interest in what they’re doing and saying. TTSA has no substance. TTSA seems to be a lethargic bunch of people going through the motions of being researchers. It seems fake to me.

Even Levenda’s book reads disingenuous.

That’s my impression.

Here are 2 more videos that recap the tdl timeline stuff,i may be wrong but nowhere it is mentioned that part about the metamaterials that ttsa? has.






part 2

originally posted by: mirageman
a reply to: 1point92AU

Plenty of very pertinent questions have been asked in this thread.

But who is going to answer them?

You're the poster who tried to make the argument a video game programmer who has never spent 1 second in the seat of a fighter jet was more qualified to identify fighter jet aircraft in flight from the cockpit of another fighter jet versus an actual 18 year 3,000 + hour fighter jet pilot veteran who has identified countless other fighter jets from the cockpit of an actual fighter jet.

You literally posed one of the stupidest arguments I've ever read on ATS. Where are these pertinent questions?

originally posted by: Baablacksheep
a reply to: 1point92AU

you guys aren't asking any of the right questions.

So in your opinion, what are the right questions then?

I've asked them multiple times.

Why after 50 years of the US government back paging UFO incidents now allowing every major mainstream news media outlet to broadcast during prime time TV slots about the phenomena?

Why after 50 years of the US government denying the existence of UFOs did the Pentagon allow ATIP to be exposed?

Why after 50 years of the US government denying the existence of UFOs did the US Navy come out with a mainstream media news release regarding a new system of reporting UAPs while serving in an active duty capacity?

Why did the US Navy make their patent for what essentially equates to the TR3B public information? This could have easily been kept secret yet was not.

Why after 50 years of the US government denying the existence of UFOs did they allow ACTIVE DUTY F18 fighter pilots who still serve in active combat zones flying $70 million fighter jets go onto a mainstream prime time show and state they along with an an estimated 60-100 other active duty fighter pilots having all witnessed the same UAP phenomena?

Why are active duty fighter pilots and retired veteran fighter pilots meeting with Congress in closed door meetings to discuss the UAP phenomena?

Lt. Graves and Lt. Accoin said it best. The fact that this phenomena acts with impunity and at will and the fact there has been no official investigation is baffling.

All of this has occurred in the past 2 years. After 50 years of complete denial and silence we all of a sudden hit light speed on this subject and yet no one wants to ascertain why?

a reply to: 1point92AU

After 50 years of complete denial and silence we all of a sudden hit light speed on this subject and yet no one wants to ascertain why?

Exactly. Why?

a reply to: pigsy2400

Will never look at a unicorn the same way again Pig's.

a reply to: 1point92AU

You're the poster who tried to make the argument a video game programmer who has never spent 1 second in the seat of a fighter jet was more qualified to identify fighter jet aircraft in flight from the cockpit of another fighter jet versus an actual 18 year 3,000 + hour fighter jet pilot veteran

I didn't say more qualified. I said;

....entirely feasible a computer programmer would know as much as pilots because these people often have to model real world events.

Appeals to authority are often a fall back position when no other evidence is forthcoming to support a position. Should pilots be the only ones consulted about things in the air. As we've seen J.Allen Hynek found military pilots were actually the least reliable observers in his studies.

But OK, you think Mick West is not qualified to talk about the subject and I am stupid. How dumb was Fravor for not turning his cameras on to acquire decent footage that shows more than IR heat signatures? Mick West's analysis is thorough and detailed and asks us to be the judge. Fravor meanwhile is certain what it wasn't. Hynek's survey said almost 9/10 times military pilots get it wrong.

We've had anecdotal evidence for years from pilots, astronauts and probably computer programmers. But so far the supporting evidence doesn't prove we are facing a threat from something not human.

So what else....

Where are these pertinent questions?

Throughout the thread both. If you missed them all then you will need to read it again.

Why after 50 years of the US government denying the existence of UFOs did the Pentagon allow ATIP [AATIP]to be exposed?

The US government have never denied UFOs exist. Projects Grudge, Sign, Blue Book were all UFO studies. JANAP 146 even detailed reporting procedures for UFOs. Blue Book was eventually closed not because the US Government decided UFOs did not exist but because there was no evidence they were the result of technology beyond our scientific knowledge or that they were extraterrestrial.

No one denied they existed.

Why after 50 years of the US government denying the existence of UFOs did the Pentagon allow ATIP [AATIP] to be exposed?

No one denied UFOS existed. But supposedly Luis Elizondo resigned in frustration after spending nearly a decade in charge of AATIP (which if you recall he's said was a success) was getting nowhere. He also said he'd never heard of TTSA or Tom DeLonge until he left the Pentagon. But once he did the Pentagon couldn't even confirm the correct nomenclature.

There are still no FOIA requests providing documentation on AATIP's operations and what reports came out. Nor has anyone from the Pentagon confirmed Elizondo was actually head of AATIP or even worked on such a project. So we should also be suspicious of their actions too!

Why did the US Navy make their patent for what essentially equates to the TR3B public information? This could have easily been kept secret yet was not.

You made your own thread about it here with differing views. Not sure how it relates back to TTSA directly?

Why are active duty fighter pilots and retired veteran fighter pilots meeting with Congress in closed door meetings to discuss the UAP phenomena?

Possibly to encourage further defence spending. But that would be speculation. No real details have been forthcoming other than they have occurred. Trump was incredibly, but not unusually, vague when asked directly.

All of this has occurred in the past 2 years. After 50 years of complete denial and silence we all of a sudden hit light speed on this subject and yet no one wants to ascertain why?

No one denied UFOs existed in the past. Although the appearance we are given is that the US Navy (no one else has been quoted) had a policy of ignoring anything that they can't identify in US air space before TTSA briefed them. If indeed they did brief them. It could all be co-ordinated coincidence.

This UFO excitement is not going on in the rest of the world. Yes there were reports in Dec 2017. But after that it's all been confined to the trash tabloids. It's very US centric and seemingly aimed at a core of people who watch UFO programming on minor networks.

But something is going on. I just don't trust TTSA (or the Pentagon) to deliver any real truth about UFOs.

I've been having a look at the long term goals of TTSA, here they are as listed and in the order they appear on their website

We are an organization driven by a relentless pursuit of knowledge and the profound possibilities our investigations, discoveries and innovations can have on society by drastically changing our future for the better. Our long-term goals are to:

1. Be a global influence in pop culture through creating exciting and unique entertainment experiences for all ages.

2. Have the capital requirements to acquire or finance our own content such as feature films so that we are able to retain equity and optimize downstream revenue.

3. Continue to increase our network of influence by engaging society, the USG and scientific community to get access to information we can mine for compelling stories and commercializable science and aerospace products.

4. Build upon the foundation that was built in our first two years of inception by continuing to educate the public and policy-makers about scientific phenomena through investigations that reveal credible, factual evidence without speculation.

5. Establish the company as the world leader in next-generation intelligence and best-in-class laboratory for advanced physics research.

6. Establish a formal working-relationship with the USG and other sovereign nations to advance our mission and specific programs.

7. Contribute to advancing human intelligence by collecting and triaging data, most notably by expanding The VAULT database.

8. Introduce a revolution in physics through Space-Time Metrics Engineering that would have the possibility of positively changing the current understanding of propulsion, communication, transportation and everyday life.

9. Significantly decrease the cost and environmental impact of orbit launches with its Beamed Energy Launch Systems.

10. Have a significant and positive impact on society by continuing to spread the spirit of curiosity and life-changing discovery.

I could say a lot on how i see each of these, but i'm just going to focus on number one in thelist.

So their first, primary, main long term goal is not to produce scientific advances or any form of "d", it's to entertain. They are in the realms of sci-fi....

Spanning film, television, books, music, art, and merchandise, fans find themselves immersed in exciting stories that inspire a new understanding and appreciation for the profound mysteries of our universe. With our unique access to both credible and incredible information by our team of experts, To The Stars is informed storytelling where the line between science and science fiction is blurred.

And perhaps they are right to focus primarily on this area. It is the only area where they can with fair certainty produce tangible results for the paying public and the investing public. Not saying it will be any good, but it will be something tangible.

Since this is their primary goal, all other goals would be secondary at best. It's no surprise to me these statements are worded this way and ordered this way. It is so at any point down the line they can say this was their aim all along and/or spin it which ever way they want or need to, depending on results in their other areas. If they produce nothing in the way of "d" or science RnD, they can say it was all for entertainment.

I wonder if Joe (or Jane) Public and those who have (or are looking to) invested see it. I think hey would be expecting a whole lot more from the guys. They will be disappointed....

a reply to: Diaspar

To reinforce that point you've made. They also said in their first SEC filing;

If the offering size were to be less than $5 million and above the $1 million minimum, TTS AAS would adjust its use of proceeds by reducing planned growth of employee headcount, reducing operational costs, and slowing down projects or not making investment in projects....

This is why they are registered as "Service Allied to Motion Picture Production". They must have known they would never achieve vast sums of funding even despite the lack of a team of financial and business advisors. So they can quite legitimately claim that their lack of funds means "not investing in projects" that go beyond the realms of entertainment.

So are they working dor/with the US Government (or elements of it) or is this something else?

If they are working with Government then why?

If it's something else then what exactly is the point of TTSA?

a reply to: mirageman

So are they working dor/with the US Government (or elements of it) or is this something else?
If they are working with Government then why?
If it's something else then what exactly is the point of TTSA?

I know you were asking in general, not to me specifically, but...

Short answer...i don't know.
I had a much longer answer typed out but it wouldn't have added anything new.
Truth is...i don't have a scooby at this point.



Far more digging required me thinks

Is NASA not a government affiliated private science/space programme, that also creates documentaries, sells clothing and books? It’s all intended to be the new NASA by the looks of it.

a reply to: 1point92AU

That paragraph reminds of that thing where you can make a sentence using the word "buffalo" eight times consecutively and it still makes a grammatically correct sentence.

The difficulty here is that the plural of buffalo is still buffalo, and there is no town called "fighter jet" that I am aware of.

But no to worry - let's have "fighter jet" as meaning an unnecessarily argumentative person, "fighter jet" as a location that said "fighter jet" occupies whilst arguing, and "fighter jets" as other argumentative people that only exist in the mind of the original fighter jet.

So we have:

Fighter jet fighter jets fighter jets fighter jet fighter jets fighter jets fighter jets fighter jet

I think I've got that right - feel free to correct me if I am wrong

originally posted by: mirageman
a reply to: 1point92AU

But something is going on. I just don't trust TTSA (or the Pentagon) to deliver any real truth about UFOs.

Forget TTSA and the Pentagon. That's the distraction.

Why does the US Navy not conduct an official interview of the 60+ active duty fighter pilots along with the 2 active duty fighter pilots on record who are reporting the aerial phenomena?

Graves and Accoin filed an official report and it was crickets from the US Navy.

during either the 5th or 6th episode of the navy pilot sightings show, they went to some island off the coast of Mexico....and I thought they might do some investigating.....yeah, they talked to some fisherman about lights coming up from the sea....so did they explore underwater?....no...they talked to people about seeing lights....the whole 6 part series could have been wrapped up in 2 parts...the last 4 were repeated claims, interviews, and of course, dramatic music and speculation....anything beyond that was shut down due to being classified.....huh?.....

and if the history channel shows 1 more clip of the "avro car", and relating that to UFO's....i'm gonna...ahh, ever mind