Homeschoolers Outraged at Iowa Bill That Treats Them All Like Criminals Mand HomeInspections

originally posted by: Witness2008
a reply to: riiver

The next generation should always be smarter than the last. Hasn't been that way for a long time. When our phones are smarter than we are, I'd say that we are in a bit of trouble.

Technology is a wonderful tool, but for too many it has become a crutch. I've run across too many people who think being able to look something up means they're smart. They don't understand the difference between looking a fact up and mastering it for themselves.

I work in publishing and a large part of my job is proofreading. One word I run across a lot is hors d'oeuvres. It's one word I never learned how to spell, and in the more than 10 years I've been on the job, it remains one of the most misspelled. But in all that time, I constantly look it up. I've never mastered it for myself. I would have to apply some effort to learn it, and clearly, just looking it up over and over isn't doing that.

You're going to see the same thing with people who just look stuff up on their phone. They aren't learning a thing.

originally posted by: ketsuko
a reply to: riiver

At least for gifted kids, there are programs that offer some hope of remedy in decent school systems. Ours is either 2E with learning disabilities that mask giftedness and he's not and never has been a super genius. He's at most in the 130 range if that. Or ours is in the 120s and super bright but not actually gifted enough for the program.

Either way, he picks up what he's supposed to learn very quickly and spends most of his day languishing with little outlet when he could still be learning because most of the rest of his class is still picking up what he already knows.

That's not a pleasant place to be for kids either, and tracking isn't really allowed these days. It might make some kids feel bad.

Exactly. It's tough for kids who actually want to learn, and the brighter they are the harder it is. Gifted programs are good but, in my area at least, they're only a one-day-per-week or even a half-day thing rather than a chance for kids to go more at their own pace. And you're right--for kids who are far above average but who miss the "gifted" label by a point or 3, school is absolutely the worst.

I had one gifted boy who taught himself to read so he could play text-heavy video games (like Zelda) and who was reading at 4th grade level before he finished kindergarten. I was told "you can't test kindergarteners for giftedness." His first grade teacher refused to recommend him for the gifted program (or to read books above first grade level in her class) and by the time first grade was over he was soured on school forever. I pulled him out of school two different times and homeschooled for a year, and he was never happier. He joined the National Guard in high school with an eye to paying for college, enrolled when he was 21, and quit in disgust after a semester...but is a voracious learner on his own time.

a reply to: ketsuko

They key to anatomy is having a good grasp of words, in my opinion. If you understand prefixes, suffixes, and roots (all that boring English stuff they drummed into our heads back when I was in school, along with how to diagram a sentence and other fun stuff my kids were never exposed to), then anatomical structures pretty much tell you what they are, what they do, and/or where they're located. Anatomy was one of the easiest classes I ever had, I agree

originally posted by: Witness2008
a reply to: riiver

The next generation should always be smarter than the last. Hasn't been that way for a long time. When our phones are smarter than we are, I'd say that we are in a bit of trouble.

About 10 years ago I was a cashier at a large fast food restaurant. One day our computer system hiccuped and the area where it showed how much change a person should get after paying was hidden by a big error message every time we rang up an order. We had a crew of about 12 in the store, and the only people who could make change without help from the computer were myself and one manager. Yep, most people are lost without their machines.

originally posted by: strongfp
a reply to: scrounger

Of course I brought a religious point of view into it because she was being taught a Christian curriculum from a private school system. You can spin this around all you want, but I just made a personal statement about my experience with someone who was home schooled, and her case probably isn't the only one.

Sigh AGAIN the test scores coming out of RELIGIOUS run schools EXCEED anything the PUBLIC schools put out.

In fact one of the most respected schools in the country if not the world is University of Notre Dame.
they are run by a RELIGIOUS SECT (catholics to be precise) and GASP also teach religious principles.

I could also give specific examples (much more than you I suspect) of kids in religious run schools getting a FAR SUPERIOR education with some religious teaching thrown in.

but be it home school, religious run school, or private secular run school they are as a whole FAR SUPERIOR to public schools and the TEST SCORES UNDENIABLY SHOW IT.

your rants clearly show you dont give two flips about qualilty of education if it is run by any religious sect.

you just want to bash (specifically by your own words) CHRISTIAN run home schools and the facts of quality be damned.

it isnt "triggered" but calling you out by YOUR OWN WORDS.

If you dont like being called a religious bigot then dont post as such.

because you have a right to hate christians. but not at expence of those recieving a superior education from them

scrounger

a reply to: scrounger

You're the one going off on a tangent here not me.

I never doubted home schooling didnt create good students in academics. Also, at post secondary levels no school would be teaching students that creationism is a fact or that great militry leader is predicted in the bible. If they do then it's most likely a school that just breeds ignorance. Notre dame doesnt have such a curriculum.

I'll say it again the historical, fallacy was in a Christian curriculum, the scientific falsehoods are in Christian curriculum. You cannot deny those facts.

Take it as either information to build upon or you can keep yelling at me about redundant test scores in what I was pointing out.

And please just stop putting words in my mouth and assuming. If you want an honest answer ask me. Dont tru to spin what I have written down as an attempt to smear Christian school systems.

a reply to: strongfp

AGAIN attacking a education program because its CHRISTIAN run.. it is you who keeps putting "christian" into your comments.

Creationism IS being taught at the "secondary" and even college level. It is now called "creative design".

You keep claiming that "christian" education is lacking .

Yet not only do you not provide EXACT EXAMPLES, but the test scores comming out of CHRISTIAN run schools EXCEEDS that of public schools

now unless your implying the tests scores are being falsified by those comming from christian run schools then the VERY FACTS OF SCORES disprove your whole rant that christan run programs are flawed.

but hey rant away...
the FACTS mock you

scrounger

a reply to: scrounger

If it was a Islamic school, I'd mention it was a Islamic curriculum, if it was a public school I would say it's public school.

In this instance it was a christian school, am I supposed to sugar coat this for you? Sorry those particular christian school systems don't know science and history very well.

Funny how this thread is riddled with "those damn liberal public schools are bad because LIBERALS!", yet someone dare mentions homseschooling, private schools, and religious run schools in a negative way, it's the end of the world.

Yea creative design... the amount of times they have changed the way creationism is presented astounds me. They just need to give up.

Also, U of Notre Dame isn't Christian, it's catholic. And you don't need to be catholic to attend it, just pay money or be good at sports.

And it's on the bottom rung of SAT scores for top university, out of like a list of 20. Wow look at them go! So prestigious. Surely Gods work.

originally posted by: strongfp
a reply to: scrounger

If it was a Islamic school, I'd mention it was a Islamic curriculum, if it was a public school I would say it's public school.

In this instance it was a christian school, am I supposed to sugar coat this for you? Sorry those particular christian school systems don't know science and history very well.

Funny how this thread is riddled with "those damn liberal public schools are bad because LIBERALS!", yet someone dare mentions homseschooling, private schools, and religious run schools in a negative way, it's the end of the world.

Yea creative design... the amount of times they have changed the way creationism is presented astounds me. They just need to give up.

Also, U of Notre Dame isn't Christian, it's catholic. And you don't need to be catholic to attend it, just pay money or be good at sports.

And it's on the bottom rung of SAT scores for top university, out of like a list of 20. Wow look at them go! So prestigious. Surely Gods work.

sigh

first nice attempt at deflection/moving the goal posts by trying to insert "islamic school".

It is an EPIC FAIL one due to up to this point all your rants about have been CHRISTIAN run schools.
to try to now claim "what if" shows a sad desperation at best.

Second no not anyone can go to Notre dame with money or sports.

If you had cared to do a basic google search before you spewed out ranting BS you would have discovered the following facts.

1. just to get though the first level of application you need a 4.0 average with straight A's and a very high sat or act score.

2. the acceptance rate out of every 100 applications (that survive the first round) is 18.9 percent.

3. last year only 3, 702 students were accepted out of 19,564 qualified applicants.

4 . they rant 18 out of ALL UNIVERSITIES in the US.

to put into perspecive (aka FACTS) there were 4, 140 colleges/universities as of 2016.

lastly and you keep IGNORING is that the test scores at all levels from charger, private , home, and RELIGIOUS (INCLUDING CHRISTIAN) run schools are FAR ABOVE PUBLIC SCHOOL

those tests include math, reading, literature, AND SCIENCE.

So again not only have I used FACTS to prove our just ranting against christian schools, the test scores (which are unbias) show your just ranting, but even when you try to present FACTS (like on notre dame) a simple google search a 8 year old can do show your just ranting against christians

but hey if your happy being an anti christian fool then who am I to stop you.

I will defend your right to rant on.

scrounger

a reply to: TheJesuit

The inspections can be summed up as are you democratic and/or liberal enough...

Is your education educating that socialism is the way? Or is it education personal responsibility...?

a reply to: scrounger

Well it's not an Islamic school system I was criticizing it's a Christian one, which seems to upset you. Do you want me to start criticizing Islamic school systems? I can, but then you'll just get upset that I am changing the subject at hand, or not which would make you a complete hypocrite.

Listen man. Bottom line is this. I made two observations:

1) A home schooled co-worker of mine was reading a history text book which went on about Alexander the Greats conquest.

Facts about it. Book of Daniel blabs on about current events which can be related to basically any sort of Kingdom at that time period, when Alexander visited Jerusalem they all crowed around him and boost his ego saying "wow look, this is about you! Now go amass a giant army and destroy the Persians for us". something along those lines.

The book of Daniel also went through many revisions, including at times when copies of the 'true' bible were bound to just a handful of libraries and holy places. It's historically inaccurate and not trustworthy.

Best TLDR but the general consensus is that the book is all up in the air, like 90% of the bibles past.

2) Did Christian fundamentalists attempt to push for what was known back then as "intelligent design" and I guess in today's world known as "creative - design" into the public school system? Yes they did.

AaronRa is a man who has been at the front lines of this battle for years now, and even got involved in politics to keep the fundamentalist crooks out of the schools.



Now look at at nearly 8 years later this subject has morphed into simply. THIS teachers can easily just tell students, well this is how science really works, but, there's this thing called creationism. And go off on a rant about some BS falsehoods about intelligent design and what not.

They are so desperate to get into the public school system in Texas. Why?

As for Notre Dame those acceptance rates are pretty typical. Harvard only had a 5.2% acceptance rate. Also you don't need a 4.0, they have academic standing programs you know. Because rich people do pay they're way in. Or students who are gifted in sports can prove themselves within' the first year. It says right on their website you need to maintain a 1.85, and then thereafter a 2.0.

a reply to: strongfp

Again, so long as a student passes entrance exams and other relevant testing and carries on a productive life in society, what business is it of yours what they learned and how?

You can look down on it all you want, but at the end of day, all that matters is that someone leads a productive, self-supporting life.

a reply to: ketsuko

And I don't disagree with that. I'm just defending my observations.

I argue tho. If a student is put into an education system that would impede of their future or cause some sort of disruption later in life, for example finally learning that what they were taught false science, or doubt in a scientific field, then get to a certain level of education and have difficulty at that level it would change their whole stance on the system, and career choices.

Students or young people shouldn't be funneled into certain fields of work or career paths, their strengths should be recognized and guided on the right path. But teaching nonsense and fallacies is wrong. The public school system for the most part is rather accurate, but it's a shame it's over burdened, miss funded, and understaffed. I went to catholic schools my whole life, privately funded, for the most part it was a good system. Far better than the public school system from what I have heard from my friends.

Although it did push me into becoming an atheist but that's another story.

I think this is completely wrong---Homeschoolers should be left alone

Julian Fernandes