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Originally posted by toms54
I have addressed all those points in this thread.
You might wish to reread my posts to Disraeli about the order of Melchizedek.
Originally posted by toms54
I believe this was the version of Christianity in Abraham's day.
Originally posted by toms54
I think people were saved then much the same as they are saved now.
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Originally posted by toms54
I believe they taught the same thing. I also believe Christ when he says he existed in the time of Abraham. We know Melchizedek was Abraham's priest so Abraham believed what Melchizedek believed and Abraham's children believed what Abraham believed.
Originally posted by toms54
I have answered all of those questions in the course of this thread. Seriously, every one.
I could ask you to reread the thread but you seem to have closed your mind somehow to what has been written here. Either that or you simply don't read my replies at all. I am not going to accuse you of bad faith so I prefer to believe the first sentence.
Why repeat myself over and over? If you were unable to understand the first times, how can I think you will understand it if I say it another 5 times?
Originally posted by toms54
I don't have a way to answer your question.
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Originally posted by toms54
I don't have a way to answer your question.
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Originally posted by toms54
However, that question has since been answered.
"You ask how can Christ save people if he is not yet crucified. I reply through faith because he is God."
Then I went on to say, "Salvation was available for the few but it was not available for the whole world until Jesus was actually born as the Christ."
But Christians today believe they are saved by believing that Jesus died for their sins...And they must also believe in Jesus Death and Resurrection to be saved…
So how could the people then (Prior to Christ) be saved…in the same way…as they are now…???
I don't have a way to answer your question. Perhaps I will think of something in the future but all I have now are examples from the Bible and Jesus's own words. If you can't believe that, I don't know what more I can say.
Originally posted by toms54
I have continued to reflect upon your ideas and now I absolutely believe some people attained salvation before the advent of Christ. Certainly the figures depicted in the transfiguration and possibly others. Since Jesus himself declared no one goes to heaven except through him, I feel compelled to conclude that Christianity has always existed and that Jesus interacted with humanity even before his birth.
Originally posted by toms54
There is much evidence for the existence of Christian concepts in more ancient times. So often I hear that Christianity incorporates pagan concepts from earlier beliefs, I usually respond that Christ did not originate these beliefs, he fulfilled them. So, yes, I do believe old testament saints were Christian even if they may have used different terminology than we do today. Further, I feel they must have had a personal relationship with Christ. They were born of the spirit and everything else.
Originally posted by toms54
I think people were saved then much the same as they are saved now.
…
…
Originally posted by toms54
I believe they taught the same thing. I also believe Christ when he says he existed in the time of Abraham. We know Melchizedek was Abraham's priest so Abraham believed what Melchizedek believed and Abraham's children believed what Abraham believed.
Originally posted by toms54
I am through with this nonsense. Say whatever you want. This conversation is over.
Originally posted by toms54
Really, Abraham and Melchizedek practiced Judaism? But how could that be? Judah was not even born yet.
originally posted by: Joecroft
a reply to: toms54
Originally posted by toms54
Really, Abraham and Melchizedek practiced Judaism? But how could that be? Judah was not even born yet.
I said the Old Testament Saints…I didn’t state which ones specifically…
Originally posted by toms54
So how can you say the OT saints practiced Judaism when Judaism did not yet exist?
Originally posted by toms54
I am through with this nonsense. Say whatever you want. This conversation is over.
originally posted by: toms54
Well who then? Moses? Moses wasn't Jewish. He was a Levite.