Japan To Build Moon Base: Will There Be A Sino-Japanese Space Race

it would be funny if we had a planned manned mission to the moon but didnt tell anyone, and then when the japanese craft landed and they got out and took their first steps, we'd have some americans up there drinkin a beer sitting in lawn chairs clapping for them, and then the japanese would be p/o with us for being a-holes.

[edit on 28/2/2005 by Schmidt1989]

China will not alter it's timestable just because the Japanese have entered space.

Btw, i thought moon bases were illegal???
Isn't there like a UN treaty against it???

www.iasl.mcgill.ca...


Well, there is enough escape hatches to drive a lunar tank through:

To those who signed it, The UN law aims to make moon exploration some unitied effort, for the benefit of whole mankind unilateral development is forbidden, multilateral is preffered, but Bi-lateral developments is ok, if they inform the Secretary General in advance about tlocation/timing etc.

Well, in that case, the European Union could set up shop for itselve, Americans and the UK could or the Russians and China could simply sign a bi-lateral agreement and notify the secretary general: "our companies are going to take this and this piece of moon, what are you going to do about it, send blue helmets ?"

The huge costs of mooncolonisation is comforting in the sense that multilateral cooperation seems necessary to spread the risks and thus relieving some tensions that may arise from everybody going solo.

Surely this law was written with the superpowers in mind, but just imagine what hell would break loose if some anonymous billionaire finances a bilateral (and thus legal) moonprogram for Tongo and Papua-New Guinea ? claiming the most juice icecrater to put on E-bay auction later????

You woulldn't believe how fast this law will be changed or how suddenly these countries may find themselve connected to the war against terror...



[edit on 1-3-2005 by Countermeasures]

Just out of curiosity;

Is there actually a practical reason for setting up bases in the moon.

I'am highly doubtful that we (eg. the world) have the technology to send large amounts of people to colonize the moon.

A missile launched from the moon would be just like a ICBM right? Subject to what-ever working missile shield.

Finally, all those craters on the moon should give us a clue on how bad an idea it is to be there.

The most practical reason is that moon bases are better launching pads to explore the galaxy from. That and research facilities as well as social experiments!!! And the whole Rocking experience of living on the moon. I would go!

Originally posted by 00PS
The most practical reason is that moon bases are better launching pads to explore the galaxy from. That and research facilities as well as social experiments!!! And the whole Rocking experience of living on the moon. I would go!

That and we could put a whole bunch of solar panels up there to collect energy.

Originally posted by Croat56
That and we could put a whole bunch of solar panels up there to collect energy.

1. How would you avoid the rocks that are going to fall on your panels?
2. How are you going to get the energy back to earth?
3. Y not build the solar panels on Earth?

---

I don't see the moon as a big difference from launching (spaceships) from Earth, Mars would be different but not the moon.

Originally posted by rapier28

Originally posted by Croat56
That and we could put a whole bunch of solar panels up there to collect energy.

1. How would you avoid the rocks that are going to fall on your panels?
2. How are you going to get the energy back to earth?
3. Y not build the solar panels on Earth?

---

I don't see the moon as a big difference from launching (spaceships) from Earth, Mars would be different but not the moon.

I dont know about the first 2 but the moon would be better because there is no atmousphere to get in the way of collecting solar energy

1. You dont! instead you use economics of scale, start cranking out millios of solarcells, produced by nanoswarms or clanking replicators, just replace the damaged solarcells that suffer from incidental impact...

alternatively, if icecraters are founfd they could setup steam engnes, by simply exposing the ice to spots in the sunlight to boil it and let it condens in the shadow of the crater again after dricving a turbine.

Minimum Surface Temperature: F -233 C -147

Maximum Surface Temperature: F212 C 100

Under low pressure and or with additives, the water will even boil at much lower temperature than 100 C


2 microwaves or a really big laser could send back.energy to earth, naturally there is the dual purpose of providing instant missileshield,, so it makes sense for the DOD and the DOE to both share the investment.

3. Lets rephrase that Why not build them on Mercury ? Mercury has highest density of solar radiation (close to sun , no atmosphere) that can be utilised plus the heavy and rare earth metals that are common in photovoltaics...

Plus we should go to the moon the build a micro-gravity Karlovacko-light brewery

[edit on 1-3-2005 by Countermeasures]

[edit on 1-3-2005 by Countermeasures]

Croat do you have any proof of that? Solar Energy is better collected on the moon? I never heard about that.

Originally posted by 00PS
Croat do you have any proof of that? Solar Energy is better collected on the moon? I never heard about that.

I know that the moon is constantly exposed to sunlight; no atmosphere, clouds, etc. I'd imagine that collecting solar energy would be much more efficient. Only about 50% of the Sun's energy reaches Earth's ground.

That being said, 50% is more than enough energy to power our current civilization assuming we have the right technology to harness it.

[edit on 1-3-2005 by rktspc]

Solar Flux, on Mercury (9214 W/m2):

Here are some consideration on how and why to maximise planet utilisation:

www.aeiveos.com...

but to bring back on topic of China-Japanese spacerace, instead of advancement by competition alternatively the colonisation of space could provide a common platform for corporation that could cast the historical sentiment and prejustices aside, Clearly the Japanese can no longer LOOK DOWN on the chinese as they are becoming such an industrialised soceity getting on level with Japanese tec and also I feel the Chinese should stop thinking of Japan as the WW2 agressor and move forward with them, Japan has been pretty peacefull after WW2, just like the Germans, they have become in fact model citizens with stringent anti-nationalist agression laws, anchored in their constitutions, having their armies mainly involved in peacekeeping missions, like canada, allthough the Japanese in this age of terror seek the oppertunity for a more pro-active army, but this is mainly because of they feel uneasy about North-Korea.

I think it would be a good idea for example if the Japanese build the high-tec mooncolony (to be shared by chinese/Japanese crews) , while the chinese provide a bunch of cheap launch rockets to move the stuff.

The Japanese have still a slight advantage in the cutting edge hightec and the nanotec, while the chinese hold a big edge in price, so this combo of affordable conventional rockets and a very unconventional cutting edge mooncolony would very much synergise both countries strong points.

The reason the western empire is still in place, is that the west always managed to play out tribal differences and we show up as the intermediator.

If Japan and china combined start shaking the resourcetree that is our solar system, they could become the most powerfull nations. Please you asians leave a spot for the poor europeans in the solar system....


[edit on 1-3-2005 by Countermeasures]

The Americans would just invade the moon ,claiming lunar terrorism.
Seriously though I hope America gets back into the race as fast as possible.
I can see a moon divided into 6 sections
russia+Arabs(Dont say no immeaditly ,the Arabs provide money and the Russians do the launches
china
japan
america
europe
India

Originally posted by Countermeasures
Solar Flux, on Mercury (9214 W/m2):

Here are some consideration on how and why to maximise planet utilisation:

www.aeiveos.com...

but to bring back on topic of China-Japanese spacerace, instead of advancement by competition alternatively the colonisation of space could provide a common platform for corporation that could cast the historical sentiment and prejustices aside, Clearly the Japanese can no longer LOOK DOWN on the chinese as they are becoming such an industrialised soceity getting on level with Japanese tec and also I feel the Chinese should stop thinking of Japan as the WW2 agressor and move forward with them, Japan has been pretty peacefull after WW2, just like the Germans, they have become in fact model citizens with stringent anti-nationalist agression laws, anchored in their constitutions, having their armies mainly involved in peacekeeping missions, like canada, allthough the Japanese in this age of terror seek the oppertunity for a more pro-active army, but this is mainly because of they feel uneasy about North-Korea.
[edit on 1-3-2005 by Countermeasures]

The Japanese after the war is nothing like the Germans.

For one, the Germans has offered full apologies and reparations. Granted, the Japanese has since the 70's has offered cheap loans to many countries. However, the Japanese government have never accepted blame for the war and they history books still maintain that they were "liberating asia from western forces".

Right-wing nationalists in Japan are rising, both in the ordinary people and the government.

So, you think the Japanese will try to stab their USA allie in the back one day for old times sake ?

I thought the aliens owned the moon already

This is a posting about this subject earlier than mine, I made the mistake of not searching for it in the engine ... DOH!

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Originally posted by Countermeasures
So, you think the Japanese will try to stab their USA allie in the back one day for old times sake ?

I think that the only thing keeping Japanese Nationalism against America in check is because of China's rise.

After all, they do still remember the 2 A-bombs.