What Existed before light was made here? Where did the CREATOR of Light come from?

a reply to: andy06shake

"I went to Sunday school so I know all about the bible." That excuse gets real old real fast. Do you know that what you were taught other than the gospel, and even that was filled with errors, was backed by Roman Catholic bibles? Not the preserved word of God in English. You never learned anything from Sunday school so stop speaking as you have.

a reply to: Marma

your new age view of God does not take in to account you (generically, meaning all of us) are a dirty rotten, hate filled, lying, sex fueled, drunken, drug abusive, reprobate sinners. That is what separates us from God and we are outside of him because of that sinful condition. You want in to God, accept his sons sacrifice you your sins.

a reply to: ChesterJohn

"Then it proves you never read the bible and if so you never understood it as God would have to too."

I do believe you stated the above.

I have read the Bible(both testaments), i did not say i understood it in its entirety, the mess of contradiction that it is and all that jazz.

Stop changing the goal posts little bit. x

Ile be quite when you accept said book is nothing more than a collection of tall tails written by MAN with all his fear and fallibility at play.

If God does exist he's not the fellow, or should i say, fellows, portrayed in that particular book, that's pretty much a given.

Until then, please continue with your organized religious nonsensical mumbo jumbo as i find it somewhat entertaining.

a reply to: andy06shake

You have yet to measure from everlasting to everlasting. You could no more measure that then infinity a concept not even our computers can calculate. Before there was the exaltation of the the son, the wisdom of God, there was no earth, no depth of heaven, no fountains of waters. It was God and light existing as one. One cannot exalt the other without their being those to worship, and that could not take place with out a habitation (not a plural of them) only one is needed. Can you find it in the Bible? your Sunday school never showed it to you, for if it had you wouldn't speak so ignorantly of the subject.

a reply to: andy06shake

I have read it for over 23 years and I still don't know all of it and understand all of it. But you are so far more superior than the rest of us. You read it once and went to Sunday school and you know God better than yourself. Excuse me if I don't agree with your lies. The tall tails are the evolutionary books you do believe it those are the true fairly tails of monkey men who came from nothing when some Water cooled on molten rock. How does that happen? ever see what happens when water is dropped on molten rock? it is instantly evaporated. and cooled rock didn't produce bacteria to live so when water did settle on it to produce and become man? your god is a rock and your mother spontaneous combustion of life.

Whose really the one with more faith I or you?

a reply to: ChesterJohn

Yes, praise Jebus and all that jizz.

I guess I'm just a poor uneducated pleb that will burn in hell for all eternity for simply questioning the bullcrap retarded notions of organized religious practice in all is many perverted shapes and guises?

Ah well me and about another 1000 billion poor souls i imagine, least ile be in some good company at that eternal barbecue as opposed to the alleged alternative.

Organized religious practice is about as ignorant as one can get to be honest, but believe what you wish, as you are perfectly at liberty to do so for the time being anyway. LoL

a reply to: ChesterJohn

I did not realise it was a competition never mind one of faith, that's your own bag of spanners their buddy. LoL

My faith is in my own two hands and mind ta boot.

I know those both exist, i think therefor i am.

As to the other faiths, well again tangible proof might be nice.

Until then i ken where my faith will be placed.

a reply to: ChesterJohn

None of that exists. You don't exist. You are made up of 99.99999% space. The only "sin" that ever exists is a sin against oneself. Imagine if your right hand punched you in the stomach. What do you do? Do you make your right hand apologize, then tie it behind your back? And you caress your stomach and erect it to the statute of victim? Promise that it will go to paradise and your right hand will go to hell? Each single human is like one cell inside a higher being's body. God is just like a bunch of Russian dolls nested neatly inside one another. There is nothing outside of God. If you can't understand that, that the teachings of Jesus are basically exactly how each of our body cells behave to each other, then there is nothing I can do for you. Pray to your God, but you'll be disappointed with yourself when you die (when you wake up from this dream of you).

a reply to: andy06shake

Let's entertain the notion through, what happens to anyone who does not believe, bow down to, or capitulate with the views of God/Jesus in the afterlife? Current Biblical rhetoric would seem to suggest they will be punished for all eternity via hellfire does it not? By the very same person who allegedly created them in the first place, in his very image, and loves them ""unconditionally"".

I would not speak for other religions but only for the Nazarene's who are the foundation of Christianity. You asked the question - "what happens to anyone who does not believe, bow down to, or capitulate with the views of God/Jesus in the afterlife?" According to the teachings of Jesus those people are banned from His kingdom of everlasting life. Those who reject the God of Jesus are not punished in hell forever. They are contained in a place in this earth which is called Sheol by the Hebrews. Sheol is eventually destroyed as the universe is destroyed and those in Sheol are then cast into another place which is called the lake of fire.

What is not clear is whether or not consciousness is eternal for those who are rejected in this afterlife realm of the lake of fire. The scriptures do tell us in Revelation 20:10 that the Devil, Beast, and False Prophet are tormented forever but does not say that the fallen angels or rejected humans are likewise punished. We have no idea whether this lake of fire is another world or a realm of prison upon the new earth. Isaiah seems to imply that it is a open realm in view of the saved human race.

Isaiah 66:22-24
(22) For as the new heavens and the new earth, which I will make, shall remain before me, saith the LORD, so shall your seed and your name remain.
(23) And it shall come to pass, that from one new moon to another, and from one sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before me, saith the LORD.
(24) And they shall go forth, and look upon the carcases of the men that have transgressed against me: for their worm shall not die, neither shall their fire be quenched; and they shall be an abhorring unto all flesh.

Now you can understand when I say that it is not clear to us exactly what happens. But to say in certainty that one is punished in consciousness forever is simply not the belief in Nazarene Christianity. It is true that Jesus loves His creation but that love is not unconditional. There is no blanket of salvation for anyone to get into the Kingdom of Heaven. There are conditions set down to qualify each person a place in the Kingdom of Heaven. That is why everyone must face a judgment after death of this terrestrial soul. Just because Jesus loves is not to say that He likes nor forgives. He has not and will not take Sheol [hell] out of His judgment as He judges a soul.

When one says forever then that must be explained by what is meant forever. To the living, the word forever means without end only because that is what we are taught. But once dead there is no forever to be understood. Time is gone and only the present is realized. People should think on that till it becomes a reality.

a reply to: Seede

So either way, we are getting burned for asking a question and/or not toeing the line?

Unconditional love my left bum cheek I'm afraid.

End of the day, if the above is our fate for simply disagreement, then the entity doing the damnation is either afraid of us or a complete and utter megalomaniac bastard with a massive inferiority complex.

a reply to: andy06shake

End of the day, if the above is our fate for simply disagreement, then the entity doing the damnation is either afraid of us or a complete and utter megalomaniac bastard with a massive inferiority complex.

That entity that you disagree with will one day be your judge and He is not afraid of any of us. All He is doing is offering you and me a shot at living forever. Actually He didn't have to do what He did but He did all of this religion stuff because He loved you. No one has to be so intelligent as to have all the answers and no one is required to believe all the stuff that another guy believes. All that Jesus wants is to get your attention and love His Father that is offering you a life forever. How you do this is not my business or anyone's business. It's between Him and you. I know that you know what I mean cause you are not a dummy.

PS - By the way is that a spitfire in your pic? I was WWII with the RAF - Over ninety now. Love that picture.

a reply to: Seede

"By the way is that a spitfire in your pic? I was WWII with the RAF - Over ninety now. Love that picture."

Hats off to you then sir, you done a Mans Job.

It is indeed a Spitfire.

My Grandfather was in the Navy on HMS Searcher, made it to 91.



As to said entity, i guess we will find out one way or the other when we shuffle of this mortal coil. Its the attendance part i have an issue with.

a reply to: andy06shake

My Grandfather was in the Navy on HMS Searcher, made it to 91.

I salute your grandfather and wish him the best wherever he is. Maybe one day I will run into both of you. Will remember the tag of "Andy O" and wish you the best. Keep your head up Andy and lol-----------------

a reply to: andy06shake

You do know that Jebus is a Canaanite and is people were known as Jebusites?

No I don't think you are uneducated pleeb. It is education that leads us away form God not to him.

When Judaism started it had nothing to do with religion. It had to do with worship. Israel was called out to give him worship. All Moses asked for was for them to go three days into the wilderness to worship God that was it. No practice no temple or even the tabernacle they were just to go worship.

Christianity also, was not a religion it was just the result of faith on Jesus for their salvation, that's it.

Today's organized religions or Christianity are so perverse it is sickening to watch and listen. 99% of the men in pulpits are thee because of their education and the love of money. I hate it.

I practice no religion, I live a holy life because Jesus Saved Me. I abstain from Drunkenness because Jesus Saved Me. I abstain from sexual immorality because Jesus Saved Me. You see, the NT tells me I am the Glory of Christ, his body, filled with the Holy Ghost, in that I have my being and live for him. I am not perfect and occasionally I fail and sin but all my sin is on him and I have his righteousness so when I get to heaven my judgement was already done, the execution of my Judgement fell on Christ, the righteous Judge 2,000 years ago, and I get life through him and not of myself. If anyone lives by rules and religious practices they are possibly not saved. Salvation is true freedom but I don't live a wild life because I can, I chose to live to glorify him for I am his glory.

And you are free to do the same if you so chose too.

a reply to: andy06shake

It would seem you misunderstood my point. I was showing you that it takes many years to understand the Bible not just a read here or there. Yep, you faith is your own but misplaced faith can kill. Thinking does not equate one as a person who has wisdom and understanding.

Yeah take Buddhism for example, they believe if the discipline themselves to deny pleasures, company of others, practice martial art forms that help them gain that desire discipline, that after they die they MIGHT attain to a higher form of existence.

The difference in the Buddhist faith and mine is on my death bed I KNOW where I will be when I die. They don't they can only hope they did enough, had enough discipline, fasted enough, ate only vegetables and drank only tea that they MIGHT attain the higher existence. They have no assurance. I have assurance of life after death a life filled with God and his Christ Jesus. I am already experiencing it right now that is how I know that I know that I know.

Blind faith is still blind, not knowing and not understanding.

a reply to: Marma

However your very words prove that I and you do exist. Space is a distance it can be molecular, it can be stellar, it can be a room or a land mass or a planet. But no matter what that space is based on an absolute truth known as Calculable Measurement. That means that space can be known to exist.

Sin is defined in the English Bible as any wrong committed to another. I am sure you have committed and wrong to another. To say you have not sinned is to say God is a liar, and if that were true then he is not a God who can save or destroy.

Wow, you have very deep issues.

You do not know what God is like. But this I can say he is very nigh unto you and yet a universe away. you suffer from the "so close yet so far syndrome". I am not building on you and you most definitely building on me. For darkness and light cannot exist in the same moment or space. Which again shows that you and I exist.

I have once believed that when I was a member of the Church Universal and Triumphant, then led by Elizabeth Prophet. All of their teachings re false and there is a god in it but it is not the God of the Bible of Jesus Christ. For Jesus is not just one of many who have ascended. No he first descended and then ascended and will come again.

Jesus is my God, I know where and what I will be when I die. I am sinner saved by grace through Christ finished work of the cross and I will have everlasting joy and glory in him, I assure you I will not be disappointed one bit. But you may be.

a reply to: ChesterJohn

You just try to do good buddy, the thing is it's not always possible.

Not through fear or punishment from any creator through.

But because it's the right thing to do.

Take what you do not have, have what you cannot take, and never hurt anybody weaker than yourself.

The rest, as they say, is Chicken soup(easy).

Faith i suppose is where one finds it.

End of the day perspective seems to be the ticket.

a reply to: andy06shake

you have not accepted God's love. So how could you claim to know what type it is? The words "Unconditional Love"are not in the Bible. If you accept God love then you receive everlasting life. John 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

a reply to: ChesterJohn

You don't need to accept Gods anything to know right from wrong.

You simply have to pay attention to your surroundings.

See this is the problem i have with Christianity, and also organized religion in general, if you refuse to accept there skewered version of what they consider to be the truth, you are automatically deemed the enemy.

Faith is a personal thing, you don't need books or rules to appreciate the concept or other people for that matter, as it tends to muddy the waters so to speak, generally with other peoples blood.

a reply to: andy06shake

of course you don't have to accept God's offer to know right and wrong. We got that from our fore-parents eating the fruit of the tree they were not to eat of.

People pay attention of surroundings only to live in this world where it is very dangerous to live today.

I have seen what organized religions does first hand. They forsake the poor, seek after riches of this world, teach mixed up gospels put together to keep the wealth of others coming in so they can live luxuriously. God's word has been skewered ever since the first skewering done by that old serpent the devil, known as Satan in Genesis 3:1-5

Faith in Christ is a very personal thing, and Christ never put us, the church, under a book of rules. That is man interpretation of it so they could fleece people of their money. We are commanded only to have fellowship of like minded people. So it is hard for me to find a few like me, and I am grateful I have. We are few but we are blessed because of it.

It is always a lame excuse to make Roman Catholic wars and inquisitions and put it on the rest of us who had nothing to do with it. I don't hear you crying about the 95 plus wars going on today that are all in the name of Arabian Tribal god, known as Allah.