Brexit, Today is the Vote!

a reply to: eletheia

good morning to you eletheia,

an attempt to revoke or destroy the reserve parachute (article 50 wto terms) can be

construed as parliament creating another parliament.

all of parliament are on the hook for this and will determine whether democracy

works or has been reduced to a soundbite for the abuse of.

f.

a reply to: eletheia

You know I agree with you; I'd take No Deal, no problem.

But that's becoming increasingly unlikely unless its an option on a second ballot.
In principle I'm fundamentally opposed to a second ballot....yet if we leave it to those tossers in Parliament to decide we are going to get sold down the river and at best get a watered down, diluted version of Brexit.

So do we push for a second ballot and hope the people have kept their resolve and vote for Brexit or do we put our faith in the hapless and amoral politicians that have proven their incompetence time and time again over the last two years?

A couple of months or so again I was reasonably confident we were going to get the Brexit we voted for.....that confidence has steadily drained away and now I very much fear that the democratic choice the electorate made will not be enacted.

I am ready to head to Westminster and start pimp slapping fools!

honestly man what a useless bunch of toerags

a reply to: eletheia

If we do Remain in the EU, in any shape or form, then we need to give up on the illusion that we live in a democracy and that our vote and opinions count for anything.

In the nightmare scenario that we Remain then as far as I see it there are only two courses of action available; Civil disobedience or switch off and live one's life ignorant of anything and everything that goes on around us and live in our own little bubble.

The thing is; all this has shown us in quite crystal clear fashion that we don't have the politicians and leaders to take this country forward in any positive sort of manner especially post-Brexit.
The nations failings have been exposed literally for the whole world to see.

Where as immediately after the referendum I was enthused and felt Brexit was a great opportunity for this country to shake off the shackles that held us back in the past now, I fear for the future regardless of what happens.

Maybe I'm just having a bad day and will feel differently later on once I've been to the pub....but I doubt it.

seen this today!

remember when we were told during independence referendum in project fear, we were daft to rely on dwindling oil!

absolutely shocking

Telegraph Artilce - North Sea Oil

a reply to: sapien82

Oh the irony.....

I can see how this could piss a few of our Scottish brethren off.

a reply to: Freeborn

It's absolutely mental isnt it !

aye Im sure a few folk will be pure raging at this!

the national printed the full Mccrone report in todays edition !

it's sad isnt it , to be lied to when all you want is to determine your own future.

If they are capable of lying like this to the UK's allies then its lies all around as par for the course, at this point no one in the UK should have even the tiniest smote or quantum particle of trust in the UK government to do anything right or just!

reply toFreeborn

I think you and I sing from the same song sheet as far as Brexit is concerned.

If we do Remain in the EU, in any shape or form, then we need to give up on the illusion that we live in a democracy and that our vote and opinions count for anything.

Now this I cant understand WHY on earth would we have to remain?

If your spouse does answer the petition and states that he does not want a divorce, it doesn't
Even a reluctant spouse can't not get divorced if the othematter. You have a legal right to a divorce. ... If your spouse does not file an answer, the court can grant you a default judgment including granting your property and custody requests as long as they are reasonable.

Even a spouse who doesn't want one can get divorced.

In the nightmare scenario that we Remain

Doesn't bear contemplating. '

The thing is; all this has shown us in quite crystal clear fashion that we don't have the politicians and leaders to take this country forward in any positive sort of manner especially post-Brexit.
The nations failings have been exposed literally for the whole world to see

.

Being order takers for the past 40 years has made them lazy.

There should be new rules drawn up for selecting MP's and they should

have a shelf life limit. Ken Clarke is a ripe example of why this should be.

Where as immediately after the referendum I was enthused and felt Brexit was a great opportunity for this country to shake off the shackles that held us back in the past now, I fear for the future regardless of what happens.

Its hard to believe we were a nation of 'go getters' ..... once upon a time.

/smh.

a reply to: Freeborn

Democracy, freedom, security, they are all just illusory anyway.

Just a means of promoting the divide and conquer mentality that keeps us apart and facilitates the class war.

True change would/will not equate to Brexit, hard, soft, or whatever shape or flavor it turns out to take.

True change requires the bankers, corporations and 1%ers to be removed from there Ivory castles.

True change requires blood, because "They" are not going to go down without there snib being burst at the very least.

Hundreds of thousands, possibly millions of people, would have to rise up and fight, possibly sacrificing their lives for any meaningful representation of the will of the people to be enforced in this nation.

And even then corruption and misrepresentation would probably still turn out to be the colour of the day.

heads up for those with an interest.

labour tabled 5 amendments to the withdrawl legislation today in parliament.

1st amend.......labour front bench calling for a permanent customs union.

result-----defeated by a majority of 83.


2nd amend.......snp calling that mp's were determined not to leave without
a deal under any circumstances.

result-----defeated by 36 votes.


3rd amend......wasn't put to the vote. no details on this.

result------no vote.


4rd amend......alberto costas amendment on eu nationals.

result------no formal division so it passed.


5th amend......tabled by labour's yvette(sp) cooper noting the committment made
by mrs may to a meaningful vote, a vote on no-deal and a vote on extending article 50.

result-----passed 482 majority.



nighty nighty
sleep tighty

don't let the brexit
bugs bitey.

f.

a reply to: eletheia

I think you and I sing from the same song sheet as far as Brexit is concerned.

Most definitely.

Now this I cant understand WHY on earth would we have to remain?

We shouldn't have to Remain.
But the cold, harsh reality is that we might be....or that the Brexit deal agreed will be a diluted Brexit that most us don't want.

We shouldn't have to accept it....but unfortunately the system we have allows for this.

My point is, our outdated and unfit for purpose system allows democracy to be usurped and ignored in order to maintain the status quo in order for the establishment, of all political persuasions, to continue treating the people of this country with utter contempt and disregard.

If Parliament decides to extend Article 50, have another referendum or accept a much diluted version of Brexit what power have we, the people, to stop them?

None!

And I know I'm in danger of being boringly repetitive but that's exactly how and why our current system is so outdated and unfit for purpose.

In such scenarios as mentioned above our only options are acceptance or civil disobedience.
It's that clear cut as far as I can see it.

Its hard to believe we were a nation of 'go getters' ..... once upon a time.

The situation we are in at present should be a source a national shame for each and every single one of us.

It seems Parliament has passed a motion to rule out No Deal and to extend Article 50 by 502 votes to 20.
I don't know the legality of this or how binding it is....but on face value I'd say 502 people deserve hanging as traitors!

a reply to: fakedirt

It's the Tory bastards that are at our throat.

The Brexit bugs we could probably get rid of with simple Midge repellent.

a reply to: Freeborn

You voted for a return of powers to The UK and this is exactly what we are seeing.

The Cooper amendment just means that if parliament can't agree on a deal then May can't just stall till crashing out becomes the only option by default.

Describing MPs doing their job properly and holding the government to account as traitors is beneath your standard.

a reply to: OtherSideOfTheCoin



Mo Mo of May's bullcrap to contend with.

www.youtube.com...

I love my country, like everyone else. Sadly it is being taken for a ride in front of our eyes. Besides wearing yellow vests and ranting on Social Media, what can we actually do?
When March 29th comes and goes, we'll be tied to the EU for longer and have to pay more money. The whole situation is a joke. We must be a laughing stock to those on the outside.
We have had just under 3 years to sort something out but now they want an extension? What will an extra 4 weeks achieve if you can't do it in nearly 3 years?

For all the hassle and bickering about Brexit, it has certainly shown the people on both sides of the coin who they can and can't trust in our political system.

The fallout from this is going to massive either way.

a reply to: rhynouk
I agree and this is just for the withdrawal agreement with the EU.
If Theresa May's deal somehow gets through parliament, we will then need to negotiate trade deals etc in a further two year 'transition period'...

originally posted by: 83Liberty
a reply to: rhynouk
I agree and this is just for the withdrawal agreement with the EU.
If Theresa May's deal somehow gets through parliament

She will get it through parliament, because there is no longer going to

be a NO DEAL...... The two options left are her deal which has already

been voted down by an unprecedented majority and *remain* which

was rejected by the referendum.


So what the people have left now from the 2016 referendum is

**NO DEAL is better than a bad deal**

IS NOW

**A bad deal is better than remain** /smh.

You couldn't make it up

a reply to: eletheia

And we are still swallowing the mince coming out there mouths. LoL

It's priceless really.

If nobody is made to answer for the crap show that Brexit has been in it's entirety then we deserve all we get really.

Because we are not just swallowing it now, we are asking for more whilst "they" muppets do airplanes into our mouths with the garbage they are coming away with.

We need a second referendum, that's a given, but not just on Brexit, we need one on whether or not Westminster should still be allowed to exist.

What they did was enable and mobilise those members of the public who were on the losing side to add legitimacy to their refusal to give the people what they voted for.

There is no democracy, it's a rigged system that maintains the broad status quo.

Change will probably have to be fought for, rather than voted for. Nothing else works, ever.