TSA/FBI...loyalty, They Live and the god of this world...

Goooooooood Mooooooooorning ATS!!! (Done in the voice of Robin Williams in Good Morning Vietnam)

Ok, now that I got that out of the way, along with coming up with the most ridiculous title I could think of, let me get to the point. This is just a quick observation but one I decided to share with the community in order to, hopefully, garner a little feedback.

Firstly, let me say that I am two things, a servant of God and Country, which I believe to be the same thing. I served in the Army for 10 years honorably, and I never saw a clause that said the vows I took in that service were abrogated when I took off the uniform. I serve in a different way now, but I still serve.

I say that not to aggrandize myself, but to juxtapose it with the news that I awoke to this morning regarding the TSA. In lieu of this shutdown many of these crack security experts at the TSA not receiving their paychecks have simply stopped coming to work, sick calls into work up some ridiculous percentage. Now to me this is simply disgusting. Never mind that the TSA is security theatre (and bad security theatre at that) with a 95% failure rate when tested, but honestly, is there no sense of duty to service? I know that I'll undoubtedly get some very cynical responses of those who are woefully unsurprised by this (as I'm also a touch unsurprised), but let's at least agree that we're disappointed. What should the repercussions be for these selfish trolls of our society? Keeping their roles on this stupid security stage should not be one.

Ok, before I wrap this up let me also mention the FBI, because I saw a report yesterday where the FBI is concerned about the loyalty of some of its agents in lieu of the shutdown, financial incentives being more tempting as pressures mount. You know, the TSA is one thing, but FBI agents!? That one is shocking to me, I would have thought those people were made of sterner stuff.

Oh, just to wrap my title all together, that's why I put "the god of this world" up top. In They Live, when RRP looks at a dollar bill while wearing the glasses, it says upon it "This is your God". I think this current debacle reveals just how true that is. Take away someones god and see their true selves emerge...

Peace...

a reply to: TheElectricPriest

When I read about the TSA calling in sick, the cases they were showing was they were picking up shifts at a part time job they had on the side so they could get paid.

In most instances in employee grievances with the shutdown, it seems that it is entry level employees (or slightly higher).

Now, this may come as a surprise to some, but some of these cats are living paycheck to paycheck. We could get into the debate of "well they should be more responsible", but I find this as a moot point. We all have contracts with our employers, and it boils down to something simple. Employee works X amount of hours, and every designated pay period (determined upon hiring) you settle up.

I get the whole "where's their sense of duty" line, but understand the federal government has been abusing it's power for some time, and their actions have consequences. These employees should have every right to not show up if they aren't being paid to put pressure on the decision makers. One of the few forms of leverage we have as employees is that our services are needed, so don't try and take that away from someone, because for many, that's all they have.

a reply to: TheElectricPriest

What..

$$$ < loyalty?

Is this still the USA, capital of commercial capitalism or some socialist-democractic pandemonion?!

a reply to: CriticalStinker

If I wasn't getting paid, I would stop showing up and find somewhere they did pay actual money.

a reply to: TheElectricPriest

People need to do what they have to do. I don’t see what god has to do with this. Other than you seem to find the need to virtue signal as much as you can. The gov certainly has a bad habit of withholding it’s loyalty to those in need. Veterans especially.

I think this shutdown is proving that our bloated government is full of un needed personel. 900,000 employees? The TSA is a perfect example. You say yourself, that they have a 95% failure rate. Is the cost for these services worth it? Your lack of surprise is really a good enough answer. TSA employees have been leaving their jobs since way before this shutdown ever happened. thehill.com...

It’s a #ty job, that’s not doing what it’s supposed to, because they hire people who have no security experience, and most of them get paid less than 15$. Which as most people know, isn’t really enough to run a household. These jobs were never meant to be taken seriously. 95% failure rate.

originally posted by: Woodcarver
a reply to: TheElectricPriest

People need to do what they have to do. I don’t see what god has to do with this. Other than you seem to find the need to virtue signal as much as you can. The gov certainly has a bad habit of withholding it’s loyalty to those in need. Veterans especially.

I think this shutdown is proving that our bloated government is full of un needed personel. 900,000 employees? The TSA is a perfect example. You say yourself, that they have a 95% failure rate. Is the cost for these services worth it? Your lack of surprise is really a good enough answer. TSA employees have been leaving their jobs since way before this shutdown ever happened. thehill.com...

Come on man, I think everyone is making really good points and I'm hearing what everyone has to say...except you. You just needed to start off your post with accusing me of "virtue signalling", which I don't even know what the hell that means. Your hate and anger shine through, but I wanted to have a more pragmatic discussion, and yes, the "virtue" of duty does have pragmatic realities. Why don't you go take a nice warm bath...

It’s a #ty job, that’s not doing what it’s supposed to, because they hire people who have no security experience, and most of them get paid less than 15$. Which as most people know, isn’t really enough to run a household. These jobs were never meant to be taken seriously. 95% failure rate.

originally posted by: shooterbrody
a reply to: CriticalStinker

If I wasn't getting paid, I would stop showing up and find somewhere they did pay actual money.

You and me both.

I hate to be the guy that tells everyone this, but I sell my body for money.

I live in this place called reality. I always strive to be the best at what I do, I have called out once in the past 7 years because I had the Norovirus, and if I can accommodate added responsibilities, I'll take them.

If you start messing with my money though, you'll find out how quickly my loyalty to self supersedes loyalty to my employer.

originally posted by: Woodcarver
a reply to: TheElectricPriest

People need to do what they have to do. I don’t see what god has to do with this. Other than you seem to find the need to virtue signal as much as you can. The gov certainly has a bad habit of withholding it’s loyalty to those in need. Veterans especially.

I think this shutdown is proving that our bloated government is full of un needed personel. 900,000 employees? The TSA is a perfect example. You say yourself, that they have a 95% failure rate. Is the cost for these services worth it? Your lack of surprise is really a good enough answer. TSA employees have been leaving their jobs since way before this shutdown ever happened. thehill.com...

It’s a #ty job, that’s not doing what it’s supposed to, because they hire people who have no security experience, and most of them get paid less than 15$. Which as most people know, isn’t really enough to run a household. These jobs were never meant to be taken seriously. 95% failure rate.

This was supposed to go here...whoops.

Come on man, I think everyone is making really good points and I'm hearing what everyone has to say...except you. You just needed to start off your post with accusing me of "virtue signalling", which I don't even know what the hell that means. Your hate and anger shine through, but I wanted to have a more pragmatic discussion, and yes, the "virtue" of duty does have pragmatic realities. Why don't you go take a nice warm bath...

a reply to: CriticalStinker

And all along somehow I thought it was an equal trade of x hours for x pay?
Is there a different equation that doesn't involve winning powerball numbers?

originally posted by: ManFromEurope
a reply to: TheElectricPriest

What..

$$$ < loyalty?

Is this still the USA, capital of commercial capitalism or some socialist-democractic pandemonion?!

That doesn't wipe out the notion of commitment to service or duty...God forbid. Dude, come on. i'm very disappointed in your post...

a reply to: CriticalStinker

there is always an alternative.....

originally posted by: CriticalStinker
a reply to: TheElectricPriest

When I read about the TSA calling in sick, the cases they were showing was they were picking up shifts at a part time job they had on the side so they could get paid.

In most instances in employee grievances with the shutdown, it seems that it is entry level employees (or slightly higher).

Now, this may come as a surprise to some, but some of these cats are living paycheck to paycheck. We could get into the debate of "well they should be more responsible", but I find this as a moot point. We all have contracts with our employers, and it boils down to something simple. Employee works X amount of hours, and every designated pay period (determined upon hiring) you settle up.

I get the whole "where's their sense of duty" line, but understand the federal government has been abusing it's power for some time, and their actions have consequences. These employees should have every right to not show up if they aren't being paid to put pressure on the decision makers. One of the few forms of leverage we have as employees is that our services are needed, so don't try and take that away from someone, because for many, that's all they have.

These are excellent points and the quality of response I was hoping to receive regarding the above. This is the type of post that forces me to question my presumptions...and so I thank you. Those that are simply making the argument of x pay for x hours are, in my opinion, failing to see the higher issue of service to a nation, a nation we all rely on for its functioning feeds us. I expected a certain level of healthy cynicism, but instead seem to be getting a double-dose of narcissism.

a reply to: TheElectricPriest

Those that are simply making the argument of x pay for x hours are, in my opinion, failing to see the higher issue of service to a nation, a nation we all rely on for its functioning feeds us. I expected a certain level of healthy cynicism, but instead seem to be getting a double-dose of narcissism.

It depends on context.

If there is a natural disaster, we don't think twice to help our community without thought of compensation.

If we were in a war scenario, and it was the countries survival at hand and the feds say they may not be able to pay me for a while, I'd still fight.

But when politicians are holding people hostage for partisan politics, use your leverage to make them suffer IMO.

a reply to: TheElectricPriest

Those that are simply making the argument of x pay for x hours are, in my opinion, failing to see the higher issue of service to a nation, a nation we all rely on for its functioning feeds us.

TSA people are in "higher service" the same way DMV people are.

It's not like you are talking about teachers or firefighters......

a reply to: TheElectricPriest

Important distinction you need to make before continuing to prattle on -- did gubmint pay your housing and feed you, too? Because if you were on a base and eating from a mess hall on it, you had your basics of food, water, shelter & heat more than covered, which federal workers don't have the luxury of having covered in the same manner.

It's a lousy comparison. And coming from a "soldier", a pretty brain dead one at that.

originally posted by: TheElectricPriest

originally posted by: Woodcarver
a reply to: TheElectricPriest

People need to do what they have to do. I don’t see what god has to do with this. Other than you seem to find the need to virtue signal as much as you can. The gov certainly has a bad habit of withholding it’s loyalty to those in need. Veterans especially.

I think this shutdown is proving that our bloated government is full of un needed personel. 900,000 employees? The TSA is a perfect example. You say yourself, that they have a 95% failure rate. Is the cost for these services worth it? Your lack of surprise is really a good enough answer. TSA employees have been leaving their jobs since way before this shutdown ever happened. thehill.com...

It’s a #ty job, that’s not doing what it’s supposed to, because they hire people who have no security experience, and most of them get paid less than 15$. Which as most people know, isn’t really enough to run a household. These jobs were never meant to be taken seriously. 95% failure rate.

This was supposed to go here...whoops.

Come on man, I think everyone is making really good points and I'm hearing what everyone has to say...except you. You just needed to start off your post with accusing me of "virtue signalling", which I don't even know what the hell that means. Your hate and anger shine through, but I wanted to have a more pragmatic discussion, and yes, the "virtue" of duty does have pragmatic realities. Why don't you go take a nice warm bath...

You should look it up, and then answer this question. What does your belief in God have to do with the TSA? Why did you insert your belief in God into your OP? Was it to signal some kind of virtue that you have?

It’s there in your name, it’s there in the title, it’s in your OP, and at the end you say. Take people’s god away and they show their true colors. As if believing in gods makes people good.

I wouldn’t have brought any of this up if you hadn’t

originally posted by: CriticalStinker
a reply to: TheElectricPriest

Those that are simply making the argument of x pay for x hours are, in my opinion, failing to see the higher issue of service to a nation, a nation we all rely on for its functioning feeds us. I expected a certain level of healthy cynicism, but instead seem to be getting a double-dose of narcissism.

It depends on context.

If there is a natural disaster, we don't think twice to help our community without though of compensation.

If we were in a war scenario, and it was the countries survival at hand and the feds say they may not be able to pay me for a while, I'd still fight.

But when politicians are holding people hostage for partisan politics, use your leverage to make them suffer IMO.

A complete valid point...I definitely see what you're saying, sort of like an "unofficial" strike. Ok, thanks, this is the differing perspective I was hoping to find.

originally posted by: Woodcarver

originally posted by: TheElectricPriest

originally posted by: Woodcarver
a reply to: TheElectricPriest

People need to do what they have to do. I don’t see what god has to do with this. Other than you seem to find the need to virtue signal as much as you can. The gov certainly has a bad habit of withholding it’s loyalty to those in need. Veterans especially.

I think this shutdown is proving that our bloated government is full of un needed personel. 900,000 employees? The TSA is a perfect example. You say yourself, that they have a 95% failure rate. Is the cost for these services worth it? Your lack of surprise is really a good enough answer. TSA employees have been leaving their jobs since way before this shutdown ever happened. thehill.com...

It’s a #ty job, that’s not doing what it’s supposed to, because they hire people who have no security experience, and most of them get paid less than 15$. Which as most people know, isn’t really enough to run a household. These jobs were never meant to be taken seriously. 95% failure rate.

This was supposed to go here...whoops.

Come on man, I think everyone is making really good points and I'm hearing what everyone has to say...except you. You just needed to start off your post with accusing me of "virtue signalling", which I don't even know what the hell that means. Your hate and anger shine through, but I wanted to have a more pragmatic discussion, and yes, the "virtue" of duty does have pragmatic realities. Why don't you go take a nice warm bath...

You should look it up, and then answer this question. What does your belief in God have to do with the TSA? Why did you insert your belief in God and to your OP? Was it to signal some kind of virtue that you have?

Man, you are really having one of those mornings, aren't you sweetheart? I suppose I mentioned God to equate that level of faith with my belief in the importance of faith and service to the nation...they're equitable. Even those without a deistic faith would understand that by way of my comparison I'm setting a base-line for my belief in the importance of our duty to country, so the mentioning thereof was purposeful for this intent, not an attempt to persuade a complete stranger of my virtue. I suppose, however, you're one of those angry atheists who is "triggered" every time someone mentions something you don't believe in. Well I apologize buttercup, I'll try to be more mindful of your sensitivity next time...

originally posted by: TheElectricPriest

originally posted by: CriticalStinker
a reply to: TheElectricPriest

When I read about the TSA calling in sick, the cases they were showing was they were picking up shifts at a part time job they had on the side so they could get paid.

In most instances in employee grievances with the shutdown, it seems that it is entry level employees (or slightly higher).

Now, this may come as a surprise to some, but some of these cats are living paycheck to paycheck. We could get into the debate of "well they should be more responsible", but I find this as a moot point. We all have contracts with our employers, and it boils down to something simple. Employee works X amount of hours, and every designated pay period (determined upon hiring) you settle up.

I get the whole "where's their sense of duty" line, but understand the federal government has been abusing it's power for some time, and their actions have consequences. These employees should have every right to not show up if they aren't being paid to put pressure on the decision makers. One of the few forms of leverage we have as employees is that our services are needed, so don't try and take that away from someone, because for many, that's all they have.

These are excellent points and the quality of response I was hoping to receive regarding the above. This is the type of post that forces me to question my presumptions...and so I thank you. Those that are simply making the argument of x pay for x hours are, in my opinion, failing to see the higher issue of service to a nation, a nation we all rely on for its functioning feeds us. I expected a certain level of healthy cynicism, but instead seem to be getting a double-dose of narcissism.

The point is that the gov is bloated with un needed personel. A point i made earlier that you ignored in favor of chastising me for calling out your need to virtue signal.

The TSA doesn’t work. Why would you be worried about them? You said it yourself with that 95% failure rate. Why would you want to pay for that?

originally posted by: Woodcarver

originally posted by: TheElectricPriest

originally posted by: CriticalStinker
a reply to: TheElectricPriest

When I read about the TSA calling in sick, the cases they were showing was they were picking up shifts at a part time job they had on the side so they could get paid.

In most instances in employee grievances with the shutdown, it seems that it is entry level employees (or slightly higher).

Now, this may come as a surprise to some, but some of these cats are living paycheck to paycheck. We could get into the debate of "well they should be more responsible", but I find this as a moot point. We all have contracts with our employers, and it boils down to something simple. Employee works X amount of hours, and every designated pay period (determined upon hiring) you settle up.

I get the whole "where's their sense of duty" line, but understand the federal government has been abusing it's power for some time, and their actions have consequences. These employees should have every right to not show up if they aren't being paid to put pressure on the decision makers. One of the few forms of leverage we have as employees is that our services are needed, so don't try and take that away from someone, because for many, that's all they have.

These are excellent points and the quality of response I was hoping to receive regarding the above. This is the type of post that forces me to question my presumptions...and so I thank you. Those that are simply making the argument of x pay for x hours are, in my opinion, failing to see the higher issue of service to a nation, a nation we all rely on for its functioning feeds us. I expected a certain level of healthy cynicism, but instead seem to be getting a double-dose of narcissism.

The point is that the gov is bloated with un needed personel. A point i made earlier that you ignored in favor of chastising me for calling out your need to virtue signal.

The TSA doesn’t work. Why would you be worried about them? You said it yourself with that 95% failure rate. Why would you want to pay for that?

Dude, nobody with a shred of common sense wants the TSA to stick around, but an abrupt stop such as this doesn't cut it for better management. Dial it down in controlled stages and dissolve it the right way with the least possible amount of income whiplash for employees as possible. We do owe those folks doing the work that much at least.