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Right wing domestic terrorism

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posted on Jan, 14 2019 @ 10:18 AM
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originally posted by: FilthyUSMonkey

originally posted by: Woodcarver

originally posted by: FilthyUSMonkey

originally posted by: Woodcarver

originally posted by: FilthyUSMonkey

originally posted by: pavil
a reply to: FilthyUSMonkey

Any group or individual that uses violence to achieve their political or social goals is to be condemned. There are plenty of extremists on all sides of the political spectrum willing to do such things and it is on all of us to condemn such violent actions.

All of them....not just the one we are opposed to. Too often people are willing to turn a blind eye to violence when it is used for something we support to a certain extent.



I don't agree with the statement:


Any group or individual that uses violence to achieve their political or social goals is to be condemned.


What about the US revolution? The Civil war? WWII? Any war?
Those are state acts, two of them were revolutions. I’m sure plenty of terrorism went on during those events, but in the context of war, i don’t think they should be included.


So there is no state-sponsored terrorism? Interesting. You might want to call that into Washington.


War is not state sponsored terrorism. The three examples you gave were all wars. I don’t know where you got that i said there is no state sponsored terrorism. I even said there was probably terrorism going on during these wars.


Your words:


Those are state acts, two of them were revolutions. I’m sure plenty of terrorism went on during those events, but in the context of war, i don’t think they should be included.


That is where I got that from.
Where did i say state sponsored terrorism doesn’t exist?


So there is no state-sponsored terrorism? Interesting. You might want to call that into Washington.

edit on 14-1-2019 by Woodcarver because: (no reason given)




posted on Jan, 14 2019 @ 10:21 AM
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originally posted by: Woodcarver

originally posted by: FilthyUSMonkey
a reply to: Middleoftheroad




Yes, Right-wing terrorism is bad just like left-wing terrorism. I think we can all agree that Islamic terrorists are the worst though


In the last 18 years right wing domestic terrorism has been far worse than either left-wing or Islamic terrorism in the US. Check the stats I posted, or refute them with credible sources.

I agree 9/11 was terrible.
And if you add one more day to that study, the jihadist/religious terrorists take a firm lead.

You are cherry picking stats and everyone here has pointed this out. You don’t get to choose what information is allowed for discussion.


Yes. That is deliberate. The federal government took swift action on the anomaly and mismanagement that allowed 9/11 to happen. This tread is about what is the biggest threat since that time: right-wing domestic terrorism, and how since 9/11 roughly 60 percent of domestic terrorist incidents were driven by racist, anti-Muslim, anti-Semitic, antigovernment or other right-wing ideologies.



posted on Jan, 14 2019 @ 10:23 AM
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[
a reply to: Middleoftheroad





Yes. That is deliberate. The federal government took swift action on the anomaly and mismanagement that allowed 9/11 to happen. This thread is about what is the biggest threat since that time: right-wing domestic terrorism, and how since 9/11 roughly 60 percent of domestic terrorist incidents were driven by racist, anti-Muslim, anti-Semitic, antigovernment or other right-wing ideologies.
edit on 14-1-2019 by FilthyUSMonkey because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 14 2019 @ 10:23 AM
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originally posted by: FilthyUSMonkey

originally posted by: Woodcarver

originally posted by: FilthyUSMonkey
a reply to: Woodcarver




the topic is right wing groups


No it isn't about right wing groups. I wrote the OP.. I think I would be the resident subject matter expert on what it is about. Did you read the title? The OP?

Do you see how I specifically call out "lone Wolves."

I never started looking into right-wing terrorist groups in the US till you brought it up, correct?

Don't try to derail the thread into right-wing terrorist groups. However, if you want to do some research, like other posters have, calling out specific right-wing domestic terrorist groups, I think that would be a helpful and productive addition to this discussion.

You call out lone wolves from the right. The media conveniently lets us know who the far-right lone wolves are, but they intentionally don’t mention “lone wolf” when it’s an act by a leftist


As of 2015 "Lone wolves"

were responsible for 25 percent of all U.S. terrorist attacks.
Source


The term "lone wolf" was popularized by white supremacists Alex Curtis and Tom Metzger in the 1990s. Metzger advocated individual or small-cell underground activity, as opposed to above-ground membership organizations, envisaging "warriors acting alone or in small groups who attacked the government or other targets in 'daily, anonymous acts.'"[5][6]
Source

So it looks like the term "Lone Wolf" is synonymous with "right-wing domestic terrorist" to some degree.

But you are deflecting again, refusing to discuss the topic of the OP, and are now throwing in the media to try and derail the tread.

Once again, the topic of of the thread is right-wing domestic terrorism, and how roughly 60 percent of those incidents were driven by racist, anti-Muslim, anti-Semitic, antigovernment or other right-wing ideologies.
But those numbers a skewed and cherrypicked.

You can’t just arbitrarily make the cut off date the day after the biggest terrorist attack on the nation ever.

Or ignore the fact that left wing “lone wolves” don’t exist.

Or ignore the fact that the number of deaths that you are reffering to is rather small. Not insignificant, but only around..... what was that number? The total amount of deaths attributed to far right extremists?
edit on 14-1-2019 by Woodcarver because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 14 2019 @ 10:29 AM
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a reply to: Woodcarver

Look you don’t want to admit that people have been committing acts of terrorism in the name of ideologies that you are sympathetic to. Let’s stop pretending that the stats are skewed or that the sources are bias. Fundamentally this is about ideology not facts. About 60% of attacks in America come from right wing ideologies and this does not fit in with your black and white view that right is right and the left are commie nazi terrorists.

Thst is why I said in my first posts it’s important to separate the right wing ideologies from those willing to commit acts of terrorism.

Take your political filter out of this and the fact that right wing terrorism is on the rise and is a significant threat becomes undeniable.

Sorry to be blunt but after six pages I think it’s past time to call it like it is.
edit on 14-1-2019 by OtherSideOfTheCoin because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 14 2019 @ 10:30 AM
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originally posted by: Woodcarver

originally posted by: FilthyUSMonkey

originally posted by: Woodcarver

originally posted by: FilthyUSMonkey
a reply to: Woodcarver




the topic is right wing groups


No it isn't about right wing groups. I wrote the OP.. I think I would be the resident subject matter expert on what it is about. Did you read the title? The OP?

Do you see how I specifically call out "lone Wolves."

I never started looking into right-wing terrorist groups in the US till you brought it up, correct?

Don't try to derail the thread into right-wing terrorist groups. However, if you want to do some research, like other posters have, calling out specific right-wing domestic terrorist groups, I think that would be a helpful and productive addition to this discussion.

You call out lone wolves from the right. The media conveniently lets us know who the far-right lone wolves are, but they intentionally don’t mention “lone wolf” when it’s an act by a leftist


As of 2015 "Lone wolves"

were responsible for 25 percent of all U.S. terrorist attacks.
Source


The term "lone wolf" was popularized by white supremacists Alex Curtis and Tom Metzger in the 1990s. Metzger advocated individual or small-cell underground activity, as opposed to above-ground membership organizations, envisaging "warriors acting alone or in small groups who attacked the government or other targets in 'daily, anonymous acts.'"[5][6]
Source

So it looks like the term "Lone Wolf" is synonymous with "right-wing domestic terrorist" to some degree.

But you are deflecting again, refusing to discuss the topic of the OP, and are now throwing in the media to try and derail the tread.

Once again, the topic of of the thread is right-wing domestic terrorism, and how roughly 60 percent of those incidents were driven by racist, anti-Muslim, anti-Semitic, antigovernment or other right-wing ideologies.
But those numbers a skewed and cherrypicked.

You can’t just arbitrarily make the cut off date the day after the biggest terrorist attack on the nation ever.

Or ignore the fact that left wing “lone wolves” don’t exist.


Yes, I can. Once again, the topic of of the thread is right-wing domestic terrorism, and how roughly 60 percent of those incidents were driven by racist, anti-Muslim, anti-Semitic, antigovernment or other right-wing ideologies.

I choose a starting point after 9/11, which represents the last 18 years. So, since 9/11, what is the biggest threat since that time: right-wing domestic terrorism, and how since 9/11 roughly 60 percent of domestic terrorist incidents were driven by racist, anti-Muslim, anti-Semitic, antigovernment or other right-wing ideologies.

Do you want me to go on repeating that last part over and over?

Has it sunk in yet?

You seem intent on dragging this post off topic, and refuse to discuss the OP.

I will say "good day" to you at this point.

Enjoy your afternoon.




posted on Jan, 14 2019 @ 10:32 AM
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originally posted by: OtherSideOfTheCoin
a reply to: Woodcarver

Look you don’t want to admit that people have been committing acts of terrorism in the name of ideologies that you are sympathetic to. Let’s stop pretending thst that the stats are skewed or thst the sources are bias. Fundamentally this is about ideology not facts. About 60% of attacks in America come from right wing ideologies and this does not fit in with your black and white view that right is right and left are commie nazi terrorists.

Thst is why I said in my first posts it’s important to separate the right wing ideologies from those willing to commit acts of terrorism.

Take your political filter out of this and the fact that right wing terrorism is on the rise and is a significant threat becomes undeniable.

Sorry to be blunt but after six pages I think it’s past time to call it like it is.
Whoa whoa whoa. What ideologies are you accusing me of being sympathetic to? All i have done so far is point out flaws in the OP’s argument and the study he is using.



posted on Jan, 14 2019 @ 10:33 AM
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originally posted by: OtherSideOfTheCoin
a reply to: Woodcarver

Look you don’t want to admit that people have been committing acts of terrorism in the name of ideologies that you are sympathetic to. Let’s stop pretending thst that the stats are skewed or thst the sources are bias. Fundamentally this is about ideology not facts. About 60% of attacks in America come from right wing ideologies and this does not fit in with your black and white view that right is right and left are commie nazi terrorists.

Thst is why I said in my first posts it’s important to separate the right wing ideologies from those willing to commit acts of terrorism.

Take your political filter out of this and the fact that right wing terrorism is on the rise and is a significant threat becomes undeniable.

Sorry to be blunt but after six pages I think it’s past time to call it like it is.
how many murdered are attributed to these right wing extremists?



posted on Jan, 14 2019 @ 10:34 AM
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a reply to: Woodcarver

Not really looking to debate you, I kind of feel sorry for the OP being so naive in contunuting to debate with you as if your going to “get it”.

The idea of 60% of attacks coming from right wing ideologies does not fit with your world view hence why you can’t acknowledge it. Cognitive dissonance is a sad sight my friend
edit on 14-1-2019 by OtherSideOfTheCoin because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 14 2019 @ 10:34 AM
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a reply to: OtherSideOfTheCoin

Very insightful points. I gave up on the poster. Seemed to me that naked deflection and whataboutism was the point of most of his posts.

Gave it a shot.

He can have the last word. I am done with filling up pages that tell him what the topic of the OP is.


edit on 14-1-2019 by FilthyUSMonkey because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 14 2019 @ 10:34 AM
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originally posted by: FilthyUSMonkey

originally posted by: Woodcarver

originally posted by: FilthyUSMonkey

originally posted by: Woodcarver

originally posted by: FilthyUSMonkey
a reply to: Woodcarver




the topic is right wing groups


No it isn't about right wing groups. I wrote the OP.. I think I would be the resident subject matter expert on what it is about. Did you read the title? The OP?

Do you see how I specifically call out "lone Wolves."

I never started looking into right-wing terrorist groups in the US till you brought it up, correct?

Don't try to derail the thread into right-wing terrorist groups. However, if you want to do some research, like other posters have, calling out specific right-wing domestic terrorist groups, I think that would be a helpful and productive addition to this discussion.

You call out lone wolves from the right. The media conveniently lets us know who the far-right lone wolves are, but they intentionally don’t mention “lone wolf” when it’s an act by a leftist


As of 2015 "Lone wolves"

were responsible for 25 percent of all U.S. terrorist attacks.
Source


The term "lone wolf" was popularized by white supremacists Alex Curtis and Tom Metzger in the 1990s. Metzger advocated individual or small-cell underground activity, as opposed to above-ground membership organizations, envisaging "warriors acting alone or in small groups who attacked the government or other targets in 'daily, anonymous acts.'"[5][6]
Source

So it looks like the term "Lone Wolf" is synonymous with "right-wing domestic terrorist" to some degree.

But you are deflecting again, refusing to discuss the topic of the OP, and are now throwing in the media to try and derail the tread.

Once again, the topic of of the thread is right-wing domestic terrorism, and how roughly 60 percent of those incidents were driven by racist, anti-Muslim, anti-Semitic, antigovernment or other right-wing ideologies.
But those numbers a skewed and cherrypicked.

You can’t just arbitrarily make the cut off date the day after the biggest terrorist attack on the nation ever.

Or ignore the fact that left wing “lone wolves” don’t exist.


Yes, I can. Once again, the topic of of the thread is right-wing domestic terrorism, and how roughly 60 percent of those incidents were driven by racist, anti-Muslim, anti-Semitic, antigovernment or other right-wing ideologies.

I choose a starting point after 9/11, which represents the last 18 years. So, since 9/11, what is the biggest threat since that time: right-wing domestic terrorism, and how since 9/11 roughly 60 percent of domestic terrorist incidents were driven by racist, anti-Muslim, anti-Semitic, antigovernment or other right-wing ideologies.

Do you want me to go on repeating that last part over and over?

Has it sunk in yet?

You seem intent on dragging this post off topic, and refuse to discuss the OP.

I will say "good day" to you at this point.

Enjoy your afternoon.

Answer my question. How many murders are attributed to far right extremists? This should be an easy answer.



posted on Jan, 14 2019 @ 10:36 AM
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originally posted by: OtherSideOfTheCoin
a reply to: Woodcarver

Not really looking to debate you, I kind of feel sorry for the OP being so naive in contunuting to debate with you as if your going to “get it”.
How many murders are attributed to far right extremists? This question is completely within the bounds of the OP. And should be easy for anyone to answer.
edit on 14-1-2019 by Woodcarver because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 14 2019 @ 10:37 AM
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originally posted by: Woodcarver

originally posted by: OtherSideOfTheCoin
a reply to: Woodcarver

Not really looking to debate you, I kind of feel sorry for the OP being so naive in contunuting to debate with you as if your going to “get it”.
How many murders are attributed to far right extremists? This question is completely within the bounds of the OP. And should be easy for anyone to answer.


Google is your friend.

Stop with the lazy arguments expecting the OP to find d the evidence to support your arguments.



posted on Jan, 14 2019 @ 10:38 AM
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originally posted by: FilthyUSMonkey
a reply to: Middleoftheroad




Yes, Right-wing terrorism is bad just like left-wing terrorism. I think we can all agree that Islamic terrorists are the worst though


In the last 18 years right wing domestic terrorism has been far worse than either left-wing or Islamic terrorism in the US. Check the stats I posted, or refute them with credible sources.

I agree 9/11 was terrible.


Your source uses the following tactic to push their narrative.



Intellectual dishonesty is a failure to apply standards of rational evaluation that one is aware of, usually in a self-serving fashion. If one judges others more critically than oneself, that is intellectually dishonest.



posted on Jan, 14 2019 @ 10:41 AM
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a reply to: Middleoftheroad

Once again, check the stats I posted, or refute them with credible sources.



posted on Jan, 14 2019 @ 10:41 AM
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originally posted by: OtherSideOfTheCoin

originally posted by: Woodcarver

originally posted by: OtherSideOfTheCoin
a reply to: Woodcarver

Not really looking to debate you, I kind of feel sorry for the OP being so naive in contunuting to debate with you as if your going to “get it”.
How many murders are attributed to far right extremists? This question is completely within the bounds of the OP. And should be easy for anyone to answer.


Google is your friend.

Stop with the lazy arguments expecting the OP to find d the evidence to support your arguments.
You are trying to make a point that far right terrorism is the biggest threat to our country. I’m asking you to post sources that will show that number in all of it’s glory. If you don’t know, then how do you know it’s the biggest threat. I’m only asking you to post sources. Which is plainly stated in the OP that it is required if you make any claims.



posted on Jan, 14 2019 @ 10:42 AM
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originally posted by: FilthyUSMonkey
a reply to: Middleoftheroad

Once again, check the stats I posted, or refute them with credible sources.
I’m asking you to back up your claim. Your OP specifically states that if a claim is made, it needs to be backed up with facts and sources. I’m asking you to back this up with sources.How many murders by far right extremist are we talking about?
edit on 14-1-2019 by Woodcarver because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 14 2019 @ 10:45 AM
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originally posted by: FilthyUSMonkey
a reply to: Middleoftheroad

Once again, check the stats I posted, or refute them with credible sources.


I already refuted with a source. It’s on page 5 I believe. I’m attacking the source of your info now.
edit on 14-1-2019 by Middleoftheroad because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 14 2019 @ 10:49 AM
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originally posted by: Middleoftheroad

originally posted by: FilthyUSMonkey
a reply to: Middleoftheroad

Once again, check the stats I posted, or refute them with credible sources.


I already refuted with a source. It’s on page 5 I believe. I’m attacking the source of your info now.


I have documented 15 sources in this thread so far. 5 in the OP alone. Which one would you like to discuss?

What is your counter source?

edit on 14-1-2019 by FilthyUSMonkey because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 14 2019 @ 10:52 AM
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originally posted by: Woodcarver

originally posted by: FilthyUSMonkey
a reply to: Middleoftheroad

Once again, check the stats I posted, or refute them with credible sources.
I’m asking you to back up your claim. Your OP specifically states that if a claim is made, it needs to be backed up with facts and sources. I’m asking you to back this up with sources.How many murders by far right extremist are we talking about?


The question is framed post 9/11, which ideology has been tied to more deaths at the hands of extremists.

The answer is more instances of terror directed homicide has been done by people with lunatic ideology that falls under the right.

The numbers are low, so it's not that big of a threat IMO.

But the question isn't are you scared to go outside, it's which brand of ideology has had more people use violence as a tool.

It's simple, it truly is.

We could frame it in a different way, but that's not how OP did it. OP knew what they would get in this thread as we all did.

I could frame it that the last 100 years, more people have died to left leaning ideologies and no one could refute it.

But it wouldn't make a difference, ideology doesn't kill people, people kill people. All ideology can be good, and all can be weaponized to be toxic.



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