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Right wing domestic terrorism

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posted on Jan, 14 2019 @ 02:02 PM
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a reply to: Propagandalf



The 1990s surge had died down by the turn of the century and right-wing terrorism occurred less frequently in the early-to-mid 2000s. Events ranging from the non-event of a Y2K-related disaster to the replacement of Bill Clinton with George W. Bush to the 9/11 terror attacks all played a role in dampening right-wing furor.

Unfortunately, this state of affairs did not last. Near the end of Bush’s second term, right-wing terror incidents began to increase again and this trend accelerated by 2009, thanks in part to the election of Barack Obama, whom both white supremacists and anti-government extremists hated, and to the major economic disasters of the Great Recession and the foreclosure crisis. The latter two in particular allowed the sovereign citizen movement to greatly expand. The result was a second surge of right-wing extremism, one that was accompanied by a surge of right-wing terror incidents. This increased level of terror-related activity remains high today, though whether or not it will sustain itself during a Trump administration remains to be seen.


A Dark and Constant Rage: 25 Years of Right-Wing Terrorism in the United States




posted on Jan, 14 2019 @ 02:07 PM
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a reply to: Propagandalf


I can understand your post. However, consider this:

In 1941 the Japanese attacked Pearl Harbor. 2,403 Americans were killed and 1,178 others were wounded, and caused the US to enter to WWII. Eighteen years later, in 1959, Japan was no longer a threat. I did intentionally use data from after 9/11.

I asked, "What has been the biggest domestic terrorist threat since 9/11."

Ask a different question, and you will find a different answer.

edit on 14-1-2019 by FilthyUSMonkey because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 14 2019 @ 02:35 PM
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a reply to: Propagandalf

And what happens when you look at the other Top 10 Worst Terror Attacks on US Soil? They're all committed by white supremacists of one kind or another.

9/11 was a tragedy but statistically speaking it's an outlier.

Serious question, on 9/10/01 did you believe that white supremacists were the biggest terror threat in the US?



posted on Jan, 14 2019 @ 02:45 PM
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originally posted by: OtherSideOfTheCoin

originally posted by: Woodcarver

originally posted by: OtherSideOfTheCoin

originally posted by: Woodcarver

originally posted by: OtherSideOfTheCoin
a reply to: Woodcarver

Not really looking to debate you, I kind of feel sorry for the OP being so naive in contunuting to debate with you as if your going to “get it”.
How many murders are attributed to far right extremists? This question is completely within the bounds of the OP. And should be easy for anyone to answer.


Google is your friend.

Stop with the lazy arguments expecting the OP to find d the evidence to support your arguments.
You are trying to make a point that far right terrorism is the biggest threat to our country. I’m asking you to post sources that will show that number in all of it’s glory. If you don’t know, then how do you know it’s the biggest threat. I’m only asking you to post sources. Which is plainly stated in the OP that it is required if you make any claims.


Ok am going to bite, I will give you a full explanation however please do not insult me by telling me that the numbers are wrong or the source bias without providing any kind of proof to support a counter argument.

My assertion is that since 9/11 there have been more attacks by individuals/groups with right-wing ideologies above all other ideologies and that as such it is the biggest terrorist threat facing America right now.

My proof for this come from official government statistics and analysis from the United States Government Accountability Office who in their report have stated that:


fatalities resulting from attacks by far right wing violet extremists have exceeded those caused by radical Islamist violent extremists in 10 of the 15 years, and were the same in 3 of the years since September 12, 2001. Of the 85 violent extremist incidents that resulted in death since September 12, 2001, far right wing violent extremist groups were responsible for 62 (73 percent) while radical Islamist violent extremists were responsible for 23 (27 percent). The total number of fatalities is about the same for far right wing violent extremists and radical Islamist violent extremists over the approximately 15-year period (106 and 119, respectively). However, 41 percent of the deaths attributable to radical Islamist violent extremists occurred in a single event—an attack at an Orlando, Florida night club in 2016


As such it is reasonable to then say that based on this information that American citizens are more likely to be the victims of a terrorist attacks stemming from right-wing ideologies above any other ideology on the basis of these statistics. Given then that 73% of attacks since 9/11 have had right-wing motivations it is reasonable to me to assert that right-wing terrorism poses the biggest terrorist threat to the United States of America.

So you asked for the information and I have just spoon fed it to you, if you still disagree then please either back up your argument, accept that your opinion is not backed up by facts or concede the point that right-wing terrorism poses a bigger threat to America than from any other ideology.

NOTE The OP is specifically talking about terrorism in the United States of America from after 9/11/2001 to present day, so don't even try coming at me by moving those goalposts.
That’s perfect. Obviously, i already knew the number. I just wanted you to post it. So 62 people have been killed by far right extremists since 2001.

So really, we should do some math to see what kind of numbers we are really talking about. Because saying things like, far right extremists are the biggest terrorist threat inside America, at 60% of all terrorist threats since 911. Sounds like we have a problem. The problem is the way you frame the statement. And that is why you keep repeating that you are frameing it a certain way. Yea. I get it. You are not straight out lieing when you frame the statement that way, but you are being dishonest in the sense that you know quite well that you are arbitrarily cutting off the date to exclude a terrorist event that killed over 3000 people. A fact that, if included in your data, would skew the results in such a drastic way that your argument looks rediculous. You are taking out all nuance to get the results you want, and when called out for this, you run back to your arbitrarily narrow study and say something like “according to all of the data you included in your study, the results say far right wingers at 62 kills in 17 years. And islamists killed 23 or whatever. But.....If you add one more days worth of data to your study, that number jumps to 3000+ for jihadists and 62 for right wingers.





edit on 14-1-2019 by Woodcarver because: (no reason given)

edit on 14-1-2019 by Woodcarver because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 14 2019 @ 02:50 PM
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originally posted by: OtherSideOfTheCoin
a reply to: FilthyUSMonkey




I don't think a lot of folks on ATS want to admit there is a big gorilla in these rooms.



I see you're kind of new here...not saying that to sound patronising but rather I think it might help you if I impart some advise.

ATS is a alt-right conspiracy forum with strong right leaning ideas being popular. Now lots of people like to deny that because there are one or two of us crazy libtards that like to mix it up a bit but if you've come over hear from a Reddit politics page then it might feel like you're a gay guy whose just walked into the local sunday school after having had your transexual girl-who-is-also-sometimes-a-boyfriend have a abortion trying to tell people that god is a myth and Trump was a bad guy...no you dont need all those guns and immigration isnt actually a bad thing if its sprinkled with a pinch of socialism. Few are ever going to agree with you no matter how good your evidence is, no matter how logical your argument is and no matter how well written your posts may be.

Dude, I 100% sympathise with you, I really do but I think you're also being really naive to expect some members to admit that actually, yeah, right-wing terrorism is a bit of a problem when they subscribe to a ideology that says the right is right and the left are a bunch of terrorist commies who are trying to steel their guns.

I am honestly surprised by how much support this thread has had so far really.

but yeah, if you think this is bad just wait to the crazy trump twitter thread. Really I find the best approach is to sometimes just let them wallow in their own ignorance and if they want to have the last post then let them have it, let them have the 40 plus stars they end up with as well.
the country used to say we will never forget 911, and here you are trying to get everybody to forget about it.



posted on Jan, 14 2019 @ 02:55 PM
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a reply to: Woodcarver

Ohhh this is embarrassing



That’s perfect. Obviously, i already knew the number. I just wanted you to post it. So 62 people have been killed by far right extremists since 2001.


Just to quote that because the actual number is 106 deaths from far right attacks. You’re getting the number of attacks and number of deaths confused. You said it twice so don’t even pretend it’s a typo.

Remind us all again now you “obviously”knew the number....

Also 2996 died on 9/11 as a direct result of the attacks including the attackers so to over 3000 as you state, I think you might want to review your numbers and try this again. Also every else is talking about the threat since 9/11so how about you also stop moving the goalposts around.
edit on 14-1-2019 by OtherSideOfTheCoin because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 14 2019 @ 03:01 PM
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originally posted by: OtherSideOfTheCoin
a reply to: Woodcarver

Ohhh this is embarrassing



That’s perfect. Obviously, i already knew the number. I just wanted you to post it. So 62 people have been killed by far right extremists since 2001.


Just to quote that because the actual number is 106 deaths your getting the number of attacks and number of deaths confused.

Remind us all again now you “obviously”knew the number....

Also 2996 died on 9/11 as a direct result of the attacks including the attackers so to over 3000 as you state, I think you might want to review your numbers and try this again. Also every else is talking about the threat since 9/11so how about you also stop moving the goalposts around.
Oops i did misread that. I did state earlier that it was around 100. Certainly a negligible mistake in this very unofficial setting.

Will you also admit to any shortcomings in your argument? Like the arbitrary yet obvious cutoff date? I mean, if the safety of Americans is the real issue, then why would you fudge numbers to make it appear that a group who had a fraction of the murders that extremist muslims have commited is the biggest threat to the country.

When the real threat is people who will be dishonest in their claims with the intent to hide the bigger threat.

You are literally fudging the numbers to protect the very people who have done the most damage to us in the same amount of time.






edit on 14-1-2019 by Woodcarver because: (no reason given)

edit on 14-1-2019 by Woodcarver because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 14 2019 @ 03:06 PM
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a reply to: Woodcarver




Oops i did misread that.


Ooops I think someone just got egg on his face and is trying to back track but ok...



Will you also admit to any shortcomings in your argument? Like the arbitrary yet obvious cutoff date?



No literally all I have been doing in my debate with you at least is pointing out facts, facts you still seem to be struggling to accept.

The OP was the one who decided to make this a thread about terrorist attacks since 9/11 not me. Now I do happen to think that is a reasonable cut off because times change and threats change. After 9/11 100% the biggest threat was violent Islamic extremists, now, in 2019, the statistics all seem to point to right-wing ideologies being a bigger terrorist threat.

You wanting to talk about 9/11 is you wanting to move the goalposts. Besides even at that, we are talking about the number of attacks not the number of deaths so its still not really all that significant.



posted on Jan, 14 2019 @ 03:09 PM
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originally posted by: OtherSideOfTheCoin
a reply to: Woodcarver




Oops i did misread that.


Ooops I think someone just got egg on his face and is trying to back track but ok...



Will you also admit to any shortcomings in your argument? Like the arbitrary yet obvious cutoff date?



No literally all I have been doing in my debate with you at least is pointing out facts, facts you still seem to be struggling to accept.

The OP was the one who decided to make this a thread about terrorist attacks since 9/11 not me. Now I do happen to think that is a reasonable cut off because times change and threats change. After 9/11 100% the biggest threat was violent Islamic extremists, now, in 2019, the statistics all seem to point to right-wing ideologies being a bigger terrorist threat.

You wanting to talk about 9/11 is you wanting to move the goalposts. Besides even at that, we are talking about the number of attacks not the number of deaths so its still not really all that significant.
You are purposefully fudging the numbers to protect the very people who attacked us. The group that is considered the biggest threat to the world right now.
edit on 14-1-2019 by Woodcarver because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 14 2019 @ 03:09 PM
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a reply to: Woodcarver




the country used to say we will never forget 911, and here you are trying to get everybody to forget about it.



No hear am I am telling everyone that since 9/11 73% of attacks have come from right-wing ideologies but just you keep on trying to misrepresent what I am saying and move those goalposts about now that you're on the ropes and know you have lost the argument.



posted on Jan, 14 2019 @ 03:10 PM
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originally posted by: Xcalibur254
a reply to: Propagandalf

And what happens when you look at the other Top 10 Worst Terror Attacks on US Soil? They're all committed by white supremacists of one kind or another.

9/11 was a tragedy but statistically speaking it's an outlier.

Serious question, on 9/10/01 did you believe that white supremacists were the biggest terror threat in the US?


I did actually. I remember the Oklahoma bombing more than I did the first World Trade Center bombing. The next day that belief was disproven, and Islamic terrorism changed all our lives for the worse.



posted on Jan, 14 2019 @ 03:11 PM
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a reply to: Woodcarver




You are purposefully fusging the numbers to protect the very people who attacked us.



Nope.

I am saying since 9/11 73% of attacks have come from right wing ideologies therefore that is where the biggest terrorist threat comes from in 2019 from a statistical stand point. Yet hear you are trying to pretend that I am protecting the 9/11 attackers, I am the same guy by the way who used to spend hours debunking 9/11 conspiracies because I hated how they protected those very same attackers.

But again just you keep trying to put words in my mouth now that you've lost the argument, keep making that stawman about 9/11....go on....
edit on 14-1-2019 by OtherSideOfTheCoin because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 14 2019 @ 03:12 PM
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originally posted by: OtherSideOfTheCoin
a reply to: Woodcarver




the country used to say we will never forget 911, and here you are trying to get everybody to forget about it.



No hear am I am telling everyone that since 9/11 73% of attacks have come from right-wing ideologies but just you keep on trying to misrepresent what I am saying and move those goalposts about now that you're on the ropes and know you have lost the argument.
I know, you keep repeating that. What i’m saying, is that you are framing it in such a way as to hide the fact that 9/11 even happened.

Islamic terror is by far the most likely kind of terror to be inflicted on anyone in the world.
edit on 14-1-2019 by Woodcarver because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 14 2019 @ 03:14 PM
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originally posted by: Woodcarver

originally posted by: OtherSideOfTheCoin
a reply to: Woodcarver




the country used to say we will never forget 911, and here you are trying to get everybody to forget about it.



No hear am I am telling everyone that since 9/11 73% of attacks have come from right-wing ideologies but just you keep on trying to misrepresent what I am saying and move those goalposts about now that you're on the ropes and know you have lost the argument.
I know, you keep repeating that. What i’m saying, is that you are framing it in such a way as to hide the fact that 9/11 even happened


No, am not, 9/11 happened.

Go through my history I have written several in-depth threads on it.

Not denying it, not pretending it didn't kill 2996 people.

I am saying since 9/11 73% of attacks have came had right wing ideological motivations. FACT.



Islamic terror is by far the most likely kind of terror to be inflicted on anyone in the world.



It might be, I dont have those stats to hand but what I do know is that in the United States 73% of attacks after 9/11 have came from right wing ideologies and thats what this thread is about.
edit on 14-1-2019 by OtherSideOfTheCoin because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 14 2019 @ 03:19 PM
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62 people since 2001. Pretty much what we all expected, but didn't want to waste time from our lives proving the study was ludicrous.

So what classification was the Orlando night club shooter who killed 49 people in a single night?



posted on Jan, 14 2019 @ 03:21 PM
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a reply to: jjkenobi




62 people since 2001. Pretty much what we all expected, but didn't want to waste time from our lives proving the study was ludicrous.


Nope, its 106 people from right wing attacks not 62

and 119 from Islamic attacks that includes the 49 people killed in the Orlando shooting.

Honestly you lot cry out for sources then don't bother to read them because they don't support your own views.
edit on 14-1-2019 by OtherSideOfTheCoin because: Clarification of answer initially was not clear that stats for islamic attacks included 49 killed in Orlando shooting.



posted on Jan, 14 2019 @ 03:22 PM
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originally posted by: QUANTUMGR4V17Y
This is all hilarious.

Total people killed by Far Right Extremists between 2000-2016 is 49... or about 3 per year.

Total People killed on 9/11/2001 by Islamic extremists 2,977.... Spread out over 15 years, that's nearly 300 per year.

Lightning kills ~27 per year...

Even vending machines are closing in on those domestic terrorists at an average of 2.18 deaths per year from 1978-1995

This is "far right extremist" stuff is a contrived narrative, trying to sway the masses with trigger words. AKA Propaganda.





Wahhabi Muslim branch that do the terrorist attacks are Qutubists and Wahbists aiming to destroy non utordox - they see left ing, freedom and insdividueals an illness of the mind - they're about as far right mental as you can get. (jiliah sp?)

Severeal thousand have died by right wing terror worldwide this millenia - instead of playing blame game - left vs right we hould be uniting to comdemn uch atrocities.



posted on Jan, 14 2019 @ 03:22 PM
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originally posted by: OtherSideOfTheCoin
a reply to: Woodcarver




You are purposefully fusging the numbers to protect the very people who attacked us.



Nope.

I am saying since 9/11 73% of attacks have come from right wing ideologies therefore that is where the biggest terrorist threat comes from in 2019 from a statistical stand point. Yet hear you are trying to pretend that I am protecting the 9/11 attackers, I am the same guy by the way who used to spend hours debunking 9/11 conspiracies because I hated how they protected those very same attackers.

But again just you keep trying to put words in my mouth now that you've lost the argument, keep making that stawman about 9/11....go on....
I haven’t mistated anything you have said. You are fudging the numbers to get the results you want. Will you at least admit to that? You agree with the cutoff date because? No one else in the country thinks that we were any safer after 9/11, than before. For years people lived in terror over that event. Security went through the roof. The patriot act made sure that everybody was watched at all times. Anyone with a middle east sounding name was scrutinized to the extreme. That is why muslim terror has fallen to such low numbers in the US. You sound like Jim Acosta standing by the wall saying “no problems here”!!

Ignoring the real threat to point out 106 deaths over a 17 year span. As well as the 100’s of attacks that are carried out in other countries
edit on 14-1-2019 by Woodcarver because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 14 2019 @ 03:25 PM
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originally posted by: bastion

originally posted by: QUANTUMGR4V17Y
This is all hilarious.

Total people killed by Far Right Extremists between 2000-2016 is 49... or about 3 per year.

Total People killed on 9/11/2001 by Islamic extremists 2,977.... Spread out over 15 years, that's nearly 300 per year.

Lightning kills ~27 per year...

Even vending machines are closing in on those domestic terrorists at an average of 2.18 deaths per year from 1978-1995

This is "far right extremist" stuff is a contrived narrative, trying to sway the masses with trigger words. AKA Propaganda.





Wahhabi Muslim branch that do the terrorist attacks are Qutubists and Wahbists aiming to destroy non utordox - they see left ing, freedom and insdividueals an illness of the mind - they're about as far right mental as you can get. (jiliah sp?)

Severeal thousand have died by right wing terror worldwide this millenia - instead of playing blame game - left vs right we hould be uniting to comdemn uch atrocities.


I could agree. I have not checked, and you offered no sources.

Moot point anyway - this thread is about domestic terrorism.



posted on Jan, 14 2019 @ 03:26 PM
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a reply to: Woodcarver

We are talking about numbers of attacks not numbers of deaths

If you want to include 9/11 in the number of attacks its has a negligible effect on that percentage.

However.

You are deliberately trying to use 9/11 to fudge the numbers not me. The thread is about attacks after 9/11 so what then would we be talking about 9/11?

You're losing this debate so hard at every level I feel sorry for you so am going to stop replying to you until such a time you can stop get with the rest of us and accept that since 9/11 73% of attacks have come from right wing ideologies thus making right wing terrorism the biggest threat statistically.
edit on 14-1-2019 by OtherSideOfTheCoin because: (no reason given)




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