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Tell me Progressives... How is a wall immoral?

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posted on Jan, 12 2019 @ 07:40 AM
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a reply to: gortex


Democrats have signaled their opposition to the wall from the outset so it's obvious they will not agree to funding it

Did Trump not run on the construction of the wall? He has spent his entire political career advocating for a wall! Again, how is that any different?


the immoral part comes in when the President of the United States uses American citizens as hostages to force Democrats to back down.

But again, how is it not immoral that the Democrats are using the same American citizens as hostages to make Trump back down?

What is the difference?


When a guy who is supposed (by himself) to be a great deal maker resorts to blackmail...

Blackmail?

Who has he blackmailed? What dirt has he threatened to expose on the DNC if they don't do as he says?

A large part of negotiation is the willingness to walk away from the table. That's not blackmail, sir. Need a dictionary?


How is it that politicians still get paid during the shutdown while those who can least afford it are made to suffer ?

I agree. Oh, wait, Trump isn't getting paid... he donates his salary to the Treasury. Pelosi and Schumer are getting paid.

TheRedneck




posted on Jan, 12 2019 @ 07:42 AM
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a reply to: Sillyolme


A wall sends the exact opposite message that the statue of Liberty does.

The Statue of Liberty is standing in a port of entry.

The wall covers areas which are not ports of entry.

Illegal immigration is the opposite of legal immigration... so I'd say that is appropriate.

TheRedneck



posted on Jan, 12 2019 @ 07:46 AM
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a reply to: jimmyx


AND HAVE MEXICO PAY FOR IT!......that was the rest of the promise he made in the same sentence....can you grasp sentence structure?

Can you grasp financial concepts?

If I buy a rental house and rent it out for more than it cost me to buy it, it pays for itself. That doesn't mean it wrote me a check to buy it. I still had to front the money, but the cost was offset.

This is one of the most ludicrous arguments I have heard to date, and it's time it was called out in force. No one with any common sense thought the government of Mexico was going to write a damned check for the wall! If you did, then bless yore heart, you pore thing.

TheRedneck



posted on Jan, 12 2019 @ 07:49 AM
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a reply to: TheRedneck




Did Trump not run on the construction of the wall?

Politicians run on all manor of manifesto promises , some they achieve others they don't it's the way of things.



But again, how is it not immoral that the Democrats are using the same American citizens as hostages to make Trump back down?

Trump is in the driving seat , has a way of forcing it through which he has threatened but doesn't have the courage to do.



I agree. Oh, wait, Trump isn't getting paid

The point wasn't about the Billionaire President but all politicians on both sides , why should they get paid while their workers don't.



posted on Jan, 12 2019 @ 07:50 AM
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a reply to: Unruhestifter




Trump was elected. One of his promises was to build a wall. Therefore building a wall is one of his mandates.


So you support the ACA? Obamacare?



posted on Jan, 12 2019 @ 07:56 AM
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a reply to: gortex


Politicians run on all manor of manifesto promises , some they achieve others they don't it's the way of things.

Whoa! Did we just experience a shift in the space-time continuum here? A couple posts back you were saying that was immoral, but only if Trump did it. Now you say it's OK because everyone does it?

I've heard of moving the goal posts, but taking them down and locking them in the garage is a new one on me.


Trump is in the driving seat , has a way of forcing it through which he has threatened but doesn't have the courage to do.

So you support Trump calling a National Emergency Declaration to fund the wall? Good to know.


The point wasn't about the Billionaire President but all politicians on both sides , why should they get paid while their workers don't.

And I agree with that point. My point, though, was that the only politician that isn't getting paid through all of this is the one you are blaming for it.

You seem to support the other politicians who are getting paid, even though you don't like them getting paid.

TheRedneck



posted on Jan, 12 2019 @ 08:00 AM
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a reply to: TheRedneck




How is it immoral for Trump to do it, but moral for Democrats to do it? I still haven't got an answer to that one.


Not about the morality part, but are you ok that Obama shut down the Govt. to get what he wanted?



posted on Jan, 12 2019 @ 08:02 AM
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a reply to: Unruhestifter

It is immoral because it makes it harder for votes to get in.

My question is if it is immoral now and not when you voted for it before then, what happen to you to change your mind on its immorality?

Did these people who voted for the wall before, have some kind of spiritual awakening?

Oh yeah, that's right they are politicians and they will say anything to garner a vote and at any cost. Screw the citizens. But keep paying those taxes, you little bitches. Both sides do it. It's sad really.



posted on Jan, 12 2019 @ 08:02 AM
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a reply to: TheRedneck




the only politician that isn't getting paid


You actually believe this? lol



posted on Jan, 12 2019 @ 08:03 AM
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a reply to: TheRedneck




Whoa! Did we just experience a shift in the space-time continuum here? A couple posts back you were saying that was immoral, but only if Trump did it. Now you say it's OK because everyone does it? I've heard of moving the goal posts, but taking them down and locking them in the garage is a new one on me.

In that case you obviously misunderstood my post.



So you support Trump calling a National Emergency Declaration to fund the wall? Good to know.

It's a tool he says he has so rather than threaten it why not use it.



And I agree with that point. My point, though, was that the only politician that isn't getting paid through all of this is the one you are blaming for it.

The one to blame for all this has the luxury of not needing the chump change that is the Presidents salary.



You seem to support the other politicians who are getting paid, even though you don't like them getting paid.

I don't support any politicians , I think they're all self serving scumbags ... that's both sides of the pond.



posted on Jan, 12 2019 @ 08:18 AM
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originally posted by: Sillyolme
a reply to: Unruhestifter

A wall sends the exact opposite message that the statue of Liberty does.
Thats the simple answer....
This is not what America is about...
The land of opportunity for your ancestors and mine.
Give me your tired, your poor, Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free, The wretched refuse of your teeming shore. Send these, the homeless, tempest-tossed to me, I lift my lamp beside the golden door!

Nowhere does it say send your rich and educated, send the best people and only those who can contribute. Keep the sick and keep the poor we dont want em.....

You know..... In A Nut Shell


Sounds good, doesnt work.



posted on Jan, 12 2019 @ 08:36 AM
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A wall would go a long ways to curb people entering the US illegally from the southern border. It's the democrats playing politics that caused this shutdown. What's 5 billion, when the government spends over 1 Trillion a year. Congress just recently passed a $550 Billion dollar Military budget.

Why should Democrats care about securing our border. Most of them live in a gated community, that has walls and armed security guards.

Illegals commit more crimes than Americans do. Every single illegal committed a crime by entering our country illegally, that way we call them Illegals aliens. Democrats refuse to admit people violating our immigration laws have committed a crime.



posted on Jan, 12 2019 @ 08:43 AM
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a reply to: tinner07


Not about the morality part, but are you ok that Obama shut down the Govt. to get what he wanted?

To be honest, I didn't even know he did. My country was under an occupation during that time and I wasn't permitted to express disapproval.

If he did, then I certainly would have opposed it had I been permitted to have an opinion. But it didn't matter then, so why should now be any different? At least you get to openly oppose the policy.

TheRedneck



posted on Jan, 12 2019 @ 08:45 AM
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originally posted by: Sillyolme
a reply to: Unruhestifter

A wall sends the exact opposite message that the statue of Liberty does.
Thats the simple answer....
This is not what America is about...
The land of opportunity for your ancestors and mine.
Give me your tired, your poor, Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free, The wretched refuse of your teeming shore. Send these, the homeless, tempest-tossed to me, I lift my lamp beside the golden door!

Nowhere does it say send your rich and educated, send the best people and only those who can contribute. Keep the sick and keep the poor we dont want em.....

You know..... In A Nut Shell





posted on Jan, 12 2019 @ 08:55 AM
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a reply to: gortex


In that case you obviously misunderstood my post.

Obviously. Now is your opportunity to clarify.


It's a tool he says he has so rather than threaten it why not use it.

So do you or do you not support Trump declaring a National Emergency to divert military funds for a southern border wall construction? I don't want to misunderstand you again.


The one to blame for all this has the luxury of not needing the chump change that is the Presidents salary.

At what point does someone not deserve to be paid?

Nancy Pelosi has a net worth of over $100 million. A real pauper, that one. What would she do if she missed a paycheck?

Chuck Schumer has a net worth of just under $1 million. Not so bad there. He probably does need his paycheck, being from New York and all.


I don't support any politicians , I think they're all self serving scumbags ... that's both sides of the pond.

I agree... well, except so far I do support Trump. He's actually tried to do what he said he would. I'm sure that will change eventually.

TheRedneck



posted on Jan, 12 2019 @ 08:56 AM
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a reply to: Unruhestifter


]]]



posted on Jan, 12 2019 @ 09:05 AM
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originally posted by: OtherSideOfTheCoin
It’s not that a wall is immoral in itself but rather opponents of the wall argue that it is immoral to use it to continue the shut down, holding workers pay cheques hostage to play political games and use it to detract from other issues. I think one of the sound bites recently what that a wall isn’t immoral but I effective.


Not true

The leader of the Dems said the wall is immoral

It is they using that language playing games and causing the shutdown



posted on Jan, 12 2019 @ 09:08 AM
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5 billion doesn't get the wall. 5 billion gets 215 miles of a wall. That's it.



posted on Jan, 12 2019 @ 09:08 AM
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a reply to: gortex

So it’s immoral and blackmail for trump to not give up on the wall because it’s using workers as blackmail

But it’s not immoral for the democrats to not give in and give trump the money for the wall which is using workers as blackmail

Please explain



posted on Jan, 12 2019 @ 09:09 AM
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a reply to: TheRedneck

The biggest difference would be that they did not order a government shutdown depriving those americans of their livelihood. For one....




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