Now it's only a waiting game

a reply to: Iscool

If the past is any indicator, it won't matter what the actual reasons are, folks will blame Trump.

a reply to: carewemust

Shep feels a bit different. And makes a good points in the video.
www.mediaite.com...

The dems and repubs put 4 bills forward with bipartisan support. One of those would pay the tsa , another would be funding for tax returns.
Trump said no.

All trump has is is tiny base. That's not going to be enough.

The first time a bipartisan bill was put forward 7 repubs in the house flipped and voted for it. The 2ed time it was 8 repub flips.
How bad do you think it will have to get with the government before dems are able to flip enough repub senators to impeach over the shutdown?
Because the shut down and what it is doing to the families of government workers is an issue that can get a president impeach much faster than the alleged corruption, laundering, collusion can.

They flipped 8 so far on the wall issue. They only need 20 to flip for impeachment. I wonder if those 8 will be willing to impeach if the shut down last another few weeks?

a reply to: TheRedneck

The dems AND the repubs have been working TOGETHER to get those people paid .

It's trump that keeps saying no.

originally posted by: JinMI
a reply to: Iscool

If the past is any indicator, it won't matter what the actual reasons are, folks will blame Trump.

I'm fairly certain that's all by design, after they realized he was going to be elected even with the negative press they changed strategy, now he's the scapegoat..

a reply to: ketsuko

Wrong.

The dems have negotiated. They even flipped 8 repubs to their side.

They put FOUR bills forward to fund the most important parts of government.

Trump was the one that said no.

www.mediaite.com...

a reply to: Iscool

The thing is congress is trying. But trump says no.

www.mediaite.com...

originally posted by: TheRedneck
a reply to: carewemust

just make it illegal for mortgage companies to foreclose or utility companies to shut off service to affected Federal employees until the dispute is resolved.

How is that OK?

They are not responsible for Trump shutting down the government.

a reply to: scraedtosleep

The dems AND the repubs have been working TOGETHER to get those people paid .

It's trump that keeps saying no.

What is the legislation? It's easy to see if Trump vetoed it.

TheRedneck

a reply to: Annee

How is that OK?

They are not responsible for Trump shutting down the government.

Firstly, it's nice to see you are so unsympathetic towards the furloughed workers. Make 'em scream until they vote against Trump, amirite? Hate much?

Secondly, which bill has Trump vetoed?

TheRedneck

a reply to: scraedtosleep

After listening to the Sean Hannity interview of President Trump tonight, My gut feeling says that President Trump will do these 2 things simultaneously.

1. Tell Mitch McConnell that he will sign the 2019 funding bill that was passed out of the House in late December. Even though the House was Republican controlled and the bill contained $7.5 Billion for Border Security, it was passed with a majority of both Democrats and Republicans voting "YEA".

2. Declare the Emergency, which will free up the funds for getting the border wall built.

The Federal Government will re-open quickly, and Wall Construction will begin later this Spring. Everyone's paid and America is on its way to reducing deaths of U.S. citizens from Illegal Aliens and Heroin.

Americans would view Democrats as extra callous, if they fought against those actions, at this point.

originally posted by: carewemust
a reply to: scraedtosleep

After listening to the Sean Hannity interview of President Trump tonight, My gut feeling says that President Trump will do these 2 things simultaneously.

1. Tell Mitch McConnell that he will sign the 2019 funding bill that was passed out of the House in late December. Even though the House was Republican controlled and the bill contained $7.5 Billion for Border Security, it was passed with a majority of both Democrats and Republicans voting "YEA".

2. Declare the Emergency, which will free up the funds for getting the border wall built.

The Federal Government will re-open quickly, and Wall Construction will begin later this Spring. Everyone's paid and America is on its way to reducing deaths of U.S. citizens from Illegal Aliens and Heroin.

Americans would view Democrats as extra callous, if they fought against those actions, at this point.

I’m pretty sure the VAST majority of Americans already view the democrats as ‘extra callous’.

And in case you’re forgetting, Orange Man Bad. Of course they’ll fight against those actions.

a reply to: TheRedneck

Shep brakes it down in this video.

www.mediaite.com...

Out of all four of the current bills only one has passed the house. But the other three are already known to have the support in the house.
congress.gov...

The bill provides appropriations to DOT for

the Office of the Secretary,
the Federal Aviation Administration,
the Federal Highway Administration,
the Federal Motor Carrier Safety Administration,
the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration,
the Federal Railroad Administration,
the Federal Transit Administration,
the Saint Lawrence Seaway Development Corporation,
the Maritime Administration,
the Pipeline and Hazardous Materials Safety Administration, and
the Office of Inspector General.

The bill provides appropriations to HUD for

Management and Administration,
Program Office Salaries and Expenses,
Public and Indian Housing,
Community Planning and Development,
Housing Programs,
the Federal Housing Administration,
the Government National Mortgage Association (Ginnie Mae),
Policy Development and Research,
Fair Housing and Equal Opportunity,
the Office of Lead Hazard Control and Healthy Homes,
the Information Technology Fund, and
the Office of Inspector General.

The bill also provides appropriations to several related agencies, including

the Access Board,
the Federal Maritime Commission,
the National Railroad Passenger Corporation (Amtrak) Office of Inspector General,
the National Transportation Safety Board,
the Neighborhood Reinvestment Corporation,
the Surface Transportation Board, and
the U.S. Interagency Council on Homelessness.

a reply to: scraedtosleep

Shep brakes it down in this video.

And the price of garbanzo beans in Beijing is up by 5%, so I hear.

I didn't ask what "Shep" said... I didn't ask for anyone's opinion. I asked you what legislation had passed the Congress for the President to sign. None of the bills you mention have passed the Congress, by your own statements... one has passed the House. We have this thing called the Senate which also has to pass it. Only then can Trump do anything. He's not the legislature! He has nothing to do with the legislature!

What he said means squat. What he threatened means squat. What he tweeted means squat. Unless and until the US Congress puts a bill on President Trump's desk, he cannot sign or veto anything. You want him to take the blame for the shutdown? Put a bill on his desk and let him veto it.

So, now that (I hope) you have some semblance of a primitive understanding of American civics, I ask you again: what bill has been passed by the Congress? It's not that hard a question... the answer needs to start with "HR-" if it is in the House or "S-" if it is in the Senate. Any bill that has passed will have both numbers; I only need one of 'em.

TheRedneck

a reply to: TheRedneck

what bill has been passed by the Congress?

I linked to the bill that passed the house in my reply to you.
www.congress.gov...

Will the senate pass it?
Trump says he wont pass any funding that doesn't include a wall.

Here is another passed in the house.
www.congress.gov...

This link will show you all the bills that deal with appropriations and were they are at.
www.congress.gov... ltViewType=expanded

a reply to: scraedtosleep

I linked to the bill that passed the house in my reply to you.

And I explained that the House is not all of Congress. Has the Senate passed it?

Trump says he wont pass any funding that doesn't include a wall.

Carrots are down 1% in Beijing.

Has it reached his desk?

Here is another passed in the house.

Which has not passed the Senate.

This link will show you all the bills that deal with appropriations and were they are at.

None of which have passed both houses of Congress, and therefore none of which can be signed or vetoed by the President.

Is there a bill Trump has vetoed, or not? That's even easier... yes or no.

TheRedneck

a reply to: TheRedneck

Has the Senate passed it?

Not yet.

Has it reached his desk?

Do you think he will sign it?

Is there a bill Trump has vetoed

No.
But his advisers said this.

“If either H.R. 21 or H.J. Res. 1 were presented to the President, his advisors would recommend that he veto the bill,” the White House said in a veto threat against the plans passed by House Democrats in the opening hours of the 116th Congress.

Do you believe that trump will sign the already passed by the house bills if the senate passes them and they have NO funding for the wall?

If the senate doesn't pass it who is to blame?
If the senate does pass it but trump wont sign , who is to blame?

My point was that the dems and repubs in the house are trying to negotiate and get funding for things that are important.

a reply to: TheRedneck

In my most sarcastic Mr. Miyagi tone, it’s hard to throw things at the wall to see if they will stick when there is no wall.

We see that argument style used time and time again. When Ohio was considering passing Concealed Carry a few years ago, the argument was blood in the streets from shootouts like the Wild West. Ohio was considering gambling casios, the argument was that crime and prostitution would skyrocket.

Trump should use the declaration of a State of Emergency to address other problems like a major crackdown on sanctuary cities and oppressive gun control laws like the recent one in NJ but especially target the people running them and leave the wall out of it until the end if he can not wrangle a concession out of the House for the wall on their own to shop his other actions.

Let the Press sky scream that Trump is hunting Liberal Democrats while actually combating Totalitarians. What he that wall happen from the reverberations up the chain like magic.

a reply to: TheRedneck

Even then, the argument cannot be made that the Dems are doing nothing to get the government back up and running. Either the Senate doesn't pass the bills and the blame now falls to the GOP; they pass the Senate but get vetoed by Trump in which case blame now falls to him; or they make it through the Senate and get signed by Trump which gives the Dems a political victory and makes Trump look weak.

Regardless of whether they actually care about government workers getting paid (they don't) the Dems have played a better game. They proposed bipartisan bills that made it through the House. At this point their job is done and the continuation of the shutdown now falls on the shoulders of the GOP Senators and Trump.

originally posted by: ketsuko
He'll declare a national emergency before it gets to true Armgeddon status, but he needs everyone to feel that it's justified and not a stunt before he does, and in the meantime, the Democrats could always come talk turkey.

Good, someone actually paying attention...and understanding how this game is being played.

Trump said he would not sign another appropriations bill that does not have money for the wall. Pelosi and Schumer are trying to jam through spending bills without money for the wall. So, the Government (parts of it anyway) had to shut down because Congress did not present the President with something he could sign.

Trump has held multiple meetings at the White House with the Dems...but they refuse to provide any funding for the wall (the most Pelosi has offered so far is $1...and that was just in jest). Pelosi even had the nerve to tell the President even if he allowed the Government to reopen, she still wouldn't give him any money for the wall. So, the Government remains closed.

Trump has tried to negotiate, but the Dems refuse to budge...he has addressed the nation about the seriousness of the situation on the border...he has personally visited the border and spoken to the boots on the ground there...

So, now (whenever he choses) POTUS can declare a National Emergency, build the wall with DND (and other available) funds, and reopen the Government without any employees suffering more than a week or two delay in getting their pay cheques.

Summarized as Trump wins, Pelosi and Schumer lose.

If, in order to avoid this total crushing defeat the Democrats cave in and give Trump what he wants to build the wall...Trump wins, Pelosi and Schumer lose.

It is checkmate for Trump in two moves, no matter what the Dems do...but they can't seem to see it.

a reply to: Xcalibur254

What the Democrats are doing is trying to prove that Trump is weak without the Republicans controlling both the House and Senate. And he is weaker without that control, but Trump is not the kind of person to admit that by any concession.

The real danger to this game is that government workers may have to look for other work. And if those numbers are high enough, there may be some serious problems in justifying hiring replacements. Especially when claims of “cutting the budget” have been made.

With that in mind, the wall being built at the moment is the one people may find themselves up against in the near future.