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The "Walls Don't Work" Argument is the Stupidest One Yet.

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posted on Jan, 11 2019 @ 05:30 AM
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a reply to: Propagandalf

I think people that have an issue with boarders should test it out at home

Your walls around your house is a boarder and you have a front door usually locked. For security purposes. Why?. Because some people cant be trusted.

Why don't you remove your front door when you goto work next and leave that boarder open. What do you think would happen?.

But their happy for your country to have an unlocked door for everyone to enter.




posted on Jan, 11 2019 @ 07:49 AM
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Your wall is made with inferior parts, I wonder why. Prototypes being built are made with final products according to DHS.

DHS Test Cut Right Through Trump’s Border Wall Steel Slats with a Saw.

www.thedailybeast.com...

Only in America.
edit on America/ChicagoFri, 11 Jan 2019 07:49:49 -0600Fri, 11 Jan 2019 07:49:49 -06002019-01-11T07:49:49-06:00k by errck because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 11 2019 @ 08:26 AM
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a reply to: interupt42

A wall is a first line of defense or deterrent. Apparently, attempting those other options has been ineffective in the past 30 years. Most likely due to the steady stream of illegal immigrants.

Border patrol have stated that we need more walls. It reduces illegal entry and allows them to do their jobs more effectively.

I have seen the facts and expert opinions for the wall. Those against have not provided the facts or stats for why more walls will not be effective.

By limiting the continuous flow at the border, more focus can be made towards those illegals already inside the US borders. Those that overstay or do not appear for court hearings, all have been documented. In time they will not be so difficult to find. Just time and resources.

Undocumented illegals though are more difficult to track and it is this group that usually has the higher percentage of criminality. Not the documented overstayers.



posted on Jan, 11 2019 @ 09:42 AM
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a reply to: CynConcepts




A wall is a first line of defense or deterrent.


Not really.

if your son sits in your house telling the world to come grab your stuff , your first deterrent is not to build a fence. Its to tell your son to stop telling the world to come grab your stuff.

If you build that fence first as your son continues to tell the world to come get your stuff , how effective will that fence be?

Especially , if your son is telling them that the only consequence of getting caught crossing the fence is that they just get sent back to the other side to try again. Its an uphill unwinnable fight . You need to first tell your son to shut up and then see if you still need that fence after he stopped encouraging people to come get your stuff.



Apparently, attempting those other options has been ineffective in the past 30 years. Most likely due to the steady stream of illegal immigrants.


Its been ineffective because they have PURPOSELY MADE it ineffective. The reality is that illegal immigrants are in fact a very big part of our economy. They have not made it cost prohibitive for Americans companies to not hire them.

In addition, the system we have in place to ensure illegals don't come is a smoke screen. I have seen this first hand. I wrote about this in one of my prior posts. See quote below



I had an employee give me their SS# and it was something like 111-11-1111. I sent the SS to an external reputable payroll and vetting company expecting to come back with a big Hell no that isn't a legit SS#. I was shocked when they said its valid , even the payroll company lady was scratching her head. After pursuing it further from her end she found out its not an uncommon shared number but still stumped that it comes back as valid. Long story short I find out later that in fact she was an illegal. In essence the system is setup to give an appearance there are measures in place to prevent the hiring or illegals. In reality, the system looks the other way and it allows illegals to be hired legally.





Border patrol have stated that we need more walls. It reduces illegal entry and allows them to do their jobs more effectively



They need more walls because they have not removed the incentives for illegals to come to the US. American companies are hiring them therefore they are coming in mass numbers because its worth coming illegally.

As long as illegals get benefit and are able to get work in the US they WILL CONTINUE to come in mass numbers , because its worth using the little money they have to come illegally. Now if they cant get jobs or benefits coming illegally they will not be using the little money they have to cross illegally. The mass influx of illegally would significantly decrease.

That is why a wall is not needed on the Canadian border. There is no benefit for a Canadian to cross illegally to the US to get a below minimum wage job to send money back to their family in Canada and then retire in 10 years. The cost of living between the US and Canada is too close. You can't survive with below minimum wage in the US or Canada. However, with below minimum wage in Mexico you can survive rather well in Mexico and retire in 10 years or so of work in the US.

In summary:
Canadians no incentive to come = no mass influx of illegals
Latin America has incentive to come = mass influx of illegals

Just like the drug war is pointless and wasteful money pit due to the American demand for drugs so will be the wall if you don't take care of the American companies demands for illegal workers. If their is a demand it will be met.




By limiting the continuous flow at the border, more focus can be made towards those illegals already inside the US borders.



Right, but you limit that continuous flow by reducing the demand by not encouraging them to come forrrr jobs and benefits.

Once you make it cost prohibitive for American companies to hire illegals ,illegals wont be able to get jobs or benefits.

1. If illegals can't get jobs or benefits the majority of them will not use the little money they have to go to another country illegally where they aren't only not wanted but unable to support themselves or their families back home. Zero reason or incentives to come here illegally.

That allows you to better use your existing resources to keep an eye on the few that come with bad intention. That is why the wall is not needed on the Canadian side. Canadians have 0 incentives to come here illegally.

2. That leaves as you stated those "illegals already inside the US borders" which overstayed on their visa.

By making it cost prohibitive for American companies to hire illegals the illegals wont be able to get jobs. Therefore they will have to go back home. The wall wont fix this at all.

3. What about the Undocumented illegals .
Again by making it cost prohibitive for American companies to hire illegals the illegals wont be able to get jobs. Therefore they will have to go back home. The wall wont fix this at all but going after American companies will fix it and wont cost billions.

4. If you still have a problem. then build the wall or sections of the wall.My bet is that you wont require the wall or as much sections as you think just like on the Canadian side.


Again I'm not against the wall , I just think we need to REALLY first go after the American companies and benefits that make illegals come here. Eitherwise you are fighting an uphill battle that will become as useless and costly as the war on drugs.



edit on 11131America/ChicagoFri, 11 Jan 2019 10:11:06 -0600000000p3142 by interupt42 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 11 2019 @ 11:55 AM
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I love this story from a San Diego news station. CNN had an opportunity to inform its viewers about the reality at the border. But instead it maintained its position is the propaganda arm of the opposition party.



SAN DIEGO (KUSI) – Thursday morning, CNN called the KUSI Newsroom asking if one of our reporters could give them a local view of the debate surrounding the border wall and government shutdown.

KUSI offered our own Dan Plante, who has reported dozens of times on the border, including one story from 2016 that was retweeted by former Speaker of the House, Newt Gingrich, and posted on DrudgeReport.com. The Border Fence Tour is below.

We believe CNN declined a report from KUSI because we informed them that most Border Patrol Agents we have spoken to told us the barrier does in fact work.

We have continuously been told by Border Patrol Agents that the barrier along the Southern border helps prevent illegal entries, drugs, and weapons from entering the United States, and the numbers prove it.


CNN requests KUSI for local view on the border, declines our reporter after finding out wall works

Sounds about right.
edit on 11-1-2019 by Propagandalf because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 11 2019 @ 11:57 AM
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originally posted by: errck
Your wall is made with inferior parts, I wonder why. Prototypes being built are made with final products according to DHS.

DHS Test Cut Right Through Trump’s Border Wall Steel Slats with a Saw.

www.thedailybeast.com...

Only in America.


Your media is made from inferior parts. Nothing is indestructible.



posted on Jan, 11 2019 @ 11:59 AM
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originally posted by: Propagandalf

originally posted by: dug88
How would a wall have stopped these 600,000 people from being in america illegally in 2017?


The wall is being proposed along the US/Mexico border, not at legal points of entry.


The wall not work because most terrorists do not come through the southern border. Plain and simple.

Trump and his moron supporters think it is fiscally responsible to fund the largest infrastructure project in US history to stop illegal immigration that is currently at a 46 year low. Not only that, but they want to put massive amounts of capital into this project instead of addressing the actual areas where terrorists enter this country.

The best word to describe that mindset is idiotic.
edit on 11-1-2019 by BlackJackal because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 11 2019 @ 12:02 PM
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a reply to: BlackJackal




Trump and his moron supporters think....


How exactly is anyone supposed to take your argument seriously?

This coming from the same person who believes that ATS is a "far-right website."



posted on Jan, 11 2019 @ 12:06 PM
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a reply to: BlackJackal




The wall not work because most terrorists do not come through the southern border. Plain and simple.


CNN is rotting some brains, plain and simple. The wall isn't about stopping terrorists, but stemming the tide of illegal immigration coming over the southern border.

Is that what you really thought this whole thing was about? Excuse me while I laugh.



posted on Jan, 11 2019 @ 12:38 PM
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originally posted by: Propagandalf
a reply to: BlackJackal




The wall not work because most terrorists do not come through the southern border. Plain and simple.


CNN is rotting some brains, plain and simple. The wall isn't about stopping terrorists, but stemming the tide of illegal immigration coming over the southern border.

Is that what you really thought this whole thing was about? Excuse me while I laugh.


The Whitehouse must watch a lot of CNN then, since the connection between the border wall and terrorism has been repeatedly made by them.



posted on Jan, 11 2019 @ 12:40 PM
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originally posted by: ScepticScot

originally posted by: Propagandalf
a reply to: BlackJackal




The wall not work because most terrorists do not come through the southern border. Plain and simple.


CNN is rotting some brains, plain and simple. The wall isn't about stopping terrorists, but stemming the tide of illegal immigration coming over the southern border.

Is that what you really thought this whole thing was about? Excuse me while I laugh.


The Whitehouse must watch a lot of CNN then, since the connection between the border wall and terrorism has been repeatedly made by them.



Of course, the potential of terrorists coming over the border is still there. Are you also saying the wall was proposed to stop terrorists?

here's some more CNN for you.


Roughly a dozen individuals who are not US citizens and are on the terror watchlist were encountered by federal officials at the US southern border from October 2017 to October 2018, according to an administration official familiar with data from Customs and Border Protection.


www.cnn.com...
edit on 11-1-2019 by Propagandalf because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 11 2019 @ 12:51 PM
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originally posted by: Propagandalf

originally posted by: ScepticScot

originally posted by: Propagandalf
a reply to: BlackJackal




The wall not work because most terrorists do not come through the southern border. Plain and simple.


CNN is rotting some brains, plain and simple. The wall isn't about stopping terrorists, but stemming the tide of illegal immigration coming over the southern border.

Is that what you really thought this whole thing was about? Excuse me while I laugh.


The Whitehouse must watch a lot of CNN then, since the connection between the border wall and terrorism has been repeatedly made by them.



Of course, the potential of terrorists coming over the border is still there. Are you also saying the wall was proposed to stop terrorists?


The connection was made by the Whitehouse (using inaccurate figures).



posted on Jan, 11 2019 @ 12:58 PM
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a reply to: ScepticScot

Stopping terrorists from breaking into the country over the southern border is one of many reasons for proposed border wall and security. More common sense.



posted on Jan, 11 2019 @ 01:00 PM
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originally posted by: Propagandalf
a reply to: ScepticScot

Stopping terrorists from breaking into the country over the southern border is one of many reasons for proposed border wall and security. More common sense.


So now it is about stopping terrorists?



posted on Jan, 11 2019 @ 01:03 PM
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originally posted by: ScepticScot

originally posted by: Propagandalf
a reply to: ScepticScot

Stopping terrorists from breaking into the country over the southern border is one of many reasons for proposed border wall and security. More common sense.


So now it is about stopping terrorists?


From coming over the southern border. Why won't you say that?

You can't, because you and your ilk need strawmen to help alleviate your cognitive dissonance.

edit on 11-1-2019 by Propagandalf because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 11 2019 @ 01:05 PM
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a reply to: dug88

Cancel VISA's. Recalled them all. Carter did it.



posted on Jan, 11 2019 @ 01:06 PM
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a reply to: ScepticScot

Says who?



posted on Jan, 11 2019 @ 01:07 PM
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originally posted by: Propagandalf

originally posted by: ScepticScot

originally posted by: Propagandalf
a reply to: ScepticScot

Stopping terrorists from breaking into the country over the southern border is one of many reasons for proposed border wall and security. More common sense.


So now it is about stopping terrorists?


From coming over the southern border. Why won't you say that?

You can't, because you and your ilk need strawmen to help alleviate your cognitive dissonance.


Because you gave an insulting reply to Blackjakal where you said the point was not to stop terrorists.

Once pointed out that the Whitehouse had used this as a justification you do a complete 180.

And again you result to insults.



posted on Jan, 11 2019 @ 01:07 PM
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originally posted by: matafuchs
a reply to: ScepticScot

Says who?


Who says what?



posted on Jan, 11 2019 @ 01:17 PM
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originally posted by: ScepticScot

originally posted by: Propagandalf

originally posted by: ScepticScot

originally posted by: Propagandalf
a reply to: ScepticScot

Stopping terrorists from breaking into the country over the southern border is one of many reasons for proposed border wall and security. More common sense.


So now it is about stopping terrorists?


From coming over the southern border. Why won't you say that?

You can't, because you and your ilk need strawmen to help alleviate your cognitive dissonance.


Because you gave an insulting reply to Blackjakal where you said the point was not to stop terrorists.

Once pointed out that the Whitehouse had used this as a justification you do a complete 180.

And again you result to insults.


You guys are deserving of insults. You might just have to deal with that.

The wall isn't about stopping terrorists, but stemming the tide of illegal immigration coming over the southern border.

Is my statement true or false?




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