What the Shut down is really about

Well let me start by telling you what its not about. isn't about $5 Billion, thats peanuts really to the American government, probably about what they spend on the military in a few days. Hell its less than a ford class Aircraft carrier.

I don't think the issue is the money the issue is the political optics of this situation.

Trump made a promise to build a wall and Mexico would pay for it, it was going to be his flagship policy, the big one, taking such a extreme hardline on immigration is a big part of why his voters voted for him. Turns out though that actually no Mexico aren't going to pay for his wall and actually he can't actually build a physical wall as he promised. So now the best he can do to appease his base of support is to build this metaphorical wall and for that he needs $5 Billion. Thats basically what he's asking for $5 Billion so he can turn round to his supporters and say he is still "winning", this is just to score political points.

So when you look at it like this you realise something very important, the government is in shut down not over $5 Billion but basically as a big F you to Trump and because Trump can't handle failing on his pledge to build his big stupid wall. So from my perspective then its both Trump and the Dems fault they are both playing quite a petty game really and the government is shut down as a result.

Now as much as I might not be a fan of Trump if I where him I would spin this, I would let it go on just a little longer then he admits that he's not going to get his $5 Billion because the Dems are so corrupt that its all their fault the wall can't built because they support open boarder (or whatever other nonsense he wants too spin). That way he looks like the good guy because he has gave in for the good of the country all because of the big bad Dems playing political games. Then any time anyone asks him what happened to his big stupid wall he just puts all the blame for his failure to build it and have Mexico pay for it on the Dems.

This though is just part of the plan of the Dems now that they control congress and they are taking advantage of that fact, they know that if they impeach Trump they would be chaos so this is the next best thing. They are going to hold public hearings, they are going to block bills, they are going to make the most of his twitter feed and if you think they have made him look bad in his first two years just wait for the next two. By the time the Dems are done they are going to have made Trump look so bad that they could reanimate Osama Bin Laden corps and have him run against Trump and Trump would still lose.

Its now all part of a Trump Vs Dems game, Trump wants to implement the policies his supporters voted him in on and the Dems are going to do everything in their power to stop that because thats what their supporters want. This shutdown is just the start, the first two years might have been divisive but the next two are going to be even more divisive.

Is this right?

Probably not, they are playing party politics, putting their own desires for power above what is best for the country but I think they would justify it has damage control. This shutdown is just the start in the coming months there is going to more and more pressure put on Trump. The goal of the Dems I think isn't to impeach Trump but rather to make life so difficult for him that he will wish he never ran for POTUS in the first place.

Cant build a wall so he'll do the next best thing. Rally his base up to be so anti immigrant it will probably deter anyone from wanting to immigrate to the US at all. Just like Russia, except if you're from a white nation, then you're fine.

a reply to: strongfp

The wall isn't to stop immigration.

It's to stop criminals from storming across the border and finding themselves dependent on welfare.

But whatev

So nobody noticed the Syria pullout got the Deep State all riled up!

a reply to: strongfp

We equally want legal whites so keep your racism to yourself.

Idiots

Trump already secured the $5 billion by eliminating pay raises for all civilian federal employees for 2019. The shutdown is just political optics to demonstrate that Socialist Democrats want open borders & Trump wants secure borders. The majority or voters want secure borders, regardless of their political affiliation & the majority of Trump supporters would like all non-essential federal jobs eliminated so a shutdown does not matter to them. Its a win/win for Trump to keep the shutdown going, especially since our country is bankrupt & can't really afford non-essential federal government employees and services. I hope it becomes permanent. If we get a better fence/wall it will be easier for volunteers to defend once the federal govement can't afford to pay essential federal border security employees.

What exactly is shut down all I notice are Parks, Museums and Panda Cams ...

a reply to: OtherSideOfTheCoin

yes Sir, and this is why Trump will win again in 2020 and the republicans will take back the house and keep the senate and this time, with a lot more Trump supporting Republicans. Come 2020, the Dems will wish they had just gave him the wall, instead of giving him his biggest political rallying cry for the second time.

If he gets the wall he can use it as 'he won" but in politics it is always 'what have you done for me lately" come 2020 everyone will forget about the wall. If the Democrats were smart, they would just give him the wall now, take away a 2020 talking point and say "we had to cave to give in to a dumb crazy leader and this is why we need to get rid of him"

originally posted by: manuelram16
So nobody noticed the Syria pullout got the Deep State all riled up!

They're really going to start screaming when Trump begins a pullout from Afghanistan, and their heroin profits dry up.

As for the OP, it's sad that attempting to keep one of your core campaign promises is now apparently a bad thing. Fact is, we're so used to politicians who make empty promises that we don't know what to do when one of them actually tries to do what he said he's going to do.

a reply to: PsychoEmperor

yes Sir, and this is why Trump will win again in 2020 and the republicans will take back the house and keep the senate and this time, with a lot more Trump supporting Republicans.

Time will tell I guess.

I wouldn't be making predictions though one way or the other. The Dems play right now could backfire spectacularly but who knows.

a reply to: NarcolepticBuddha

What a falsehood. They're criminals if they want to get in they will find a way. Same logic as banning guns. Only thing is, it's just going to create more crime. You know, human trafficking and more crime along the boarder.

a reply to: OtherSideOfTheCoin

Gee and all along I thought there was a shutdown because Congress did not present a bill for the president to sign?
Has our process changed?

originally posted by: shooterbrody
a reply to: OtherSideOfTheCoin

Gee and all along I thought there was a shutdown because Congress did not present a bill for the president to sign?
Has our process changed?

Well ok at its most fundamental level you may be right

they want 5 billion for a symbolic symbol. yep, that's what they're calling it now. lololol

a vanity project we all know isn't going to stop determined people. bunch of pusses.

trump said on live tv he'd be proud to shut the goverment down until he gets his wall - his symbolic symbol. god damn, he's such a tool.. it's astounds me everyday he has supporters.

btw, america voted for a democratic congress - they voted against the wall. lol

Trump just wants his 5 billion so he can build a few miles of a 30 foot high concrete barrier, which will only make for an impressive photo shoot, with him standing in front of it with a big cheesy smile... It'll convince his fanatic base that his somehow won and got his impenetrable southern border wall that he promised. Even though the majority of that 5 billion, in reality, will just go to replacing the already existing chain link fences.

The dems need to hold strong and not allow Trump to fleece the American taxpayers of 5 billion dollars, just so he can have his his little narcissistic propaganda fest.

a reply to: OtherSideOfTheCoin

So if Congress did not present a bill how is this in any way trumps fault?

originally posted by: strongfp
a reply to: NarcolepticBuddha

What a falsehood. They're criminals if they want to get in they will find a way. Same logic as banning guns. Only thing is, it's just going to create more crime. You know, human trafficking and more crime along the boarder.

The point of it isnt to stop ALL of them, the point is to stem the tide, the Falsehood is all these anti-wall people making the false-premise that we want the wall to stop EVERYTHING.

We are well aware that you can never stop everyone. I read the other day from another poster that we spend 100s of billions of dollars on health care alone every year on illegals and thats just who we know about.

If we stemmed the tide to just stopping 15-20 percent of thsoe people coming in the wall will pay for itself in two years, but thats just HEALTHCARE alone, not all the other programs that are funneling money to compensate for illegals , including taking up space in jails, deportation, HOLDING them like were having to do right now with these caravans. Etc Etc ad nauseum

its clear to see that even at a LOW percentage of stopping the influx, will save us hundreds of billions in less that 5 years.

Billions that can go into programs to help the vets, revamp healthcare, etc etc etc, you know facilitate programs that ALL Americans want.

Anti-wall people arent using common sense and are knee jerking with emotion, they arent looking at the numbers, or the long game

originally posted by: strongfp
Cant build a wall so he'll do the next best thing. Rally his base up to be so anti immigrant it will probably deter anyone from wanting to immigrate to the US at all. Just like Russia, except if you're from a white nation, then you're fine.

Not anti immigrant. Anti illegals. When are you Stalinists going to get that through your heads?

a reply to: knoxie

America voted for a split congress.
Civics is your friend.
Dems have a majority in the house.
GOP has a majority in the senate.

originally posted by: Carcharadon

originally posted by: strongfp
Cant build a wall so he'll do the next best thing. Rally his base up to be so anti immigrant it will probably deter anyone from wanting to immigrate to the US at all. Just like Russia, except if you're from a white nation, then you're fine.

Not anti immigrant. Anti illegals. When are you Stalinists going to get that through your heads?

Thats the narrative the left wants to push, its easier to call us racists and bigots if they keep repeating that line and denying the actual reality of the issue.

Remember its in the saul alinsky playbook, repeat the lie enough and it becomes truth.