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This is why your lefties seem unhinged

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posted on Jan, 2 2019 @ 02:27 PM
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originally posted by: riiver
a reply to: kaylaluv

Here's what I don't understand, and please don't flame me because this is an honest question. So many people advocate for letting people in willy-nilly just because they're poor, because of gangs in their home countries, etc. Every thread has dozens of posts like that. But what about our own poor? Our own people living in fear of gangs on a daily basis, etc. Shouldn't we be looking to address these issues on our own soil, for the people who are already here and already US citizens before we open our doors to the rest of the world's problems? I don't get it.


Sure, but this is anathema to the party of secure borders.....




posted on Jan, 2 2019 @ 02:31 PM
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originally posted by: network dude

originally posted by: dug88

originally posted by: network dude

originally posted by: dug88

originally posted by: network dude

originally posted by: dug88

originally posted by: PokeyJoe
a reply to: dug88

If they can’t get here in the first place, these companies wouldn’t be able to hire them, no?



Yeah in an ideal world that'd be nice. Too bad that hasn't been working has it? Oh yeah how are you going to stop people from sneaking into a country with two gigantic coast lines? Both of which are shared by the country from which you are trying to keep people from coming from.

There's endless ways to enter America apart from the southern border.

You can line the southern border with turrets and land mines but as long as there's incentive for illegal immigrants to enter and stay in America they'll find a way.

I mean people manage to cross the Korean demilitarized zone for # sake. That's like 4km of death with heavily armed fortifications on both sides.


present some numbers of how many successfully cross the DMZ and we can have a nice discussion on that.


globalnews.ca...

www.bbc.com...

en.m.wikipedia.org...

en.m.wikipedia.org...

www.quora.com...

theconversation.com...

This should probably be enough references to get you started.


Cool, thanks for bringing something of substance to make your point.

Here:
50,000 a month

And I believe the numbers in your link was 1000 a year. Are you sure this is the stance you want to take here?


Yeah....there's a pretty big difference between the US/Mexico border and the Korean DMZ. I was just pointing out that even with ya know land mines, artillery, armed soldiers and large walls people manage to cross...sure maybe only 1000/year but that's still 1000 people that manage to cross one of the most dangerous places in the world. I was just pointing out that even if America turns their border into that....people will still get through. That's not to mention again...the two massive open coastlines that'll be extremely difficult to build a wall around.

Addressing the rampant hiring of illegals and removing the incentive for people to cross the border is more effective than any wall. People are willing to go through some #ed up # for a better life. If no better life awaits they won't bother. As it is right now, the available employment and services for these people are obviously better than those available in their own country. If it weren't they'd stay there.


you are correct. I don't believe anyone here has claimed that a wall/fence would stop everyone. But, do you think that a physical barrier might stop some?

And again, thanks for debating with facts and junk, and not just attacking muh feelz.


Sure it might. But as long as the root cause of the problem still exists it won't stop the problem.

en.m.wikipedia.org...

So according to that....there are around 11.2 million illegal immigrants in America...i've seen numbers higher and lower...but anyway...the exact numbers aren't important. According to the same article around 8 million of them have jobs. This means, American companies willingly employed 8 million illegal immigrants rather than citizens or legal immigrants. That's 8 million people who would likely not be able to remain in America without those jobs and 8 million jobs willingly given to illegal immigrants by American employers.

The other 3 million or more or less or whatever the number are likely supported by the people working those jobs, government services being provided to them or crime.

Heavily punish employers that hire illegal immigrants, deport those illegal workers, stop providing welfare and other services to them and I imagine the numbers would begin to drop heavily.

This won't happen though. Both Republican and Democratic politicians own shares in or own businesses that profit by hiring illegals. Corporate lobbyists push to keep any kind of laws that would enforce punishments on companies that hire illegals and instead they spin fantasies of a wall for the voter base to keep Republican voters happy and to give Democratic voters something to argue and be mad about.



posted on Jan, 2 2019 @ 02:31 PM
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originally posted by: network dude

And I believe the numbers in your link was 1000 a year. Are you sure this is the stance you want to take here?


That 1000 is 999 that go to China and then defect from that direction, the DMZ is at most one per year makes it.


edit on 2-1-2019 by Xtrozero because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 2 2019 @ 02:32 PM
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a reply to: network dude


We (those who aren't for open borders) are in favor of LEGAL immigration, but against ILLEGAL immigration.


(emphasis/bolding mine)




So at this point, you need to embrace your TDS. You MUST recognize it and wear it proudly. If you don't, then the next tiny step is a mental breakdown. Now please, explain why Illegal immigration is the way to go.


The crickets are getting tired of chirping. Any lefties care to defend their position supporting, encouraging and/or abetting violation of our federal immigration laws, federal laws against defrauding the United States (via knowingly false asylum claims) & any assorted state law violations?

Of course they won't. They can't. Their position is indefensible and they know it. Thank God, in typical lefty fashion, they had the chance to signal their high & mighty, arrogant and deranged virtuous virtues to the rest of us. That's those virtue signalling lefties for you though!

Great post ND A nod to merit based immigration from me as well, and zero tolerance on illegal immigration



posted on Jan, 2 2019 @ 02:38 PM
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a reply to: riiver


i know you didn't ask me but I personally would much rather the wall money be spent helping our own poor people..

not some symbolic wall that won't stop bad people who are determined. that does not mean I want open borders, either.



posted on Jan, 2 2019 @ 02:38 PM
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a reply to: dug88

The root cause isn't our problem, however. It is the Citizens of those nations, who are responsible for forming and operating a functional government.

If they can't do that, shame on them. Shame on them for standing by idly while socialist failures seized control (no doubt through legal AKA "democratic" means) instead of passing out Cigarettes and Blindfolds.

They made their own beds, and it isn't our job or our problem to save them from themselves IMHO. We should focus on America, securing our borders, defending our people and preserving the distinct American culture and Patriotic American way of life.


Heavily punish employers that hire illegal immigrants, deport those illegal workers, stop providing welfare and other services to them and I imagine the numbers would begin to drop heavily.



This won't happen though. Both Republican and Democratic politicians own shares in or own businesses that profit by hiring illegals. Corporate lobbyists push to keep any kind of laws that would enforce punishments on companies that hire illegals and instead they spin fantasies of a wall for the voter base to keep Republican voters happy and to give Democratic voters something to argue and be mad about.


Seconded
The waste of space/oxygen known as spineless Congress won't act. They didn't act when we held a super-majority for 2 years why should we expect anything else from them now? Government and the system itself is badly broken. But we can't let that get in the way of enforcing existing laws



posted on Jan, 2 2019 @ 02:43 PM
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the real reason lefties seem unhinged and righties if you're a lefty. Is that your media news source tells you their unhinged.

Consider how the left media villifies anyone in a MAGA hat. Consider how you keep seeing the one picture of the woman crying on the sidewalk when trump won....consider that it was "ONE" woman. One.

The news programs lie to you. You're favorite celebrity who pretends to know more about politics than you do, tells you their wacked. Don't believe them. Get out of the house and go see for yourselves.

Remember that every time you see an unhinged Redneck in a Maga Hat or one wacko left person going beserk, that out of a country of half a billion people, it's just one person. Don't be that stupid. LOL



posted on Jan, 2 2019 @ 02:44 PM
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a reply to: oloufo

And I drive from Missouri to Kansas to work and back again each and every day. The operative term is "member states". Mexico and the United States, Guatemala and the United States, El Salvador and the United States, et al, are "member states" of nothing, not like any of the EU member states are, not like any of the states in the United States are.



posted on Jan, 2 2019 @ 02:45 PM
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a reply to: amazing

One woman crying on the sidewalk while the rest were marching around screaming REEEEEEEE in pink hats crocheted to resemble vaginas. Tell me that's normal behavior for a woman. If it is, then I am an abnormal woman, indeed, because I thought those thousands (?) all looked stupid.



posted on Jan, 2 2019 @ 02:53 PM
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originally posted by: ketsuko
a reply to: amazing

One woman crying on the sidewalk while the rest were marching around screaming REEEEEEEE in pink hats crocheted to resemble vaginas. Tell me that's normal behavior for a woman. If it is, then I am an abnormal woman, indeed, because I thought those thousands (?) all looked stupid.


And how many were there doing that? I've never seen anything like that in real life and I know lot's of liberals. Non of my VERY liberal friends on facebook ever posted a pic of themselves in a vagina hat. This stuff isn't real life. It's like Antifa,, you get 12 guys from california and all of a sudden it's ahuge movement. I've never seen an antifa guy in real life. And to be honest, I've never seen a person wearing a MAGA hat in real life either? LOL
edit on 2-1-2019 by amazing because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 2 2019 @ 02:59 PM
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originally posted by: network dude

originally posted by: openminded2011
a reply to: network dude



Hiring someone who is illegally here is a crime. That's how it should be approached. If you are here legally, have a work visa, that's fine, but if you are here illegally, not paying taxes, using our roads and infrastructure, the person who hires you should be held legally accountable for it. And the penalties should become more severe each time that person is charged. No need to ever build a wall if it is impossible to come here and work illegally. TPTB know that is the solution and none of them will ever do anything about it. This issue is nothing but a political football both parties are using to get a rise out of their respective base, I truly believe that.


um....about the guys selling drugs or children, how would that hinder them?



If they get caught doing that, they get executed, period.



posted on Jan, 2 2019 @ 02:59 PM
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a reply to: amazing

Move to Portland. I hear ANTIFA runs the show there.

I live out where you will see the occasional Trump bumper sticker or hat or something, but since concealed carry is a thing here, you aren't going to find much ANTIFA agitation, not openly like you will in other areas.



posted on Jan, 2 2019 @ 03:00 PM
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originally posted by: network dude

originally posted by: TinySickTears

originally posted by: PokeyJoe

originally posted by: knoxie
a reply to: ClovenSky




The wall is simply symbolic. But maybe it is the first hurdle we need to get over before we take this matter seriously.


spend gazillions on something you think is only symbolic?

huh?





The Wall is symbolic for Border Security as a whole.


pretty expensive symbol

so it is more important to have a giant expensive symbol even if it does not work?

how about getting # done that is actually going to work and secure the border?

i mean wouldnt a secure border be a pretty good symbol for a secure border?


and the entire point of all this is......rather than them trying to get # done, they say "no deal". Trump is asking for a deal. You are against him for wanting what you want. All because he's Trump. See it yet?


trump is to blame
we have been through this

he took the blame on himself


wall is not and should not be the only option



posted on Jan, 2 2019 @ 03:01 PM
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originally posted by: ketsuko
a reply to: amazing

Move to Portland. I hear ANTIFA runs the show there.

I live out where you will see the occasional Trump bumper sticker or hat or something, but since concealed carry is a thing here, you aren't going to find much ANTIFA agitation, not openly like you will in other areas.


I used to live just south of portland and would go there often. Still never saw an antifa person in his natural environment.



posted on Jan, 2 2019 @ 03:05 PM
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a reply to: amazing

"What happens in Vegas, (better) stays in Vegas".



Nah. You're an evil social justice warrior and I'll put up a wager that you're wearing a brandnew MAGA-vagina hat right now. Is that even a thing? It should be.




posted on Jan, 2 2019 @ 03:06 PM
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originally posted by: TinySickTears

trump is to blame
we have been through this

he took the blame on himself


wall is not and should not be the only option


It is funny how all the liberal leadership we see today against the wall voted for it in 2006 and even up to 2015 they supported. What happen...hmmm The wall is one piece of the puzzle. Same old crap...they voted for it to happen in 2006 and no one wanted to touch it with a 10 foot pole until Trump came along and he said I'll touch it and build it, and now they are like Oh NOOOoo we can't do that.

Blame Trump all anyone wants doesn't change the fact that congress is full of #ty people.
edit on 2-1-2019 by Xtrozero because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 2 2019 @ 03:07 PM
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a reply to: dug88

Spot on!



posted on Jan, 2 2019 @ 03:08 PM
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originally posted by: amazing


I used to live just south of portland and would go there often. Still never saw an antifa person in his natural environment.




Look for the man buns and floppy hats in the men and women dressed like men for the women.
edit on 2-1-2019 by Xtrozero because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 2 2019 @ 03:09 PM
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a reply to: riiver

I appreciate you asking. Not because I think I have all the solutions, but because it opens a dialogue.

I believe the wall would be a huge financial burden. We are already so far in debt. I personally do not back something that puts us further in debt, will take years to implement, and we don't even know how effective it is going to be. We don't even know how much it will cost - estimated $25B. Then upkeep and patrols.

You didn't ask why I am against the wall though. For me, the better option would be to take away the incentives for why people are coming illegally, not just to put something in their way to deter them like a wall. I feel like we need to look bigger picture.

First off - end the war on drugs. Specifically, decriminalize Marijuana.
I think this would reduced violence in CA, save the US billions, make the US drug market less appealing, and shrink government control.

More modernized and intelligent surveillance of the border.
I personally think more dogs, radar, ground sensors, and drones, but I am not even opposed to intelligent fences necessarily. Equipment that provides tracking data we can use as intelligence.

Restructure the Visa system.
Stricter punishments for those who overstay. More follow up on those with expiring Visas. Allow work visas to be easier, but track them better.

Restructure immigration application process.
The paperwork and turn around time in obscene. Make the system more welcoming and user friendly. Still vet people, but don't force people into thinking their only option is the dessert in the middle of the night. The will help the "good ones" get through. It will also make it harder for drugs and human trafficking victims to slip through the cracks.

Restructure the welfare system.

Follow through.
Punish people who overstay visas.
Punish companies who hire illegals.
Provide the assistance that is advertised.

I am not against better borders. I just think $5B can go so much further than a starting fund for a wall that IMO is an economical and ecological disaster.



posted on Jan, 2 2019 @ 03:14 PM
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a reply to: knoxie

I'm all for that too. (I think we should take all that cash we hand out to other countries and pour it into taking care of our own first, myself.) But we're still stuck with the question of what to do to stem the tide of illegal immigrants. And I'm not saying I have any answers, don't get me wrong. The comments about cracking down on employers hiring illegals, cutting off welfare to illegals, etc. are all great solutions. If we DID do those things, it would be a tourniquet on the hemorrhage. But as others have said, special interests ensure that there will never be a crackdown on employers, and the current climate of "sanctuary" cities and even states doesn't look to promising for implementing a "no welfare" policy. What then do we do besides stand around and wring our hands?



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