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Democrats have Introduced a Bill to make Mexico Pay for The Wall !!

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posted on Dec, 29 2018 @ 07:06 AM
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a reply to: TinySickTears


moats and gunz and aligators and #

it is not one or the other

if you do not support the wall it does not mean you support open borders.

you know this

No, not necessarily. But I have yet to hear a convincing argument for anything other than a wall to combat the immediate border crisis. I thought you might have an idea.

So you're in favor of just killing everyone as they come across then?

TheRedneck




posted on Dec, 29 2018 @ 07:17 AM
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originally posted by: TheRedneck



So you're in favor of just killing everyone as they come across then?

TheRedneck


it was a joke.

seen those types of posts from a lot of people that fall on your 'side' of things.
many posts like that

you talk of an immediate problem but want this wall.

wall going to take many years to build dude. not so good for an immediate problem now is it?


all of a sudden in the past 2 years the wall has become needed.
what a joke


just since trump started spewing it.


weak

we dont need a wall
not wanting a wall does not mean you want open borders so why not just stop playing that game



posted on Dec, 29 2018 @ 07:41 AM
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a reply to: TinySickTears


it was a joke.

seen those types of posts from a lot of people that fall on your 'side' of things.
many posts like that

I was being serious. And you haven't seen any posts like that from me. I don't take sides; I state things how I see them.


you talk of an immediate problem but want this wall.

wall going to take many years to build dude. not so good for an immediate problem now is it?

It's still the fastest and surest way to control the border. At least there will be construction crews watching the border simply by being there during construction.


all of a sudden in the past 2 years the wall has become needed.
what a joke

I assume you're saying that you are joking. I have been calling for a border wall since the late 80s. That wasn't Donald Trump's idea. He's just giving us hope we might finally get it.


we dont need a wall
not wanting a wall does not mean you want open borders so why not just stop playing that game

I'm not playing games. I asked you what your preferable solution to securing the border is. So far all you've done is make jokes and repeat we don't need a wall over and over. Do you have a solution better than a wall or not?

If you oppose the proposed solution and do not have a better solution in mind, that is support for no solution... in this case, an open border. Again: do you have a better solution?

TheRedneck



posted on Dec, 29 2018 @ 07:47 AM
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a reply to: TheRedneck

a solution?

not really. not sure how legally and logistically all this # works

legalization would curb a lot of the # coming across the border. drugs/guns/people
thats a good first step

tax money from legalization could probably go towards some border security. patrols. whatever


there has to be other ways
you are saying the wall is it?


fact is we dont really know

we dont know how a wall would do.
we dont know how legalization and money funneled through for security would work

thats a fact



posted on Dec, 29 2018 @ 07:59 AM
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originally posted by: burdman30ott6

originally posted by: TinySickTears

originally posted by: burdman30ott6

originally posted by: TinySickTears
the man said mexico would pay for it

it was one of his biggest campaign issue

why should taxes go for it?


Indirectly, they will. Look, if the left can paint tax cuts as "lost taxpayer revenue" then Trump can paint the savings of billions of dollars in illegal immigration expenses within the US that will no longer be as prevelant or costly after the Wall is completed as "Mexico paying the price tag."


bull# and you know it

he lied
a major one

they are not and never were going to pay for it

why do you deflect all the time

is this another one of those song and dance deals where he said a thing but you only know what he meant if you are in the orange club?

he said mexico was going to pay for it

not indirectly in a round about way via savings we might start to see in a decade



WRONG. My position on this has not veered from day 1.
From 2 years ago:
www.abovetopsecret.com...

We eliminate NAFTA and build the wall and the savings on eliminating all of those illegals from America's social spending programs combined with the tariffs on Mexican imports and return of many jobs to the US from Mexico will pay for that wall... Who presently benefits from that social spending and those jobs? Mexico does, obviously. The $100 Billion+ annual tax payer expense to feed, educate, incarcerate, and medically care for all of those illegal aliens is $100 Billion+ Mexico doesn't have to spend on their escapees and the $64 Billion annual US losses thanks to NAFTA are presently $64 Billion additional dollars into Mexico's economy.


We (Trump voters) not only knew that the "Mexico will pay for it" promise was intended to mean through tariffs, policy changes, and savings on illegals, we TOLD EVERYONE ELSE THAT WERE TOO SLOW TO SEE IT how it would work out. This post was from 6 days after he was inaugurated. It was a point I had made previously on ATS as well, including during the campaign.


“TOO SLOW TO SEE IT” does not even begin to describe the inability to employ common sense and/or process logic of these terminal sufferers of TDS. I really think it all goes back to schools removing comprehension tests from education.



posted on Dec, 29 2018 @ 08:03 AM
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originally posted by: TheRedneck

I was being serious. And you haven't seen any posts like that from me. I don't take sides; I state things how I see them.




i said i see those types of posts from a lot of people.

you dont take sides but you posts almost always seem to lean in favor of trump and all his bull#

whatever


point is a wall is not the only answer



posted on Dec, 29 2018 @ 08:09 AM
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Another misleading (lie). Who isn’t surprised? a reply to: xuenchen



posted on Dec, 29 2018 @ 08:24 AM
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a reply to: TinySickTears


a solution?

not really. not sure how legally and logistically all this # works

But you seem so sure a wall won't work. Why is that?


legalization would curb a lot of the # coming across the border. drugs/guns/people
thats a good first step

Legalization of what? Legalization of immigrants, legalization of drugs...?


tax money from legalization could probably go towards some border security. patrols. whatever

OK, not sure where the tax money from legalization would play in since I don't know what you are legalizing. But I do hear something about increased patrols. Have you ever been to the southern border?


there has to be other ways
you are saying the wall is it?

I'm saying the wall is the only way I know of to effectively secure the border. There are other things we can do as well: increase penalties and enforcement of hiring laws and increased border patrols (we agree on that) for instance. But neither have shown indication in the past that they can secure the border by themselves. Laws can be broken, and 2000 miles of border is a LOT of area to cover manually, which means it becomes far too easy to slip across between patrols.

The wall is not a stand-alone item. If we want secure borders we will need to also address immigration itself. That means making it easier for documented migrant workers to come in, easing the problems associated with asylum requests, which are mostly due to the asylum infrastructure being overwhelmed, be more aggressive against VISA overstays, that sort of thing. There's a lot of holes in the bucket to be patched. But the biggest hole is the open southern border, which is like a missing bottom in that bucket. Patch all the holes you can find, but if you don't fix the bottom it'll never hold water.


we dont know how a wall would do.
we dont know how legalization and money funneled through for security would work

We've got some pretty good indicators. Some small areas of the southern border are fenced, and a few places actually have walls already. Illegal border crossings are down in those areas in the 90+ percentile range. Israel has a border wall that has been 99.9% effective in stopping illegal crossings. I know of no area where a wall has not had a positive effect on illegal crossings. It's very nature makes it more difficult to cross.

TheRedneck



posted on Dec, 29 2018 @ 08:28 AM
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originally posted by: TinySickTears


weak

we dont need a wall
not wanting a wall does not mean you want open borders so why not just stop playing that game


It's not a game and I (for one) will call out those who support open borders.

Might as well own it.



posted on Dec, 29 2018 @ 08:31 AM
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a reply to: TinySickTears


i said i see those types of posts from a lot of people.

I'm sure you do; so do I. But then you added "on my side." I don't like being assigned to a "side." I tend to think for myself.


you dont take sides but you posts almost always seem to lean in favor of trump and all his bull#

There are two possibilities when that happens: either the poster is agreeing with Trump or Trump is agreeing with the poster. It is possible, you know, for someone to say something that can be agreed with outside any following going on.

At other times, I would list the number of times I had disagreed with the President, but no more. I refuse to do so any more. It makes no difference, and takes far too much time for no benefit. I will simply take future references to my agreement on issues as a belief that everything is either Democrat or Republican and reply appropriately.

I am an Independent.

TheRedneck



posted on Dec, 29 2018 @ 08:32 AM
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This was the first big mistake Trump made in thinking the vast majority of Americans would be smart enough to understand that the money saved in Nafta and foreign aid cuts was how Mexico was going to be paying for the wall. The vast majority of Americans don't understand simple mathematics (see common core) so making promises of any complicated understanding is a non-starter for any politician. Furthermore, its why our standing in education around the world has become the laughing stock because there are so many idiots here.



posted on Dec, 29 2018 @ 08:34 AM
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originally posted by: DBCowboy

originally posted by: TinySickTears


weak

we dont need a wall
not wanting a wall does not mean you want open borders so why not just stop playing that game


It's not a game and I (for one) will call out those who support open borders.

Might as well own it.


awesome

but what you and many others do is claim people are for open borders when they are not
you claim these things if they disagree with trump or disagree about this stupid wall


a wall is not the only answer
not wanting the wall does not mean you support open borders

those are facts



posted on Dec, 29 2018 @ 08:36 AM
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a reply to: TinySickTears

But your only solution is to let everyone in.



posted on Dec, 29 2018 @ 08:36 AM
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a reply to: TheRedneck



The wall is not a stand-alone item. If we want secure borders we will need to also address immigration itself. That means making it easier for documented migrant workers to come in, easing the problems associated with asylum requests, which are mostly due to the asylum infrastructure being overwhelmed, be more aggressive against VISA overstays, that sort of thing.


That is all quite true; a good place to start.

Unfortunately, most all of us born before1984 know none of that will ever happen. No wall will ever be built and more cities will become sanctuaries.

"Secure Borders" is a fantasy in the land of broken dreams and broken promises.



posted on Dec, 29 2018 @ 08:37 AM
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originally posted by: DBCowboy
a reply to: TinySickTears

But your only solution is to let everyone in.



see youre doing it now
lying i mean

i never said that



posted on Dec, 29 2018 @ 08:38 AM
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just read an article that says taxpayers just paid like 54k for tents for a party on new years at mar a largo that probably is not going to happen now.

54k

coulda built a chunk of wall for that much
edit on 29-12-2018 by TinySickTears because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 29 2018 @ 08:42 AM
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a reply to: DBCowboy

DB, they're coming in anyway! 800 dumped at a bus station in El Paso last weekend.

The billions spent on keeping them out turn into billions letting them in. And its because the US is signatory to the UN Migration and Asylum pact. The US has no choice except to grant asylum seekers a hearing. They get to stay pending the hearing. They disappear into the Sanctuary Cities and never show up for the hearings.

Rinse, repeat. For DECADES!



posted on Dec, 29 2018 @ 08:46 AM
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originally posted by: TinySickTears

originally posted by: DBCowboy
a reply to: TinySickTears

But your only solution is to let everyone in.



see youre doing it now
lying i mean

i never said that



Common sense.

If you're opposed to actions to prevent anyone from coming in, you must be FOR letting them in.



posted on Dec, 29 2018 @ 08:47 AM
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originally posted by: TonyS
a reply to: DBCowboy

DB, they're coming in anyway! 800 dumped at a bus station in El Paso last weekend.

The billions spent on keeping them out turn into billions letting them in. And its because the US is signatory to the UN Migration and Asylum pact. The US has no choice except to grant asylum seekers a hearing. They get to stay pending the hearing. They disappear into the Sanctuary Cities and never show up for the hearings.

Rinse, repeat. For DECADES!


It's because all politicians want illegals in the country. This is something that both democrats and republicans are guilty of.



posted on Dec, 29 2018 @ 08:50 AM
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originally posted by: DBCowboy

Common sense.

If you're opposed to actions to prevent anyone from coming in, you must be FOR letting them in.


wrong again

opposed to a single action(the wall) does not mean you are for letting them in

you know this

youre just playing your stupid little word vomit game

actual moats and gunz and gators is an action to prevent people from crossing.
im not for that either


that does not mean i am for open borders



really what is the point of having a conversation with you?
you just dismiss what people say and #ing lie the entire time.




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