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A toast to those that deny reality and insult those that don't

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posted on Dec, 28 2018 @ 12:28 PM
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originally posted by: odzeandennz
a reply to: JinMI

Ok. Youre right, you win. 😊


Congrats! You succeeded in twisting the thread to one of Trump's confusing speeches.

You can sleep well tonight knowing that you turned it on the man.

I have no idea wtf Trump's agenda is right now but you seem to have it all figured out.

So what about these deleted e-mails and text messages in an extremely high profile case?p

Last I heard, the Mueller investigation has cost the United States 350 million dollars. I'm sure you're going to correct me if I'm wrong but even if it's half of that, shouldn't they have come up with something by now?

It's been two years.




posted on Dec, 28 2018 @ 12:28 PM
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a reply to: Propagandalf

Which would certainly make sense in it's own context.

However when delivering his speech he switched from wages to budget. If the 10% indicates budget, he certainly put it out of context, thus the conversation and the controversy.
edit on 28-12-2018 by JinMI because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 28 2018 @ 12:32 PM
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originally posted by: Grambler
I want to label these people with a name, but cant think of one fitting enough to describe the unbelievable display they put forth.

Maybe "Paralogists?"

Narcissistic Paralogists?


"Paralogist"
    noun

    One who uses illogical or fallacious reasoning, especially which appears superficially logical or which the reasoner believes to be logical.

Just a suggested term.



posted on Dec, 28 2018 @ 12:34 PM
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originally posted by: JinMI
a reply to: Propagandalf

Which would certainly make sense in it's own context.

However when delivering his speech he switched from wages to budget. If the 10% indicates budget, he certainly put it out of context, thus the conversation and the controversy.


He certainly could have been conflating a raise in military budget (which includes the pay raise) with a raise in wages, or had been entirely confused about it all, but none of that really matters. Unless we're in the habit of policing speech, big deal. But the notion that he was intentionally trying to deceive the people he was talking to—lying—is itself a malicious lie, one without any evidence to support it. And we should defend Trump on those grounds.

edit: Sorry OP for deviating off topic.
edit on 28-12-2018 by Propagandalf because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 28 2018 @ 12:36 PM
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What about those who deny what they see and hear with their own eyes and ears?

I went a few rounds with my niece this week. She dismissed me as being a "conspiracy theorist" because of various, factual and provable claims that I made. Hell, even video proof isn't good enough for her, as she "easily, fact checked" the video and proved that the person didn't actually mean what they said on video in front of an audience. (At least not by standard dictionary definitions of the words uttered *I guess*.)

The lengths that people will go to in order to deny something that goes against their group think is truly frightening to me.

But the icing on the cake is the snarky, condescending, dismissive attitude that those same people (who deny reality) will respond to you with. That's the part that makes me genuinely angry.

I was called "old", and told I think just like every other "baby Boomer" (a group which I do not even belong to).

I was also informed that the world hates Trump and is embarrassed for the USA. And this is a fact because of what a cab driver and waiter said to her on her vacation abroad.

To deny that TDS exists is to deny 2+2=4. then again....I bet she would say it equals 5.



posted on Dec, 28 2018 @ 12:42 PM
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a reply to: Grambler

I haven't come across many who claim they'r wrong but, I like you and the fact that you can stand up like a Man and Humble yourself like that guy people worship with long hair.

Nice.



posted on Dec, 28 2018 @ 12:53 PM
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originally posted by: odzeandennz
a reply to: network dude

When he said make it 10% , what do you think he was talking about? Which is right before he said if anybody objects to the big PAY raise they just got? And said people said to only make it 3 or 2 % , then says he said to make it 10% or more.

And per the DoD, the troops are slated to receive a 2.6% raise which is .2% more than their last 2.4% raise.

After this I also give up.


I can agree that it's confusing and the speech was awful in that regard. But I just don't see him saying what it charged. And I'm not trying to be biased on this. When I was in, we knew how big our raise was going to be long before the LES.

I'm sorry I just don't see it.



posted on Dec, 28 2018 @ 01:05 PM
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I don't see anyone actually denying what Trump said in his speech to the troops.

Some are interpreting what he said differently than others, but no one is denying the words were actually spoken.

That's different than flat out denying he even said the words.

People who defend the Left will flat out deny what they see and hear with their own eyes and ears.



posted on Dec, 28 2018 @ 01:10 PM
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a reply to: Grambler

I'll still S & F you, because I've enjoyed your past threads, but c'mon fella, this type of thing can also be said about conspiracy theorists, some who post threads right here on ATS! I'm sure you've read threads written by people who believe that we never landed on the moon, or who believe the earth is flat. They'll not only refute the scientific facts that are presented to them, which prove their beliefs are silly, but will spin the truth/facts to support their narrative. HELLO...this is same sort of thing that happens when you discuss politics and it happens not only here on ATS, but on every blog, or comment section that exists on the internet. People are so passionate about their beliefs and feelings, that they are unwilling to hear the truth. Bitchin' about it on a thread and "raising your glass" won't change things, because you can't change human nature. All you can do is, present your opinion and/or facts, and realize people will either agree or chastise you, while completely ignoring or spinning the truth. It happens all the time and it will continue to happen, especially when discussing politics. Even though I'm a conservative, I'll even admit that BOTH political sides are to blame, which is probably why people are so angry at each other these days.




posted on Dec, 28 2018 @ 01:16 PM
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originally posted by: knoxie
a reply to: JinMI


you haven't even watched the video of him bragging about "his" 10 pay raise. hilarious.



op, your thoughts on trump and his 10% pay raise? considering this is a post on denying reality i'd REALLY love your thoughts.


Yes trump certainly lies.

And there are certainly people that are willing to outright ignore reality in efforts to support trump.

No denying that from me.

Now as to gthe isse of this raise, are people claiming he actually did sign a raise for them? I dont know I havent seen it.

But yes, if people are out there saying trump did in fact sign a raise for troops when it clealry can be proven he didnt, that is what I am criticizing.



posted on Dec, 28 2018 @ 01:17 PM
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a reply to: Wide-Eyes


350 million?

oh lord..



posted on Dec, 28 2018 @ 01:18 PM
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a reply to: odzeandennz

Considerably?

Ok bud.

It was a 1 percent pay raise in 2014.

Obama care wiped that out.

In 2015 it was a 1.6 percent raise.

You're full of it..

"Considerable" lol.



posted on Dec, 28 2018 @ 01:19 PM
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a reply to: Grambler


why don't you watch the video and give me you thoughts.. I dare you. lolol



posted on Dec, 28 2018 @ 01:27 PM
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a reply to: shawmanfromny

I think conspiracy theories are different.

In fact I think the entire argument on this thread about trumps 10% raise is different as well slightly.

Here is how.

A conspiracy theorists might say the mooin landing was fake. They will look at the video and say it was made in a studio, etc.

That is different than seeing words, and saying they mean the opposite of what they mean, or pretending they dont exist at all, like in my mueller example. Its not like people are saying well yes the IG wrote that, but in reality this was a conspiracy on the IG's part in order to achieve something. Nope, just a denial the words were even written.

The equivalent would be a moon landing conspiracy theorists saying there is no moon landing footage at all. Period. Then you show the footage, and they say yep, that proves there was no footage. Not that the footage is faked, or something shady is going on, or it proves nothing. Just that it doesnt exist.

That is a special kind of wrongness, and mixed in with virtiol and insults with the smugness they are right, that is what fascinates me.



posted on Dec, 28 2018 @ 01:34 PM
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originally posted by: knoxie
a reply to: Grambler


why don't you watch the video and give me you thoughts.. I dare you. lolol


Ok I did.

This still isnt what I am talking about completely.

People lie intentionally, or they exaggerate. That is understandable.

So Trump saying there is a 10% pay raise when it looks to be 2.something percent is a lie it seems. Now he could defend it by syaing well he meant this or that, etc.

You may still say that is a lie. Ok, all politicians do that.

Like Obama, you can keep your doctor.

What I am talking about is different. I am talking about someone reading Trumps comments, and then saying "Trump never said they were getting a 10% pay raise", even when the transcript and video is posted for all to see. That denial of reality is what is staggering to me.

Thats not just a lie, that is something more



posted on Dec, 28 2018 @ 01:44 PM
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a reply to: Grambler


cool. I was in a thread yesterday and some were denying he was talking about a pay raise. I appreciate your honesty.


edit on 28-12-2018 by knoxie because: (no reason given)

edit on 28-12-2018 by knoxie because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 28 2018 @ 01:48 PM
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a reply to: Grambler

I genuinely hope you have a Happy Holiday season, a Happy New Year and that you prosper in 2019 and continue you're Youtube venture, which sadly, I haven't really had time to enjoy much of this Christmas season.

All that said, in order to enlighten you to a very real reality, I would, in the spirit of helpfulness, simply point up a genuine truth.

As to the Mueller investigations, Starzok and Page and all that? Very few if any are following. Americans have the attention span of a gnat. By operation of "sub-routines" that work in the background of the typical American mind, the brain naturally defaults to a DOS version of politics which runs on a very simple rule.

Rule1: All politicians and those who surround them and those who operate the administration of governance, i.e., the Justice Department, etc., are all crooks!

Rule 2: When in doubt, refer to Rule 1 and know that US Politics is an Organized Crime Soap Opera.



posted on Dec, 28 2018 @ 02:57 PM
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originally posted by: knoxie
a reply to: Wide-Eyes


350 million?

oh lord..


So $350,000,000USD for nothing is funny to you or did you actually have a point?

Please elaborate.



posted on Dec, 28 2018 @ 07:03 PM
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a reply to: Grambler




For example, I had a person one time tell me the Yankees won the championship the previous year. I showed them on my phone that wasnt true. Thye then doubled down and claimed that every single sight, including MLB.com, newspapers, etc., were lying and involved in some sort of conspiracy, and then made fun of me for falling for it.

Mandela effect, it was not the same for both of you



posted on Dec, 28 2018 @ 08:42 PM
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The search for truth has a reputation for destroying livelihoods, be it for the instigator or those being investigated. Political power does not like the spotlight put on its own problems. To be successful in the mainstream media these days you get this and hold the party line.

There is no real profit in owing a newspaper or other media outlet these days, but there is still power in managing the public perception. The CIA has had its filters in the media for quite some time, has shut down and altered many stories over the years.

With the internet and various chat rooms growing, so is the battlefield in the information war of perceptions. Getting a job can be tough these days and there is a growing cash flow into managing online perceptions. It is important to remain aware that not everyone has the same interest in reality as you. Some are just trying to put food on the table.

Putting together a jigsaw puzzle in the middle of a politically charged environment is not easy. Do your homework to sort out the facts from the fiction. Have a thick skin to not even waist your time on the personal slagging. Keep your focus on the goal when stuck in a confusing mess and don't stop moving.

The truth is out there.




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