Pope Francis changes prayer Our Father the words of Jesus himself

originally posted by: 5StarOracle
a reply to: TerryDon79

Do you listen to Elton John on Saturday nite Terry?

Nope. That’s when I’m murdering people and resurrecting them.

originally posted by: 5StarOracle
a reply to: TerryDon79

What do you mean?
We both know you are mentally challenged...

And there’s the true xtian coming out.

Your mass murdering god would be super proud.

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04
a reply to: TerryDon79

Now you are getting somewhere. By accident, but you still made progress.

Some people may think it's murder. So it's not by the laws of God that God sinned, but merely the belief of some people. You just destroyed your entire argument.

I can't think of a single law that could possibly justify genocide.

a reply to: TerryDon79

So now you are calling yourself God...
That was easier then the evolution arguments...
Thanks for the fail...

originally posted by: 5StarOracle
a reply to: TerryDon79

So now you are calling yourself God...
That was easier then the evolution arguments...
Thanks for the fail...

Do you think your god is the only being able to resurrect people from death?

There’s these pretty cool people who know cpr and have other equipment to do just that.

originally posted by: TzarChasm

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04
a reply to: TerryDon79

Now you are getting somewhere. By accident, but you still made progress.

Some people may think it's murder. So it's not by the laws of God that God sinned, but merely the belief of some people. You just destroyed your entire argument.

I can't think of a single law that could possibly justify genocide.

Pretty sure a certain someone near the beginning of the 1900s passed some laws to make it legal in certain countries.

Well that settles it. I'm through with Catholics!
I was fine with all the mean nuns
I was fine with all the sexual misconduct
But this? Oh hellll no!

originally posted by: TerryDon79

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04
a reply to: TerryDon79

Sorry, learn the definition of malice. Learn what it means to provide evidence not claims.

You defeated your own argument.

It’s ok. I’m sure your murdering god would be proud. Just like Hitler was with his SS.

MUrder by definition is a act of hatred,thats where the cold blood comes into play. Soldiers are doing as commanded and therefore not killing out of hatred or cold blood. killing to survive is O.K.
The translation of thou shalt not kill should had read murder because todays definitions,and kill used to mean what murder is today.

Also the 10 commandments are under the OT and as such are for hebrews. the OT specifies who it is for if you read carefully.

But but..the law...No jesus came back to fulfill the law for the hebrews and to then make a new covenant with the gentiles and any who wanted to follow his teachings.

you are free to believe as you will though and thats cool. to each their own.

originally posted by: Sheye
a reply to: 2012newstart

What do you think about the changing of "Our Father"?

I think it is a wise and good change. The original implied that it was the heavenly Father who led us into temptation . I think “abandon us not” is much more appropriate.

That’s my two cents on the matter.

Except that suggests that God abandons us. I was under the impression that we might turn away from him, but he doesn't turn away from us (except possibly in Hell, which is a different argument).

originally posted by: TerryDon79

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04
a reply to: TerryDon79

Saying the same thing over and over thinking it somehow makes it more factual is infantile.

Exactly.

Here, let me help.

Murder is killing a living thing on purpose.
The god of the bible killed billions on purpose.
The god of the bible sinned.

Murder, in every jurisdiction I am aware of (and I accept there may be places where it is different), has an "unlawful" component. It needs to be both unlawful and with malice aforethought.

If God is the Supreme Being then his Word is the ultimate law. Therefore, whatever he chooses to do is at all times lawful (for Him to do, anyway) simply by virtue of Him doing it.

Therefore, God is not capable of committing murder (or, indeed, any crime) under the definition used in probably every legal system in the world.

If there is a god, pray that one would never have to...for better or for worse.

originally posted by: EvillerBob

originally posted by: TerryDon79

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04
a reply to: TerryDon79

Saying the same thing over and over thinking it somehow makes it more factual is infantile.

Exactly.

Here, let me help.

Murder is killing a living thing on purpose.
The god of the bible killed billions on purpose.
The god of the bible sinned.

Murder, in every jurisdiction I am aware of (and I accept there may be places where it is different), has an "unlawful" component. It needs to be both unlawful and with malice aforethought.

If God is the Supreme Being then his Word is the ultimate law. Therefore, whatever he chooses to do is at all times lawful (for Him to do, anyway) simply by virtue of Him doing it.

Therefore, God is not capable of committing murder (or, indeed, any crime) under the definition used in probably every legal system in the world.

That is exactly the problem with sovereign authority, zero oversight or accountability. That is what I call original sin. It is absolutely unacceptable for any single governing force to possess such power as it will inevitably corrupt.

a reply to: 2012newstart

I'm fairly sure that Jesus did not speak English.

The traditional reading is a translation and based upon the Old English of the KJV.

originally posted by: 5StarOracle
a reply to: Woodcarver

I’m going to play along with your stupid line of inquiry as you try to fault God...
God did create Satan, but Satan created something too he created evil...
It was Satan when he originally sinned as well as in this story that is trying to prove something to God...
God just gives him the chance, it’s all about free will...
And God didn’t give Satan so much power over him obviously there boy genius, because Job has free will too see, so he has his own power to decide for himself...

Did satan create evil? Or did god create evil? It seems to me, that if god created satan, then god also created evil.

Remember that i don’t believe in god, satan, or evil, and that you can’t demonstrate any of them either.

originally posted by: toms54
a reply to: Woodcarver

Your argument was much stronger before that post (but still wrong.) We are not discussing the Hebrew Masoretic text here but the New Testament. You are referring to the Old Testament.

Even if the Gospels were written years afterward, they were sourced from earlier versions. If you believe the higher critics (academics) there is internal evidence of earlier versions like Q that writers of the current Gospels drew from.

Or you can believe they were in fact written by the saints and say the same thing in places because they all knew each other and saw the same things.

The Gospels were edited and added to over the years but there are so many early copies that these additions have been identified and weeded out for the most part. Witness the various different endings for the Gospel of Mark.

you are correct, that we are talking about the new testament, but many christians still hold on to many of the old testament teachings, rules, and stories. So i have no problem lumping them all into one bucket sometimes. They are both equally absurd and worrying.

originally posted by: TzarChasm

originally posted by: Woodcarver

originally posted by: 5StarOracle
a reply to: TheLead

All the evil sin pain deaths suffering the afflictions are all attributed to Satan dummy, and God won because Job held onto his faith and trusted in the Lord without fail... So Job won too dummy...
And Satan therefore failed lost the bet proved what a dickhead he is a complete and utter failure...
Go read it again...

Nope Satan won that bet. He tricked god into hurting Job and his entire family, proving that God is petty and not to be trusted. Which is basically the entire moral story of the bible.

And really, who tempted Satan by being all smug and self important and narcissistic about his godly duties? I don't blame Satan one bit for trying to open god's eyes and teach him humility.

I agree, as far as moralistic ancient texts, (of which there are many) this one seems specifically egregious to me. Even more than the story of Abraham and Isaac. This story seems to be the one that puts god in the worst position. He does seem extremely murderous. To me, this is a story about god sicking his attack dogs on a good person’s innocent family. To prove a point to his attack dog.

originally posted by: 5StarOracle
a reply to: Woodcarver

I bet you can convince yourself of anything...
Too bad you can’t make me believe you...
Woodcarver... You should change your nick to blockhead...
Bring that hate for God and those who believe in him, just try harder though because you kind of suck at this so far...
I’m younger than you most likely and I think you are simple, so nice try there too...

There are at least four insults in your post there. If you put at least as much effort into learning your bible, you would be an atheist too.

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04
a reply to: Woodcarver

If that's your takeaway then it's because it's what you want to be true, since literally none of that is true.

My takeaways are that God allows free will and faith won't stop bad things from happening, but God does not allow more than we can endure. God does not cause these things to happen. If we keep our faith good things can come from the suffering.

What good thing did Job get?

He got to live forever, in adoration of the guy that killed his family?

Nooooooo thanks.

a reply to: Woodcarver

Those are not insults, I was just telling the truth...
Feel free to continue to showcase your fabulous knuckle dragging ability, be careful not to slip and fall on your drool though...

a reply to: TzarChasm

So this earth is the prison?
And the punishment is bad things happening

Yes God gave us free will, it was His gift to us

I am not sure I understand your argument yet