Remote viewing and why the C.I.A. dropped it after twenty years.

a reply to: charlyv

It's overall "Usefulness" or Ethics has nothing to do with it not being recognized as a science, in which many Phd's and Military brass participated in.

Right, like Dr. Doom...Ed Dames and his famous kill shot. I always got a big kick out of Ed on C2C, especially with his RV of Satan and ETs...

Perhaps we could get private contracts with the 3 letters to RV for them. We could all learn RVing on youtube and create a think tank.

REPLY TO: Osirisvet (the dang reply function won't work!)

HEY PEOPLE! Did anyone read my post, besides Osirisvset?? He totally contradicts himself. That's a big thing that needs to be worked out or addressed before even discussing anything else!

Osiris- that's not what he said or implied. And he said that we currently have three species regularly visiting us and taking samples and studying us, etc. Said they all three know and follow the rules.

He did not imply that some are inter-dimensional and some are physical, coming from other planets. He began by saying they are NOT from other planets or from deep space. Then he later starts talking about they are probes from deep space and how their physiology is different than ours in ways that result from their environs being different (he uses the example that if their world is a planet covered entirely by water, then they will have gills).

Nowhere does he say there is a mix. Or imply it. If he did, I missed it and would love for someone to point out the time stamp.

I used to put some credence on this guy, but that's a big contradiction. And no one here seems to think it matters. What the heck, ATS people!

I have met and talked to a retired remote viewer. His answer is, we are never really retired, don’t mention my name and so I honor his request. In a nut shell it continues and it works. It is supported by an elaborate underground facility isolating the viewer from outside influence and is stricktly controlled. But who knows, it could all be BS or not?

This comes to mind eh?

a reply to: olaru12

and this.
Tavistock. They wind you up because they know what makes you tick.

themillenniumreport.com...

To all the non-believers, I've said it before, and I'll say it again, there is definitely something to remote viewing. Its accuracy on the other hand is more subjective as it is open to the biases of the interpreter. Intention is key, and actual freeing up your mind and letting it happen. Interpret afterwards. The pros may be able to operate differently, but for us amateurs, that is how we should try to do it. I believe we can all do it. Some better than others. Just like running; some people are naturally better than others, but with practice we can all improve.

I guess R.V. for most people is one of those things like seeing an UFO or a ghost etc. Most people don't really believe in it until they see or experience it. Then they become believers. That is how it was with me. I took my son to the IRVA (International Remote Viewing Association) conference in Las Vegas several years ago. They have one every year in June I think. While there, they had several participation exercises, and this is what convinced me that R.V. is real. If you want to read about the details of the exercises, here a couple of links to other threads on this that I replied to.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

www.abovetopsecret.com...

note: the insert link button wasn't working for some reason (???) I hope the links work as is.

ff

a reply to: fastfred

"Just like running; some people are naturally better than others, but with practice we can all improve."

You hit the nail on the head, for instance I can teach anyone to see aura's. Dont believe me ? I'll put money on it. I'm confident because I have taught at least 5 people who had no prior experience or knowledge of the subject.

Just like that, they became believers and wanted more and more knowledge. I could teach you a lot of things if you just let go of the fact that you dont wanna hear it from me.

They guys you see on the fringe media are fakers. Or fakirs.


There really is a remote program, used on ISIS and Bin Laden.

The turkeys they show you are a smokescreen. They purposefully cloud the issue with tall tales and legends so that the Chinese RV teams cannot get a trustworthy fix on OUR RV teams. The Chinese, Russian and AQ viewing teams try to lock on to Area 51 and they literally start seeing bugs bunny cartoons, the ones with Marvin the Martian. So they won't trust anything they pick up.

One RV lab looked like the sleeper booths from the movie "Alien", so the other teams would start confusing images from that movie with whatever the real team was acually doing.

a reply to: Kandinsky

The Cold war was considered over and the US was calling it a win.

I guess your right but lets not forget, Western Powers in the cold war era armed the Mujahideen of Afghanistan, through covert ops. Soviet Union and its military forces were not expecting a Guerrilla warfare.

originally posted by: fastfred
To all the non-believers, I've said it before, and I'll say it again, there is definitely something to remote viewing.

I am sure that you believe that it is. But believing does not make it so.

I took my son to the IRVA (International Remote Viewing Association) conference in Las Vegas several years ago. They have one every year in June I think. While there, they had several participation exercises, and this is what convinced me that R.V. is real.

Of course they did. Their actual purpose was to make you believe. And see it worked.

Remote viewing does not exist. Suggestion on the other side does. Imho most people are prone to suggestion, just to different degrees.

a reply to: moebius

Well Moby, I don't believe because they want me to believe, or some kind of suggestion. I became a believer because I experienced it. I suggest you try it before being so dismissive.

At the IRVA conference they ran a couple of double blind type of experiments that I was skeptical about initially. They had a set of 20 unique images, each numbered and sealed in an envelop. We were given 5 mins. to draw the image to be selected in the future. We had no idea what the images were. And nobody had any idea which image would be selected as the process would be random.

I waited until approx. 4 mins. had passed before I started to draw anything because I didn't want to turn in blank paper. So I closed my eyes and thought for a moment, and kind of went blank. The first thing/image that came to me I started to draw. As I did, more detail came to me and I drew it. Time was up. I signed and dated my drawing. The process of selecting the image we were suppose to match was as follows. Someone from the audience was selected to roll a pair of dice. This determined an envelop to open that contained a list. Another person was selected to roll the dice again to select the item on the list which had a corresponding reference to the image envelopes indicating which one to open. I have to say I didn't match exactly the image, but it was better than 90%. The first image (expr.) had 3 people in it, and for some reason that is the only part (detail) I didn't get; everything else in the background, foreground etc. was there. FYI, the people in the image were a very minor part, and not the focus of it.

After the reveal they showed us all of the images. They were all very different. So there was no way to confuse which image you were trying to match with. The amount of detail I had in my drawing that matched so so closely to the imge selected is what really blew my mind. And when the experiment was repeated with a new set of images, and happened again; I'm convinced there really is something to this. Especially the fact that this was something that hadn't happened yet; the selection of the image to draw.

Also, for anyone who suspects some sort of cheating; the dice were large dense foam ones. I inspected them myself, and rolled them to make sure they were not loaded in some way. Also, the people selected were not plants, as at least one of them I had met before and talked at length with.

So Moby, try and keep a more open mind. But I do agree that people are prone to suggestion. But don't make such blanket statements if you don't know what you are talking about.

ff

a reply to: anonentity

I still think Ingoo swans book "penetration" is real and the CIA tested his abilities and spent billions doing so
just because they thought the Russians were doing the same thing!

It's an interesting topic. On one side I'm willing to believe that there may be some things that the human mind is capable of, like remote viewing, that are not undestood or even known.

On the other side, none of the 'evidence' that has come to light so far seems credible. I don't doubt that the CIA or some other government agency tried it, if just because the russians also tried it, however, if something came out of it, they kept the compelling examples secret until know.

remote viewing is exactly what shaman do !

and its been practiced for thousands of years by shaman all over earth

they remote view where the animals are !

they tap into the energy of the planet and find it !

they speak to the ancestor spirits and gather information

just because science cant explain doesnt make it any less real , I mean we cant effectively explain gravity any more than we can explain where consciousness comes from yet somehow we dismiss all the subjective states of consciousness , despite millions of humans repeating the same steps and getting the same results!

originally posted by: fastfred
a reply to: moebius
Well Moby, I don't believe because they want me to believe, or some kind of suggestion. I became a believer because I experienced it. I suggest you try it before being so dismissive.

Caution may be advisable for some people. I only say that because a good friend of mine dabbled with RV some twenty years ago - even having his own personal trainer - and was quite traumatised, eventually believing that other individuals were trying to psychically 'attack' him from afar.

Of course that could all be standard clinical paranoia rather than reality, but the effect on his demeanour was undeniable despite being a very grounded individual beforehand. He's okay now but it took a while to recover from. His reason for dabbling? Gambling and accessing good tips at the bookies! Not a good starting point.

As for reading material, Jim Schnabel's 'Remote Viewers: The Secret History of America's Psychic Spies' is still top of the pile for me.

a reply to: fastfred

You fell for a magic trick mentalists do things like that all the time. They dont really read your mind and you are not magically predicting anything. There is hundreds of ways to match your drawing to a picture. If you think your drawing was selected at random your wrong.

Oh and they got you to that conference to make money off you. You paid to be swindled just so you know

originally posted by: toysforadults
Is this guy credible? What proof does he have?

listen from 5:30 to 6:11, and there is your answer.

a reply to: Crusher


It would have gone dark by now, after twenty years they would have got a few of the techniques nailed down, so if they had a good student with natural abilities that plus training would be enough.

a reply to: dragonridr

Hey dragonridr, I know what you're talking about but this wasn't the case here. There were probably around a hundred people involved, and there was no way for them to see/know what I drew; or what anyone else drew for that matter before the selection process started. Also the amount of detail in particular in the background was so spot-on that it was what really got me. Remember, I had no idea what I was suppose to draw. The image could have been anything; microscopic, macroscopic, animal, mineral, geometric, landscape, etc. Also my position in the room was about 2/3rds back, and about center. The room was somewhat dimly lit, so any kind spying would also be extremely difficult.

FYI, not everyone got it. Some people were better than others; some not very good at all. But my first effort turned out to be my best with details matching. My second was good also, but not as good as the first.

All I can say is I was fairly skeptical at first, and I was trying to determine if there was some sort of scam going on, or if it was real. My conclusion is that there really is something to it. My experience moved the dial for me from skeptic to believer. The phenomenon has something to it. How reliable it is seems heavily dependent upon the interpretation which is subjective and could be problematic for practical applications. By this I mean; if you didn't have an image to compare it to you might be somewhat lost. In the case of a landscape, you might get that it is a landscape, but not know where it is located unless it had a very unique well recognized feature. But I guess the pros. have worked on these issues to increase the reliability. Also the pros are probably people with natural above average psychic abilities.

FYI, I didn't get swindled out of any money. I took my son there because he was interested (a weekend for father son bonding). Also I've been interested in it for a while, and I wanted a chance to discuss it with Dr. Targ & Dr. Puthoff .

ff

a reply to: anonentity

The Degree of Success was Debatable ?