It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

Lobbyism - Legalized Corruption

page: 1
9
<<   2 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on Nov, 23 2018 @ 03:09 AM
link   
I, as a Russian troll, have always been very concerned about the issue of corruption. Because it is corruption that is one of the main reasons for the fall of peoples, countries, empires and civilizations. Taking advantage of corruption, all negative forces can easily change not only the moral and moral foundations of any society and state, but also change its legislation. That is, countries and peoples will disappear not just like that, but under the Law.

Any healthy society will resist corruption primarily because of a sense of self-preservation. I emphasize a healthy society. Unless it is infected with suicide virus. In Russia, every day, news agencies report dozens of corrupt officials arrested - from businessmen and generals to government officials at the level of governors and government ministers. I think this is normal. This is a public reaction to the virus of suicide, which is introduced into it, often from the outside. You can call it the tyranny of Putin and the KGB, we call it the dictatorship of the Law.

And what about the USA?

Opening Wikipedia:




Lobbying, persuasion, or interest representation is the act of attempting to influence the actions, policies, or decisions of officials in their daily life, most often legislators or members of regulatory agencies. Lobbying is done by many types of people, associations and organized groups, including individuals in the private sector, corporations, fellow legislators or government officials, or advocacy groups (interest groups). Lobbyists may be among a legislator's constituencies, meaning a voter or bloc of voters within their electoral district; they may engage in lobbying as a business. Professional lobbyists are people whose business is trying to influence legislation, regulation, or other government decisions, actions, or policies on behalf of a group or individual who hires them. Individuals and nonprofit organizations can also lobby as an act of volunteering or as a small part of their normal job. Governments often define and regulate organized group lobbying that has become influential.


en.wikipedia.org...

I conclude:

1. Corruption is a normal business.
2. Business has replaced God
3. The country has lost the will to live and legally proclaimed suicide as its goal and the American dream

What do you think?

thank




posted on Nov, 23 2018 @ 04:26 AM
link   
Hi Troll, hope you are good today.

I think the fact that many humans crave power is what leads to corruption. Power is craved by human nature, so I believe corruption to be an unavoidable part of society.

You are correct in surmising business is the new God. But I think even if we lived in a society free from business and consumerism there would still be humans craving power and bending the rules for their benefit.

I also think corruption is relative to the moral framework of the governing method used within a country. Corruption could potentially be morally right and advantageous to society if the overall governing method is 'evil'. Although that might not be true because I cannot think of an example, and probably isn't the true definition of 'corruption'.



posted on Nov, 23 2018 @ 04:47 AM
link   
 


off-topic post removed to prevent thread-drift


 



posted on Nov, 23 2018 @ 05:04 AM
link   
a reply to: RussianTroll

Be careful using any language other than English, it is against T&Cs and your posts will be deleted. It is for no other reason but to ensure consistency in communication.

The survey results you post are not surprising to me. At heart we do believe in the 'good' things in life. But when we are on our own, maybe at work, power can feel good, and power does indeeed corrupt.

In my opinion less than 1% would answer that power makes them happy or gives them purpose, it's not an acceptable answer.

But if you take a look around, there are power hungry animals everywhere.



posted on Nov, 23 2018 @ 05:07 AM
link   
a reply to: RussianTroll

Yes money is the new god all hail money! But still 69 % said it was family that gives them a sense of purpose. Which also explains why the sociopaths in charge have been attacking the family.



posted on Nov, 23 2018 @ 05:11 AM
link   
a reply to: and14263

It’s called social engineering I believe.



posted on Nov, 23 2018 @ 05:17 AM
link   
What goes up? Evzio goes up! Kaleo goes up!

Who needs $$$? Kaleo does!

Who needs Evzio? Overdosed opiat-addicted do!

Who will go up in January '19? Pfizer and nine other pharmacy industries!


It is so nice to live in a late stage capitalism, righto?



posted on Nov, 23 2018 @ 05:18 AM
link   
a reply to: surfer_soul

As in - you believe that we crave power due to social engineering of our 'success' driven society?

I'd like to clarify before I give further opinion in case I am barking up the wrong tree.

(That reminds me of an old Russian saying: "Dogs barking can't fly without umbrellas" - or something!)



posted on Nov, 23 2018 @ 05:29 AM
link   

originally posted by: surfer_soul
a reply to: and14263

It’s called social engineering I believe.


You're right. Running in of social technologies occurs not only in countries of the 3 world, but already in the countries of the West. I can observe how the Maidan technologies in Ukraine in 2013 are now being applied in the USA. The boomerang returns, and the question remains: “Were all social technologies and methods of informational and hybrid wars destined for the East? Or are the final goal Americans and Europeans, Caucasian people?”
Remember when the first "color" revolution? Did her laws come up with Gene Sharp? Not!
The first "color" revolution was in London - The Gordon Riots of 1780
en.wikipedia.org...



posted on Nov, 23 2018 @ 05:35 AM
link   
a reply to: and14263

Yes, but it goes deeper than that. For now and so as not to go off topic, let’s just consider the aspect of a success driven society and what we generally consider success to mean.



posted on Nov, 23 2018 @ 05:38 AM
link   
You think Putin is free of corruption?



posted on Nov, 23 2018 @ 05:44 AM
link   
a reply to: surfer_soul

I think craving power is natural and would be evident even in a society where financial/career success is not valued.

It could be a survival instinct, some of us crave the power, in order to lead the pack, in order to ensure pack survival.

So the engineered society we now live in hasn't given birth to power craving, it has only emphasised it. Of course this is only my opinion and I have no way of testing this in a non-success driven society.... Oh actually, what about tribes, where success is down to hunting, gathering and farming... I do believe there is an element of corruption to be seen within the 'Witch Doctors'. They certainly crave power and deceive and corrupt to keep their power.

And their success is not socially engineered and financial/career based. It is pure power ov3er the tribe.



posted on Nov, 23 2018 @ 05:49 AM
link   

originally posted by: TREESNAKE1111
You think Putin is free of corruption?


Now no one is free from corruption. She is in the life of every person, sometimes we do not even notice her.

Is Putin free from corruption? Of course not. If he personally is probably not a corrupt official (for many years now hundreds of NGOs and intelligence agencies have been looking for Putin’s money, but they cannot find it), then his circle is 100% non-free. Putin refused dozens of personal friends, whom he put in power and who became corrupt. Some were sent to prison, others fled to London and Tel Aviv. I understand him, hard to lose personal friends whom I loved and trusted. But he has other priorities, not enrichment. He after the collapse raises the great country



posted on Nov, 23 2018 @ 06:02 AM
link   
a reply to: RussianTroll


Now no one is free from corruption. She is in the life of every person, sometimes we do not even notice her.


This is the part which interests me most.

For example, am I corrupt but do not realise this?

And if I am corrupt, and do not realise, then that would indicate the 'urge for corruption' is subconscious... meaning it could be an innate survival mechanism!


I am now trying to think of ways I have been are currently are being corrupt. There is a strong relationship with selfishness, which is discussed in this book nicely: en.wikipedia.org...



posted on Nov, 23 2018 @ 06:03 AM
link   
a reply to: surfer_soul



“As naturally as the ruled always took the morality imposed upon them more seriously than did the rulers themselves, the deceived masses are today captivated by the myth of success even more than the successful are. Immovably, they insist on the very ideology which enslaves them. The misplaced love of the common people for the wrong which is done to them is a greater force than the cunning of the authorities.”

T.W. Adorno

That rhymes with this topic as well; the higher your status, the higher is the amount of corruption in your life.



posted on Nov, 23 2018 @ 06:19 AM
link   

originally posted by: and14263
a reply to: RussianTroll


Now no one is free from corruption. She is in the life of every person, sometimes we do not even notice her.


This is the part which interests me most.

For example, am I corrupt but do not realise this?

And if I am corrupt, and do not realise, then that would indicate the 'urge for corruption' is subconscious... meaning it could be an innate survival mechanism!


I am now trying to think of ways I have been are currently are being corrupt. There is a strong relationship with selfishness, which is discussed in this book nicely: en.wikipedia.org...



I cannot say whether you are corrupt, and how this corruption is manifested. Corruption in the United States and Russia is very different. Domestic corruption is very developed in Russia - bribes to a policeman, a doctor, a petty official. In the USA - state corruption, at a high level in business and in power. Russians in most cases come to the officials with "gratitude" in the form of a box of chocolates or coffee cans. This is also corruption. Compare unethical and unscientific.
True, in Russia now and this is rapidly changing and approaching "Western standards", unfortunately.

I believe that there is no “selfish gene”. It’s just a false scientific justification for one’s own weakness and greed



posted on Nov, 23 2018 @ 06:21 AM
link   
a reply to: RussianTroll

The book does not discuss a 'selfish gene' as such.

There is no selfish gene.


Dawkins uses the term "selfish gene" as a way of expressing the gene-centred view of evolution as opposed to the views focused on the organism and the group, popularising ideas developed during the 1960s by W. D. Hamilton and others.



posted on Nov, 23 2018 @ 06:49 AM
link   

originally posted by: and14263
a reply to: RussianTroll

The book does not discuss a 'selfish gene' as such.

There is no selfish gene.


Dawkins uses the term "selfish gene" as a way of expressing the gene-centred view of evolution as opposed to the views focused on the organism and the group, popularising ideas developed during the 1960s by W. D. Hamilton and others.




The Overton window



posted on Nov, 23 2018 @ 06:52 AM
link   
a reply to: RussianTroll

A valuable link, thank you.



posted on Nov, 23 2018 @ 02:10 PM
link   
a reply to: and14263

Sorry I wasn’t very clear about what I was getting at. What I meant is that I feel social engineering has conditioned people to accept things they otherwise wouldn’t. Look at this thread for instance, we have two brits and a Russian discussing lobbying in American politics and apart from public opinion no Americans! Lobbying is so normalised for them it’s not even an issue perhaps.

I agree with troll it seems like legalised bribery and surely something that shouldn’t be allowed under law?



new topics

top topics



 
9
<<   2 >>

log in

join