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Collegiate Fraternal Orders and their ties to secret societies

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posted on Aug, 27 2006 @ 09:33 AM
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Originally posted by chrysoloras
I know that the fraternity as a whole does not really care about the true facts of the life of Chrysolroas, especially the fact the he never once taught at Bologna as the order states.


Ahhhh yes...I know what you mean now. I remember sitting through a presentation at our chapter by one of our alumni who is big into researching the legit history of our order and those involved (i.e. Chysoloras). Amoung some interesting tidbits about various historically important families in Italy, he talked about how its doubtful that he taught in Bologna, and some of the theories as to why this "idea" came to light and some other stuff.

This was like 5 years ago or so, so most of the stuff has since passed on from my brain. While I myself an not a big historian type of guy, I know that many of our men are almost obsessed with finding out more, and I can relate to that. Just not really my thing.

-Steve




posted on Oct, 28 2006 @ 11:05 AM
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dear edamianx id be curious as to what you found out about the mystic 7 i to am a sigma chi very interresting


Sol

posted on Dec, 13 2006 @ 05:13 AM
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Hello everyone,

I'm sorry I missed the heated discussion here from a few months ago. This is a subject I'm currently researching and writing about, but I must've been asleep that week. (:-)

"Fraternal orders" in general have since the days of antiquity been a familiar vessel for spreading Enlightenment in a Dark Age. During the barbaric Middle Ages in Europe in particular, such orders formed the backbone for carrying on the "mystical-alchemical" traditions of Ancient Hermetical Science, when discussing such things in public could quickly get one burned at the stake. This "hermetic science" was basically an enlightened philosophy for its time, and involved such heretical and forbidden ideas as the fact that the Earth is not the center of the Universe but merely one planet in a whole Solar System.

Fraternities in the US carried on this tradition of Knowledge and Culture, and many of them began in discussion groups on philosophy and literature. Some, like Kappa Sigma, do not hide their connection with influential figures of the late Middle Ages like Manuel Chrisoloras, who, along with some contemporaries, paved the way for the Reformation and eventually to our Age of Reason today. Part of the emblem of Kappa Sigma is the Caduceus, the Staff of Hermes, which incorporates some of the the most ancient "alchemical" symbols known to Man. This is the only fraternity (to my knowledge), other than the Medical one, to use this symbol.

Perhaps it will be possible to resurrect this discussion and get some further opinions on this. If the poster "chrisoloras" is still subscribed to this forum, I would particularly be very interested to get in contact with you.

My very best,
Sol



posted on Dec, 14 2006 @ 05:24 AM
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hello, i am also very intrigued with the symbolism used in fraternity rituals. i love to study them and see how they relate to freemasonry or the oddfellows, also i like to see how the fratenity shapes its men. if anyone has any rituals that they would like to share, please U2U me, i need help starting my collection/research.

to elaborate on the staff of hermes. it is my understanding that Kappa Sig used many symbols so they could recognize their meeting places and discuss intellectual matters. originally they were formed because of a tyrant that was ruling the city of bologna. members had to meet in secret because of him, the staff could have been a symbol meant to trick people into thinking that they were there for different reasons.


M74

posted on Dec, 25 2006 @ 12:44 AM
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Well, as an active Beta hailing from a chapter that originated as one of the Mystic Seven temples, I can't get into the specifics regarding the lore (as I have made such a pledge not to reveal it), but I can clear up some of the origins and it's history.

The Mystic Seven were formed as a literary society, in part to break away from other (open) literary societies that the original seven men fell out of favor with and disagreed with, and in part influenced by the rise of masonry. The Mystic Seven, I should point out, is in no way shape or form directly related to masonry in its origin. Many Mystics familiar with the founders motives would tend to describe its founding as more of their own vision of what masonry offered, in their own image. It was founded not so much as an "anti-masonry" society so much as an alternative. Their own secret society with its own meaning. They are very different in their overall views.

The confusion between Mystics connection to both Beta and DKE comes from the civil war. The Mystic temples were damaged greatly leading up to and during the way, as members left to fight and meetings were put on indefinite hold. After the war, the first Temple (Temple of the Wand) began to re-examine their standing as a society, and began looking for alternative ways to exist as a brotherhood. They originally turned to DKE, and were rejected for admission three times. Some time went by, and eventually circumstances cause the Temple of the Wand to split into two groups. There were those who we consider the traitors, those who split, and they petitioned separately for admission to DKE, and were eventually accepted and formed a new chapter. The true Mystics of Temple of the Wand still remained, however. Despite this, the Temple of the Scroll and Pen followed the traitors' lead, and also chose to petition separately for admission to DKE, and formed a new chapter at Syracuse, breaking away and forfeiting their right as Mystics.

Fast forward a bit, Beta eventually approached the Temple of the Wand for admission, in their mission for expansion. Beta specifically was looking for a way to expand further into the south. The Temple of the Wand offered their current strongest temple, the Temple of the Star in Mississippi (Ole Miss), as the first to lead the assimilation charge. Soon the few remaining temples in the south followed their lead, and eventually Temple of the Wand finished the deal when the merger was officially made around 1879. Mystic OFFICIALLY belongs to Beta Theta Pi. The two DKE chapters founded by old ex-mystics are generally regarded as traitors, and ignored by the true Mystic chapters still active within Beta (if you ever visit a strong Mystic Beta chapter, you might notice they hold a strange animosity toward DKE in general, in many cases). Much of the original Mystic ritual has been rewritten and made part of what is now the Beta ritual.

Anything else you specifically wish to know regarding the Mystic Seven, I can try to answer to the best of my ability.


[edit on 25-12-2006 by M74]

[edit on 25-12-2006 by M74]


M74

posted on Dec, 30 2006 @ 03:51 PM
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Originally posted by chrysolorasIn 1868 an offshoot of the Mystical Seven was founded at the Univ. of Virgina, called the Mystic Seven. Much debate has taken place as to the legitimacy of whether this group was or was not part of the Wesleyan group. However, in 1890 the Mystic Seven and its chapters did merge with Beta Theta Pi. Beta Theta Pi at the time did incorporate some of its ceremonies into their rituals. Later these became optional for chapters to use or not use. (A similiar thing happen a few years prior with another group known as WWW or Rainbow Society, and Delta Tau Delta. WWW it has been said was an offshoot from the Mystical Seven as well.)
Are you a Beta, from Wesleyan, or Mystic? Because some of that information is sketchy, but I can clean up some of it.

The Southern chapters were originally founded separately, as Temple of the Wand wasn't confident in its ability to maintain communication with chapters so far away. However, they were later officially accepted as Mystic Temples, adding to the grand total of ten Temples in the society's lifetime (a common misconception was that there were only seven temples, three were "lost", and consequently "replaced", adding up to ten total). The rituals were the same, the traditions were the same, and the southern temples and their foundings were, in fact, perpetuated by members from Temple of the Wand and other northern-based Temples who supported southern expansion. For all intents and purposes, they are the same society with the same established principles.

The Wesleyan boys aren't the only ones who are still very much actively Mystic, as I stated in my previous post. I myself am not from Wesleyan, but my chapter is very strong in their Mystic background and we have maintained a most of our original documents (a few were lost in a fire decades ago, unfortunately).

Also, the Rainbow fraternity was started in Mississippi (Ole Miss). It was influenced a great deal by the Temple of the Star, but was not officially connected to the Mystic Seven. There were members who either left the Mystic Seven, or were in some other way familiar with the very basic principles of the Mystic lore, and they recycled a great deal of what they did know into Rainbow. It was later assimilated into Delta Tau Delta.

Also, I should point out that it wasn't uncommon for Mystic Temples to handle their business in a more publicly acceptable fashion, such as assuming other fraternal titles. Many Mystic Temples were active while at the same time being active chapters of other Greek letter organizations. Their Greek fraternities were unaware of their Mystic secrets, up until the time they all rejoined and came together as one as new chapters of Beta Theta Pi. Consider it a nice cover.


Also, the merger between Mystic and Beta was a long process, as it was generally handled in a fashion where each Temple was brought into the fold one or two at a time. All the temples were brought in during a ten year process from 1879-1889.

[edit on 12/30/2006 by M74]



posted on Jan, 21 2007 @ 12:02 AM
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m74 I am a beta and would liike to ask you about this



posted on Sep, 17 2007 @ 08:55 AM
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I was wondering about more information about the Heptasophs or Seven Wise men group mentioned by Chrysoloras. I've been offline for a long time now and I'd like to speak to him or anyone else who knows more about this enigmatic group. Sounds very interesting. Thanks a bunch!



posted on Oct, 12 2007 @ 12:10 AM
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Guys im new to the forum and i apologize if i dont follow what u are trying to get to. All of these fraternities are great in their own way. All i see is a bunch of ridiculous questions about what this one does and what that one does. If you really want to know your gonna have to buck up and join. The secrecy protects the lodge. We dont want everyone to join. Not everyone has the stones it takes to be in any of these fraternities. In that you want a specific type of person to join your lodge. Oddfellows and Masons want an upright, caring, giving person. We dont want everyone and if you cant live your life in an unselfish lawful manner we dont want you. One thing all of these have in common is that when they were started they were started to help others in need. No more no less.



posted on Jan, 15 2008 @ 04:01 PM
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The Kappa Sigma ritual was taken by Stephen Alonzo Jackson. I heard he was killed by masons, actually. Anyway, decide for yourself. This guy posted the main part of the Kappa Sigma ritual/initiation on his myspace page in the blog section.

www.myspace.com/kappasigmaritual



posted on Jan, 15 2008 @ 05:54 PM
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Originally posted by Kappasigmar
The Kappa Sigma ritual was taken by Stephen Alonzo Jackson. I heard he was killed by masons, actually.


Oh, look ... another unsubstantiated rumour with no proof or references.

Sigh.

Jackson was a Freemason, he wasn't killed by them. Duh.

Your pal,
Meat.



posted on Jan, 16 2008 @ 02:43 PM
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He was a freemason, and then borrowed/stole many aspects of the Masonic ritual to supplement the then sparse Kappa Sigma ritual. Once the masons found out about this, they killed him.



posted on Jan, 16 2008 @ 06:45 PM
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Originally posted by Kappasigmar
He was a freemason, and then borrowed/stole many aspects of the Masonic ritual to supplement the then sparse Kappa Sigma ritual. Once the masons found out about this, they killed him.


No, he wasn't.

Show my your proof, otherwise it's just a wild rumour. Next thing you know, we're going to find secret documents (that has to be real, because it's PDF file) that connects SK to Hellenic alien fish babies. And then we'll connect it to a fictional flick about a guy who makes a mountain out of mashed potatoes.

C'mon, man ... be better than that. Show your proof.

Your pal,
Meat.



posted on Jan, 30 2008 @ 12:50 AM
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reply to post by chrysoloras
 


I am a Kappa Sigma at the Lambda Zeta chapter and I am Completely fascinated with the history of the fraternity. I would greatly appreciate it if you or any other Kappa Sig viewing this could take the time to explain some more history to me.



posted on Apr, 28 2008 @ 09:04 PM
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M74 where have you been initiated as a Beta?



posted on Jul, 14 2008 @ 10:53 PM
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reply to post by M74
 


M74 -- how can I contact you outside of this forum?



posted on Aug, 5 2008 @ 03:02 PM
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reply to post by allthemodrnthgs
 


Though you are correct about Sigma Chi changing there name from Sigma Phi, you are wrong about the reason. Not to point fingers, but your source of this information is from the worst possible person to ask about the matter. Sigma Chi's original name was Sigma Phi. The sigma phi ritual was stolen and then a new ritual was put in place and the name was changed to Sigma Chi. Most other sources site this fact except for Beta Theta Pi. The "rumor" or underlying truth of the whole matter is that Sigma Phi and Beta Theta Pi were rival fraternities and the Sigma Phi ritual was stolen by Beta, thus forcing the name change to Sigma Chi and a new ritual.



posted on Aug, 5 2008 @ 03:04 PM
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reply to post by senrak
 


I really hope that you are not going out trying to find other Fraternities' rituals. That would dissappoint many if not all greek members out there.



posted on Aug, 5 2008 @ 03:11 PM
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reply to post by 7YearItch
 


Sorry man, but I highly doubt that will happen. These are secret societies. Why would people discuss their rituals openly? Seems pretty dumb to even ask.



posted on Aug, 5 2008 @ 03:15 PM
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reply to post by Zauberer
 



Why would you want to freely discuss anything about a SECRET organization. I will promise you, as a member of a Fraternity myself, half of what you see, read, or hear about the rituals of a certain Fraternity are way off base. People put false rituals out there in order to keep the actual ritual a secret, unless you are a member of the Fraternity than you will never truly understand their ritual, even if you read it.



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