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Should the US divorce?

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posted on Nov, 20 2018 @ 12:30 PM
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originally posted by: JAGStorm

originally posted by: watchitburn
a reply to: JAGStorm

If that were to happen, we would see wars on American soil within a generation.

I don't think anyone wants to see that.

We may have disagreements on how we govern the country, but we're all still Americans.


My fear is that we are going to see war on American soil regardless.

I have the same feeling, what the outcome will be is anybody's guess, maybe split up with a east America and a west America. Doubtful though.
But it does feel like something is going to happen .




posted on Nov, 20 2018 @ 12:39 PM
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a reply to: Aazadan
I have read and, no it's not... I think you have been brainwashed to think this by propaganda pushed to today's children By the Federal Department of Education. Educate yourself. Read it for yourself and forget the BS you have been taught.

Edit: Interpret this for me.


The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people.[


edit on 20-11-2018 by CharlesT because: (no reason given)




The Ninth Amendment (Amendment IX) to the United States Constitution addresses rights, retained by the people, that are not specifically enumerated in the Constitution. It is part of the Bill of Rights.

edit on 20-11-2018 by CharlesT because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 20 2018 @ 12:45 PM
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a reply to: CharlesT

Even if you were right, which you aren’t, it has been tried twice before and both times it failed spectacularly.



posted on Nov, 20 2018 @ 12:47 PM
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a reply to: CharlesT

The only rights retained by the people are the ones the government says you have. Those can be changed at any time. Some are easier to change than others.



posted on Nov, 20 2018 @ 12:48 PM
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a reply to: Aazadan

i come from a small town...local politics is really all anyone cares about.

The biggest obstacles we face with education is the federal testing standards that have taken over teaching and replaced it with 8 hours of practice testing and rote memorization.

The biggest obstacles we face with health care tends to be pricing, which isn't really set at a state level. I'd look more to how Medicare impacts that.

The federal government has its roles. Regulating markets, protecting borders, and representing the union abroad are 3 good examples. Local government has its roles, too. And with federal regulation getting in the way, its hard for local government to do much more than throw their hands up and blame regulations for failure.



posted on Nov, 20 2018 @ 12:57 PM
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originally posted by: Aazadan
a reply to: CharlesT

The only rights retained by the people are the ones the government says you have. Those can be changed at any time. Some are easier to change than others.

I pity you. You have been brainwashed beyond repair. Because of all of the brainwashing political propaganda effecting these last generations, our constitutional republic is doomed.

Edit: We are slowly becoming China because of attitudes such as yours.
edit on 20-11-2018 by CharlesT because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 20 2018 @ 01:10 PM
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a reply to: CharlesT



We are slowly becoming China because of attitudes such as yours.


Actually, I'd suspect its only a matter of time before China owns the US. Considering the political situation in the US, it might be a relief!



posted on Nov, 20 2018 @ 01:41 PM
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originally posted by: Look2theSacredHeart
a reply to: JAGStorm


I think three things would be better solutions for this Red-Blue fistfight, though:
1. Limit corporate power

AOC and Justice Democrats want this too, they even have Wolf-PAC the anit pac money pac.


2. Term limits for congress

Absolutely, lets get the supremes too!


3. A viable third party

I would love to be wrong about this, but this just cant happen in our system. First past the goal is very limiting. Rank choice sounds pretty cool, but how do we get this at the federal level?



posted on Nov, 20 2018 @ 01:57 PM
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originally posted by: SwissMarked

originally posted by: watchitburn
a reply to: JAGStorm

If that were to happen, we would see wars on American soil within a generation.

I don't think anyone wants to see that.

We may have disagreements on how we govern the country, but we're all still Americans.


Communism/socialism is as unAmerican as you can possibly get and the majority of the west coast would/is wrapping their arms around it... so I wouldn’t say “we’re all Americans” when half the nation is trying to destroy the very fabric that made U.S. just that...


You live in a socialist society, youre brainwashed, and you are spreading your falsehoods.

I'd start with Police, Fire, Libraries, public transportation, K-12 education (you might have missed this), public roads, bridges, waterways, sewers, parks, etc. Congratulations, if you have ever used one of these services, you are a socialist too. But let's get to the good ones.

Medicare and Social Security. If you have a problem with these, then you are a selfish libertarian and I can't help you out of that hole.

Uhoh, how about the military!?!

How about corporate welfare. That's socialism for the rich. TIF funds, bailouts, etc. that's all socialism for them, but not for you. When New York pays $1B to Amazon, that's $1B that could have gone to making the citizens lives better. That's corporate socialism.

Tell me again how unamerican socialism is?
edit on 11/20/2018 by whargoul because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 20 2018 @ 02:19 PM
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originally posted by: bigfatfurrytexan
The biggest obstacles we face with education is the federal testing standards that have taken over teaching and replaced it with 8 hours of practice testing and rote memorization.


What's the problem with testing standards? If they're too low, states can always choose to exceed them. If they're too high, then doesn't that indicate the states are incompetent since they're still the ones that dictate curriculum and some states can't meet the goals?



The biggest obstacles we face with health care tends to be pricing, which isn't really set at a state level. I'd look more to how Medicare impacts that.


Health care pricing is set at the state level. Medicaid is run on a state by state basis. Insurance is run state by state. The feds don't determine any of that. Medicare has been forbidden from buying cheaper alternative drugs in some situations but that isn't what is driving the cost of care. What is driving the cost of care is the prices drug companies charge, and what insurance will pay for those drugs. The feds have nothing to say about that.


The federal government has its roles. Regulating markets, protecting borders, and representing the union abroad are 3 good examples. Local government has its roles, too. And with federal regulation getting in the way, its hard for local government to do much more than throw their hands up and blame regulations for failure.


What sorts of federal regulations get in the way? Because what I see in my small town, we have a small factory. It's quite dangerous and has many, many OSHA violations. However, they say it's too expensive to fix the violations, so instead they just hire security to prevent OSHA from accessing the premises. Then they say the cost of those regulations would put them out of business.

In other instances, we bury coal ash, then the containers leak into the drinking water (our towns drinking water is now officially considered toxic) but the local government refuses to do anything about it, because they don't want those jobs to go away.

From what I've seen, state and local governments have all of the power, none of the responsibility, and none of the accountability.
edit on 20-11-2018 by Aazadan because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 20 2018 @ 02:22 PM
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a reply to: CharlesT

So what makes you think a weak federal government is suddenly going to work this time?

What you're asking for is to break into 50 different nations, all of those nations would still have all of the same culture problems. And all of them would be weaker apart than we are as a whole. Imagine a land locked state like Iowa trying to do anything at all. Or Mississippi with it's total lack of education.

The end result of such a path would be a lot of war, a lot of dead countrymen, a lot of destruction, and a total lack of any sort of prominence on the world stage ever again.



posted on Nov, 20 2018 @ 02:27 PM
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a reply to: SocratesJohnson

I have heard rumors that China owns California.



posted on Nov, 20 2018 @ 02:28 PM
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a reply to: JAGStorm

It's time for the country to stop pretending like ideology is king, and start looking at the real, tangible world and try to fix things that governments have caused to go wrong.

The problem is, ideology IS king, and no one likes to admit that they're wrong, so we just keep on trucking.

We don't need a divorce, we need the parents to start acting like adults.



posted on Nov, 20 2018 @ 02:35 PM
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originally posted by: SlapMonkey
a reply to: JAGStorm

The problem is, ideology IS king, and no one likes to admit that they're wrong, so we just keep on trucking.

We don't need a divorce, we need the parents to start acting like adults.



Maybe neither side is wrong, they are just different.
Staying together just for the kids will just make everyone unhappy.




posted on Nov, 20 2018 @ 03:10 PM
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originally posted by: JAGStorm
Maybe neither side is wrong, they are just different.
Staying together just for the kids will just make everyone unhappy.


No, one side is definitely wrong. One side wants to sustain population growth through immigration, have an educated work force, and have a functional government that can serve it's citizens. The other wants to isolate itself from the world, abandon science, and live in some sort of libertarian mad max society that is headed up by the church.



posted on Nov, 20 2018 @ 03:40 PM
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Failing multiple secessions, IMO, the best route to go would be 50 territories akin to Guam, US Virgin Islands, Puerto Rico, American Samoa, but with substantially more autonomy, significantly less federal meddling, and equal representation for all things fed in DC.

But that would make too much sense, so of course it'll never happen.
edit on 11/20/2018 by Nyiah because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 20 2018 @ 03:50 PM
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originally posted by: Nyiah
Failing multiple secessions, IMO, the best route to go would be 50 territories akin to Guam, US Virgin Islands, Puerto Rico, American Samoa, but with substantially more autonomy, significantly less federal meddling, and equal representation for all things fed in DC.

But that would make too much sense, so of course it'll never happen.


Why should there be equal representation? Mississippi is not equal to California.



posted on Nov, 20 2018 @ 04:10 PM
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a reply to: Aazadan

Yes they are. They are each a state.



posted on Nov, 20 2018 @ 04:14 PM
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originally posted by: bigfatfurrytexan
Yes they are. They are each a state.


That invites a number of states with small populations to control the government. A tyranny of the minority. It's already bad enough that small states currently enjoy a significantly higher amount of representation relative to their residents.
edit on 20-11-2018 by Aazadan because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 20 2018 @ 04:35 PM
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originally posted by: Aazadan

originally posted by: Nyiah
Failing multiple secessions, IMO, the best route to go would be 50 territories akin to Guam, US Virgin Islands, Puerto Rico, American Samoa, but with substantially more autonomy, significantly less federal meddling, and equal representation for all things fed in DC.

But that would make too much sense, so of course it'll never happen.


Why should there be equal representation? Mississippi is not equal to California.


If memory serves, Puerto Rico has more population than about 20 US states, but zero useful representation in Washington.

It may not be equal in terms of statehood, but exactly how is neutering them as far as federal representation goes anywhere close to fair?



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