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Gray wolf population could lose federal protection under GOP Bill

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posted on Nov, 15 2018 @ 12:28 PM
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From This article



Republicans have only a few weeks left until they cede control of the House to Democrats, but the first big post-election GOP vote won’t address taxes or border wall funding.

It involves wolves.

Republicans are furiously pushing legislation that would remove gray wolves in the 48 contiguous U.S. states from the list of threatened and endangered animals protected under the Endangered Species Act, which safeguards those animals’ habitats. The House of Representatives is expected to vote on the bill Friday.


What the heck conservatives???

When did conservatives STOP BEING CONSERVATIVE? How is anyone conserving anything when they remove protection status... might as well remove the protection status of national forests while you are at it and completely deplete what our nation has.

When can we get this red haired cheeto out of office?????




posted on Nov, 15 2018 @ 12:31 PM
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a reply to: HunkaHunka

You have derailed sir.




posted on Nov, 15 2018 @ 12:32 PM
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Can you elaborate?


originally posted by: MisterSpock
a reply to: HunkaHunka

You have derailed sir.




posted on Nov, 15 2018 @ 12:41 PM
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a reply to: HunkaHunka

You appear to have developed a severe case of TDS.

I'm seams to be terminal.
Nothing more can be done I'm afraid. It's off to the glue factory for you.



posted on Nov, 15 2018 @ 12:46 PM
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a reply to: HunkaHunka




posted on Nov, 15 2018 @ 12:46 PM
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Wolves in Idaho, Montana, Wyoming, eastern Washington, eastern Oregon and part of Utah have already been removed from the endangered list because the populations there have recovered, according to U.S. Fish and Wildlife.

They are being removed from the endangered species list because they are no longer considered endangered.
You claim to be firing radicals in your supposed business but you appear to be just as radical if not even more so.
edit on 15-11-2018 by CharlesT because: (no reason given)

edit on 15-11-2018 by CharlesT because: (no reason given)

edit on 15-11-2018 by CharlesT because: (no reason given)


Edit; Fake comes to mind.
edit on 15-11-2018 by CharlesT because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 15 2018 @ 12:47 PM
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originally posted by: HunkaHunka
Can you elaborate?


originally posted by: MisterSpock
a reply to: HunkaHunka

You have derailed sir.



You blamed the Republicans.

The ESA needs to brought into 21st century natural sciences and ecology paradigm — it’s based on a very limited understanding of habitats and their inner connectedness to all animals and natural environmental services. That said, keystone species, like the gray wolf, provide a benefit far above the cost incurred. The darter fish or some ground-burrowing grouse, not nearly worth the cost.



posted on Nov, 15 2018 @ 12:51 PM
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a reply to: CharlesT

One must fight fire with fire



posted on Nov, 15 2018 @ 12:53 PM
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originally posted by: HunkaHunka
a reply to: CharlesT

One must fight fire with fire

BS! Do you hug trees?



posted on Nov, 15 2018 @ 12:56 PM
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a reply to: HunkaHunka

From your own article:

This is Bipartisan:




“This is bipartisan. But still, I think it fits easier on our agenda,” said Rep. Pete Sessions, R-Texas, who chairs the House Rules Committee that approved rules of debate for the wolf bill. “I think it makes it harder when there’s a new Congress.”

Sessions said both Republicans and Democrats from western states, where many gray wolves in the U.S. live, made a push to get the bill through.


It is already happening:



Despite legal challenges, the state’s Department of Fish & Wildlife has approved the killing of wolves who attack livestock, reigniting controversy between ranchers and conservationists.

Wolves in Idaho, Montana, Wyoming, eastern Washington, eastern Oregon and part of Utah have already been removed from the endangered list because the populations there have recovered, according to U.S. Fish and Wildlife.


This should have already happened:




But livestock industry associations, representing ranchers who have to deal with wolves scaring and attacking their cattle, argued in a letter to House leadership that the U.S. wolf population has recovered and would have already been removed from the endangered species list, if not for “activist litigants” who “used the judicial system to circumvent sound science and restore full ESA protections to these predators.



What is all the outrage about? People in urban areas trying to dictate policy in areas of the country in which they don't live or deal with the ramifications of idiot decisions made in Washington?

Or the title theme... Republicans Bad?
edit on 15-11-2018 by infolurker because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 15 2018 @ 12:59 PM
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a reply to: HunkaHunka

Wolves have been overprotected so much that they are overpopulated in some area's now. They pose a huge risk to livestock and to the local deer, elk and moose populations.

Why do you hate deer, elk and moose? You ever seen a wolf kill? How knowledgeable are you on wildlife management? Do you understand the dangers of predators becoming overpopulated and what it does to the populations of their prey?

I know, I know, them dog looking cute wolves, how cuddly. Those cuddly little dogs that would tear your children apart and wolf them down without a second thought. Those cute little dogs that in a pack can take down a moose for dinner.


Wolves in Idaho, Montana, Wyoming, eastern Washington, eastern Oregon and part of Utah have already been removed from the endangered list because the populations there have recovered, according to U.S. Fish and Wildlife.


They are not endangered, so why pretend otherwise? You don't manage wildlife based on fantasy and because people think wolves are pretty animals, ignoring the fact they are vicious predators that decimate livestock and wild game if allowed to overpopulate.



posted on Nov, 15 2018 @ 01:23 PM
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a reply to: infolurker

I agree the gray wolf should be considered ‘recovered’, but the idea that 1700 - 5000 gray wolves pose a significant threat to livestock in an area of 100,000 - 250,000 square miles is specious, at best. The livestock industry wants the ability to hunt nuisance wolves; however, it becomes a slippery-slope because once hunting is allowed without reporting (as mentioned they’re [livestock operations] allowed to hunt nuisance animals but must report the kill) the open public will have plausible deniability and hunting will proliferate.

I know, it happened here in NC with the Red Wolf. After 30 years of successful reintroduction efforts, the Red Wolf managed a breeding population that, by all measures, was healthy and free of genetic in-breeding...then the USFWS allowed farmers to hunt nuisance animals (there aren’t livestock operators in the dismal swamp area of Eastern NC — these wolves were never a nuisance but coyotes were). There were 100-150 total wolves in 2010, 3 years after the hunting was allowed, the population was around 35.

It should be mentioned, the coyote invasion (the red wolf can mate with a coyote and produce a sterile offspring) caused a great deal of the problem, but at least half of the deaths were the result of farmer shootings. Most farmer shootings were claimed as misidentification. 30+ years of time, money, and effort all for naught because the population is gonna die a slow death of in-breeding...5 years after they were ready to call the reintroduction a success.

WRAL — USFWS and Red Wolf Hunting



posted on Nov, 15 2018 @ 01:27 PM
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a reply to: HunkaHunka

As someone who lives in Montana, this is great news!

Want to save 100 elk? Kill a wolf.

Or as the bumper sticker here says... "Wolves. Smoke a pack a day."




posted on Nov, 15 2018 @ 01:34 PM
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a reply to: BeefNoMeat

The problem is the wolf this is about was never endangered in the first place.

I'm in Alaska for the last 18 years, but I'm originally from Idaho. I lived there when they brought in the wolves to transplant to Yellowstone.

First, after the wolf was said to be extinct in Idaho, I personally could have guided anyone who wished to two locations where packs existed. Two weeks before they released the wolves, I personally watched one of the native population die on the side of the road in Yellowstone. A tourist had hit it with their car.

Shortly after the wolves were released, the State Biologist admitted that he had been lying, that there were already wolves in multiple locations in Idaho. Local farmers and ranchers kept their existence on the down low to protect them. Then they get a punch in the gut when the transplanted wolves immediately left Yellowstone and started killing livestock.

Same with Bald Eagles that were never endangered and in fact flourish in large numbers in the US. We who lived there knew the truth all along.

Spotted Owl, never endangered and lives in many habitats. Even in a K-Mart sign. That whole thing was a lie.

We need to let Fish and Game return to doing their jobs in the same way that increased the deer and elk herds to levels that never existed in the US before.

At some point common sense needs to come into play and lies need to stop.



posted on Nov, 15 2018 @ 02:12 PM
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a reply to: Blaine91555

I hear ya, dude. We agree to varying degrees and appreciate your anecdotal evidence. I earnestly believe the livestock operators in The West are just protecting their property. No shame in that game.

The area that the lower 48 wolves inhabit is comparable to the area of the eastern time zone. If you believe the USFWS numbers, 1700 live in the area where livestock operators are concerned, the remaining 3700 live in Minnesota, Wisconsin, and Michigan. I’m sure you’ll try to square that with some qualification(s) or equivocation, but it’s simply not true that gray wolves pose any problem to anyone outside of livestock operators where the 1700 N. Rockies population exist.

USFWS Gray Wolf Population

The spotted-owl was a total PR stunt. It was political and shameful. I remember intrinsically thinking it was ‘off’. Got it right as a grade-schooler.

There are different narratives about what happened to the Bald Eagle — not here to get into that — but there was undeniable data that the Bald Eagle declined severely, ‘to the brink of extinction’ (whatever the threshold is). The data that shows the remarkable recovery of the Bald Eagle is astounding (I figured you could throw in some data and skip the anecdotes in future replies).

Not sure what you mean about Fish and Game doing their job like they did with deer and elk. Deer have become a nuisance to the point they’ve opened up hunting...increases in deer tick-bourne illnesses are another thing.

Common sense is always a good thing.



posted on Nov, 15 2018 @ 02:13 PM
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a reply to: Blaine91555

People fail to realize how adaptable canines are. Coyotes, for example, are literally warm blooded roaches. Wolves aren't far off from the same. Short of killing their food sources entirely it would be impossible to truly threaten their numbers.



posted on Nov, 15 2018 @ 02:23 PM
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They shouldn't have had Federal Protection in the first place and especially now. Reintroducing a Alpha predator to areas that contain livestock and ranchers was always a stupid idea.



posted on Nov, 15 2018 @ 02:39 PM
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this is a math problem

gray wolves > Orange Man

every day it's a new way to hate on Trump, I give it an A+ on originality but a D for realism



posted on Nov, 15 2018 @ 02:53 PM
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a reply to: BeefNoMeat

The problem with the eagles, is where I lived at the time had more of them than was said to exist in the entire lower 48.

Even now as those scavengers numbers are way up, if you see a feather lying on the ground and pick it up, you can do prison time. An eagle nest can end a construction project or divert a road.

I'm not buying the reported numbers. With the history of lies, even lying in a court of law knowingly, it's hard to accept.

My comment about the deer populations is to make the point of how well Fish and Game do at their jobs when left alone to do it. City dwellers don't know the facts and it's that naivete that radicals rely on as they push their false agenda's through the courts.

There was a workable balance before the madness started. Yes some animals did need protection, but not from hunters or ranchers. Hunters and ranchers were the best defense and the first to turn in someone poaching or killing animals for the heck of it. There is a large native wolf pack for instance in S.E. Idaho that exists because the local farmer and ranchers kept their existence close to the vest. The poachers were generally rolling stones up for a lark from Salt Lake City or Ogden.



posted on Nov, 15 2018 @ 02:53 PM
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a reply to: HunkaHunka
These conservationist use certain animals,plants or whatever to use as an umbrella species to lock up chunks as land from human use. The Y2Y (Yellowstone to Yukon)is using the endangered grizzly bear in its quest for an animal corridor even though they were pretty much delisted in some states. Lots of money from NGO's is flowing into Canada's conservation groups and with their help the Alberta NDP government is quickly turning the Eastern Slopes into "parks" which restricts resource development ,pipelines and even backwoods camping and off vechicle use.




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