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Farenheit 451 in California - Firefighters making $400K per year with OT

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posted on Nov, 13 2018 @ 04:20 PM
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a reply to: AugustusMasonicus

www.mercatus.org...

They're also in the 8th worst fiscal health of the 50 states. They are one "oopsie" away from serious pain and one "Oh S#!*" away from catastrophic failure to meet obligations. Counting unfunded pensions and state and local government debt, they carry about 1/9th the debt the federal government does... not a good move for an entity which cannot print their own money or set interest rates themselves.




posted on Nov, 13 2018 @ 04:20 PM
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originally posted by: stormcell
There's some evidence that the fires were started by sparking power lines:

www.dailymail.co.uk...

If there were a solar flare or CME, that extra current can actually cause power lines to spark as in the Carrington Event of 1859

en.wikipedia.org...

Fluctuations in the Earth/Solar magnetic field can actually be transported into the Earth's mantle through magnetic field lines. No different from induction melting in a furnace. That will cause earthquakes and volcanic activity.

I've been given the task of lighting and keeping a firebox lit when my parents were out. That involves first lighting kindling (anything from newspaper to small twigs and leaves), then getting that to light larger branches and finally the main log.
Once a branch or log is burning it can burn out if there isn't enough air flow, but the minute air flow is increased, it will start burning again.


Please don't blame this on a solar flare or global warming, that is insulting to EVERYONE who reads this. Things have changed A LOT since 1860's and the chance of a fire from a solar flare are so small in comparison to what they used to be, do to so many different factors, that it is an absurd notion and is only used by charlatons to try and sell idiots "end of the world" books/videos. Come on, you should know better than this.

AS far as fires, i've had the same job as you when I was younger b/c we heated w/ a wood stove mostly (so from age about 6-7 I was in charge of getting the fire going in the morning after it died down at night). The point is it isn't as simple as tossing a cig out the window and "poof" forest fire. There hs to be LOTS of convergent conditions and it is a very small chance ultimately.
edit on 11 13 2018 by DigginFoTroof because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 13 2018 @ 04:21 PM
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So basically this post is a non-qualified person trying to make statements about how fires or hazmat scenarios should be handled , how some fires start all without realizing the risk that comes with this job and then complaining about the pay ..

Good luck with all that please though tell me how you are justified in anyway to speak about anything on this? Sorry being a self-proclaimed Awakened Mind doesn't count for anything in the real world. See this story below, my uncle was one of the three firemen that died in this he and all fire fighters have more courage then you will ever have sitting behind the safety of your keyboard and monitor so I have no issue with them getting paid whatever they can.

www.nytimes.com...




edit on 13-11-2018 by opethPA because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 13 2018 @ 04:21 PM
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a reply to: burdman30ott6


Not disputing that, they are not, like the Original Poster claimed, mooching off the Federal teat when it comes to tax money. I did a thread about this awhile back and I was a bit surprised who made the list of net contributors.



posted on Nov, 13 2018 @ 04:27 PM
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a reply to: AugustusMasonicus

If you play the long game, that will either change or California will dissolve as we presently know it. Those really are the only two possible scenarios at this point, especially considering their present political dynamic and having a single party with veto-proof control of everything. Either the US government eventually bails them out, in which case they will become net useless eaters where federal taxes are concerned overnight, or the US government will wisely refuse to bail them out and we can all attend the California auction as the state sells its assets and then finds itself either broken up into other states or under the control of the federal government's arbiter. I suppose there's a third option of the World Bank bailing them out, which will require massive austerity agreements and, again, the federal government will need to guard themselves against getting drawn into helping the state meet their shortfalls.

It's a shame nature hasn't come up with a Neutron Bomb forest fire yet. Some manner of blaze which gets the job that needs doing done without harming the infrastructure or the trees.



posted on Nov, 13 2018 @ 04:37 PM
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a reply to: AugustusMasonicus

I also find that the "taxes paid vs federal outlays received" is a stat which can be manipulated to say whatever you want it to.
wallethub.com...

Take Alaska as an example. A lot of the federal spending in Alaska is due to federal needs more than the state actually needing something. We've got a number of federal grant projects which were the result of the military requiring improvements to access or supply lines. The state was happy to accept the grants and the projects, don't get me wrong, but they'd have never happened without the feds paying for them because Alaska didn't need them. Similarly, our rural nature benefits from the federal government's subsidization of various rural programs... these federal outlays for education, rural septic, water treatment, and garbage processing, and various modernization projects aren't things the rural bush communities would have required or, in many cases, wanted if not for federal mandates and federal checks to pay for it all.

California, meanwhile, is about as developed as it gets. Their big federal expenses happened decades ago, while rural states like AK, North Dakota, and Wyoming are just now catching up to standards established in the more populated states 30+ years ago.



posted on Nov, 13 2018 @ 04:41 PM
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a reply to: DigginFoTroof

Good. They deserve it more than any white collar crook does.



posted on Nov, 13 2018 @ 04:55 PM
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a reply to: burdman30ott6


Even if California were having money dumped in by the Federal Government due to Federal requirements they are still a net contributor unlike what the Original Poster claimed. He's wrong.



posted on Nov, 13 2018 @ 05:31 PM
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originally posted by: JAGStorm
a reply to: DigginFoTroof

Firefighters in our area are paid very well here also.

So here's the weird thing. I live in the country. We don't have a huge population. There is a ton of water everywhere.
We have very cold winters and sometimes there are fires from wood stoves or barn fires and things like that. It is very rare for houses to burn down. So rare when it happens it's on the news with all the details.

We have approximately 4+ firefighters Per 1000 people (doesn't that seem high?)
And they are always always recruiting for more.
Now let me give you some perspective, We have 6 police for our entire county, but only ONE for our village.
So only ONE cop, but we have almost 50 firefighters? Does that make any sense?

They just built not one but two new fire stations, and have tons of trucks.
I seriously think this is some kind of money scheme for the village.





Just wait till you look into how much the trucks are - from the main engines, the tanker trucks, the F650-750's (that have big metal tool boxes filling the bed) and other vehicles. Then you have their equipment much of which is even more expensive than military equipment (HHHUUUGGEEE markup) and even buying something like a gasoline Stihl concrete saw (16" diamond blade) billed at $6K for a new unit (retail is $1-1.5K). Maintenance and repairs to the tankers, engines, etc is also astronomically high from what I have been told and it must be done after "hours" used, so it can be sitting at a fire site for 8 hours just idling doing nothing but after 300 or 500 hours, it gets serviced as if it had been used "all out" for that amount of time, when it's possible that all the time was idling.


www.stihlusa.com...



posted on Nov, 13 2018 @ 05:39 PM
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Text

originally posted by: rickymouse
Of course, the overtime pay is all coming out of Federal emergency greants along with probably some of their regular wages for time spent fighting the fire they classified as eligible.

It would be beneficial for a fire fighter to start a fire if they get that much pay. Ninety nine percent of firefighters would never do that though, thank god, but that one in a hundred that is underwater financially might think of it.

I think firefighters should get paid a good wage, but I think that California might be somewhat too high even with their high cost of living there.



Yeah but when a firefighter makes 2x what a surgeon or a orthopedist, then I think there is something wrong considering you don't have ~9 years of school/residency to do (sometimes more for specialties) - and it is all b/c it is in a "socialized" system where it is all paid for by tax dollars.

When you compare wages in LA area for laborers it might be 10-20% higher than the rest of the nation, for technical positions, it is about the same, maybe 15% higher - and that is b/c of the higher cost of living - but those positions aren't paid for by tax dollars. There is no reason that they should make on AVERAGE 74% more than national average (that means they make over 2-2.5xx what some do like those in Lousiana - New Orleans and Mississippi).


Wages of firefighters by state

www.businessinsider.com...



www.businessinsider.com...-8



posted on Nov, 13 2018 @ 05:44 PM
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So tell me, is it any coincidence that the state with such an extremely high pay rate for firefighters just so happens to also have the most fires of any state (even when averaging sq mileage vs # of fires). It seems VERY convienent that they have so many fires and I'm tired of tip-toeing around issues like this while people destroy lives, property, etc and make tonenes of money at the same time.

There are MANY states that are dryer than Cali and have just as high, or higher, chance of fire but the difference is that they don't pay obscene amounts to FF's. Arizona, New Mexico, Texas, Utah, Colorado, Nevada all come to mind, especially Texas with the 2nd highest population and many THOUSANDS of lightening storms per year, which are a much more frequent cause of fires than cigarettes or dumb humans.

This issue needs to be examined closely and I think the FBI needs to investigate this.

I still want to know what Trump tweeted about the fires. Did he make is sound like these were suspicious or that they were being contained too slowly?



posted on Nov, 13 2018 @ 05:49 PM
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originally posted by: operation mindcrime
a reply to: DigginFoTroof

Because overkill is underrated.

Now back to those firefighters ignoring fires to raise their paycheck...

Peace


IDK what you mean, about overkill being underrated. R U saying they did the right thing?
edit on 11 13 2018 by DigginFoTroof because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 13 2018 @ 05:56 PM
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originally posted by: opethPA
So basically this post is a non-qualified person trying to make statements about how fires or hazmat scenarios should be handled , how some fires start all without realizing the risk that comes with this job and then complaining about the pay ..

Good luck with all that please though tell me how you are justified in anyway to speak about anything on this? Sorry being a self-proclaimed Awakened Mind doesn't count for anything in the real world. See this story below, my uncle was one of the three firemen that died in this he and all fire fighters have more courage then you will ever have sitting behind the safety of your keyboard and monitor so I have no issue with them getting paid whatever they can.

www.nytimes.com...





Oh, so you are qualified? Please tell us more especially about what you know about me. I have an uncle who died of parkinsons so I guess I'm an expert in that too - that is how your logic works. I had a cousin who was raped so I'm an expert in rape as well. Yeah, it must be nice to live in your "world" where you magically obtain all the knowledge of a profession through distant sharing of DNA.

Thanks for such a helpful contribution to the thread. I think we would have been utterly lost w/o your help.



posted on Nov, 13 2018 @ 06:00 PM
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originally posted by: hombero
a reply to: DigginFoTroof

Good. They deserve it more than any white collar crook does.


I won't argue against that. I personally don't think that any crook deserves it even if they are firefighters.

If people knew the orgins of firefighters, they were often ex-cons who couldn't get any other job and they often robbed houses while trying to save people and put the fire out - then often they couldn't "save the house" so their theft went unnoticed b/c everything was lost anyways. We are talking about LA and we all know how the LAPD is run. What makes anyone think that the LAFD is much different?

Just b/c people are made out to be hero's on the news, well we all should know that the news never manipulates the truth to fit the agenda now do they.



posted on Nov, 13 2018 @ 09:37 PM
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originally posted by: DigginFoTroof

originally posted by: operation mindcrime
a reply to: DigginFoTroof

Because overkill is underrated.

Now back to those firefighters ignoring fires to raise their paycheck...

Peace


IDK what you mean, about overkill being underrated. R U saying they did the right thing?


I'm saying I don't care. If I was risking my life for my work I would have every sirene blasting and I would expect people standing outside to salute me...that's just me.

Now the original premise of this thread was that firefighter are corrupt and are making money by not doing their job.

If you are going to # on people who derserve nothing less than your respect I'd say the burden of proof is on you. I haven't seen any so far...

Peace



posted on Nov, 13 2018 @ 11:16 PM
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originally posted by: DigginFoTroof

originally posted by: opethPA
So basically this post is a non-qualified person trying to make statements about how fires or hazmat scenarios should be handled , how some fires start all without realizing the risk that comes with this job and then complaining about the pay ..

Good luck with all that please though tell me how you are justified in anyway to speak about anything on this? Sorry being a self-proclaimed Awakened Mind doesn't count for anything in the real world. See this story below, my uncle was one of the three firemen that died in this he and all fire fighters have more courage then you will ever have sitting behind the safety of your keyboard and monitor so I have no issue with them getting paid whatever they can.

www.nytimes.com...





Oh, so you are qualified? Please tell us more especially about what you know about me. I have an uncle who died of parkinsons so I guess I'm an expert in that too - that is how your logic works. I had a cousin who was raped so I'm an expert in rape as well. Yeah, it must be nice to live in your "world" where you magically obtain all the knowledge of a profession through distant sharing of DNA.

Thanks for such a helpful contribution to the thread. I think we would have been utterly lost w/o your help.


I didn't say I was qualified and to talk about this topic regardless of how I grew up.

However it's ridiculous for you to complain about what firefighters are making, how they use encrypted channels or if the reply to a leak was correct.



posted on Nov, 13 2018 @ 11:19 PM
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Family members who own d-8 and other heavy equipment were hired by the Forest Dept for a huge fire in CA. The pay was really good and overtime and still they refused to ever do it again. They were terrified, the fire the heat the mountain drop offs where they lost a man that fire, the burning poison oak, the lack of sleep and lousy food.
No amount of pay was worth it to them.



posted on Nov, 13 2018 @ 11:26 PM
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a reply to: DigginFoTroof

google


About 100 firefighters die on the job each year, and heart attacks cause about 45 percent of these deaths, a much higher percentage than for other public safety occupations — 22 percent of the on-the-job deaths among police officers, and 11 percent for emergency medical workers.Mar 26, 2007



Search NBCNews.com

Firefighters' heart attack risk soars at the scene
Harvard study finds deaths increase even during less-demanding duties.
www.nbcnews.com...-uxf-hKiUk




Including Monday's fatality, a total of six firefighters have died battling wildfires in the northern part of the state over recent weeks. Three firefighters have died in the Carr Fire and two died fighting a fire near Yosemite National Park.Aug 13, 2018



posted on Nov, 14 2018 @ 02:35 AM
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originally posted by: JAGStorm
a reply to: DigginFoTroof

Firefighters in our area are paid very well here also.

So here's the weird thing. I live in the country. We don't have a huge population. There is a ton of water everywhere.
We have very cold winters and sometimes there are fires from wood stoves or barn fires and things like that. It is very rare for houses to burn down. So rare when it happens it's on the news with all the details.

We have approximately 4+ firefighters Per 1000 people (doesn't that seem high?)
And they are always always recruiting for more.
Now let me give you some perspective, We have 6 police for our entire county, but only ONE for our village.
So only ONE cop, but we have almost 50 firefighters? Does that make any sense?

They just built not one but two new fire stations, and have tons of trucks.
I seriously think this is some kind of money scheme for the village.




You sure that isn’t a volunteer department?



posted on Nov, 14 2018 @ 07:44 AM
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In my opinion, first responders (especially these firefighters) are true heroes. If they can find a way to make that kind of money, good for them.

I'm pretty sure no amount of money is going to get me or most of the people here on ATS to walk into this:

edit on 14-11-2018 by jtrenthacker because: (no reason given)



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