Cerns true goal

originally posted by: Phage
a reply to: Whatsthisthen

Science REALLY needs a conscience.

Science is a process.

It's people that need a conscience.

Some branches of science do understand.

Source

I swear to fulfill, to the best of my ability and judgment, this covenant:

I will respect the hard-won scientific gains of those physicians in whose steps I walk, and gladly share such knowledge as is mine with those who are to follow.

I will apply, for the benefit of the sick, all measures [that] are required, avoiding those twin traps of overtreatment and therapeutic nihilism.

I will remember that there is art to medicine as well as science, and that warmth, sympathy, and understanding may outweigh the surgeon's knife or the chemist's drug.

I will not be ashamed to say "I know not," nor will I fail to call in my colleagues when the skills of another are needed for a patient's recovery.

I will respect the privacy of my patients, for their problems are not disclosed to me that the world may know. Most especially must I tread with care in matters of life and death. If it is given me to save a life, all thanks. But it may also be within my power to take a life; this awesome responsibility must be faced with great humbleness and awareness of my own frailty. Above all, I must not play at God.

I will remember that I do not treat a fever chart, a cancerous growth, but a sick human being, whose illness may affect the person's family and economic stability. My responsibility includes these related problems, if I am to care adequately for the sick.

I will prevent disease whenever I can, for prevention is preferable to cure.

I will remember that I remain a member of society, with special obligations to all my fellow human beings, those sound of mind and body as well as the infirm.

If I do not violate this oath, may I enjoy life and art, respected while I live and remembered with affection thereafter. May I always act so as to preserve the finest traditions of my calling and may I long experience the joy of healing those who seek my help.

P

a reply to: pheonix358

That's more an oath for those who apply science to healing. Which is as it should be.

Too bad war makers don't take such an oath. Hard to imagine how that would work though.

Science is a process. But indeed, there are more than enough examples of it being carried out in an immoral manner.

So let's stop doing it.


Heh, should we ban guns too? Or just make sure they are only used morally?

a reply to: Phage

Science is a process. But indeed, there are more than enough examples of it being carried out in an immoral manner.

So let's stop doing it.

Once again Phage ...

All or nothing thinking.

Perhaps study up on the Psychology of all or nothing thinking. It is a psych problem.

P

a reply to: pheonix358

Yeah. Intentionally so.


So, more on topic, what do you think about the research being done with the LHC and the OP?

a reply to: andy06shake

Science is not the problem but what people do with the results.

Fan or not without science and technology we would not be having this discussion, just a thought.

Yet what is left of science if you took away the scientists?

People are essential for science to exist.

So science is people. People are often passionate when discovering new things and learning.

From passion grows arrogance. And arrogance leads to downfall. Sun Tzu warned of the pitfalls of arrogance in The Art Of War.

The counter to arrogance is humility.

And a conscience would not go astray.

Technology and science is all good and well, , but without a conscience and humility, we will always get the Oppenheimers. That is when things get out of hand.

When a scientist says things like:

“Now I am become Death, the destroyer of worlds”

. . . we should know that this is not going to turn out well.

a reply to: Whatsthisthen

When a scientist says things like:

“Now I am become Death, the destroyer of worlds”

It wasn't a scientist who came up with it. Oppenheimer did study Hinduism a bit though, apparently. I think the reality of what he had helped wrought stunned him. It's not surprising the quote would come to his mind when he saw the result, face to face.

But, nuclear science helped save my life. Helps save very many lives. So...

Two edges and all that.

I thought CERN was a way to make gold from lead - we have been able to create radioactive isotopes of gold since 1947 and with the ability to digitally fund anything short of an actual black hole filled with money I could see that being a real thing.

a reply to: circuitsports

I thought CERN was a way to make gold from lead

Nope.

Well, theoretically, maybe. A few atoms at a time. But it's cheaper to dig it out of the ground.

a reply to: Phage

It wasn't a scientist who came up with it. Oppenheimer did study Hinduism a bit though, apparently. I think the reality of what he had helped wrought stunned him. It's not surprising the quote would come to his mind when he saw the result, face to face.

But, nuclear science helped save my life. Helps save very many lives. So...

Two edges and all that.

Well I never met the man personally, so just from what I read decades ago. I know Oppenheimer is quoting Shiva the Destroyer in Hindu writings. Whatever the case the guy is a worry.

I'm not against people studying things such as atomics. I study the same subject from a different perspective. Personally I think a few well aimed nukes in the tens of megatons will solve a part of our UFO problem. I also know that The Fires of Uranium have many uses and not necessarily bad ones at that. Very early days yet and the wonders I've seen of technology are something else.

A double edged sword as you say, yet why has science designed into the LHC the circumference and rotation of the earth as described by AthlonSavage a few pages ago?

That sounds like the sacred geometry of the occultists and Masonic folks.

I spoke it could be a design fluke, or perhaps some part of trangled string theory and quantum physics.

Flukes aside, it seems there is more to CERN then just particle crashes.

And really the mosquitoes flapping their wings analogy from the folks at CERN looks more like a distraction than anything else.

So science must understand it is going to come under heavy criticism and suspicion.

a reply to: Whatsthisthen

A double edged sword as you say, yet why has science designed into the LHC the circumference and rotation of the earth as described by AthlonSavage a few pages ago?

His numerology is nonsense. His math, pathetic.
www.vcalc.com...

a reply to: Whatsthisthen

Like Phage said ancient Hinduism(Bhagavad-Gita) not Oppenheimer statement per-say.

Of course, science can exist without people, just as the universe would get along just fine without us.

a reply to: andy06shake

Of course, science can exist without people, just as the universe would get along just fine without us.

Nope. Science is a process of discovery. It can exist without humans, perhaps, but not without people.

a reply to: Phage

Big place the universe through I'm sure there are other life forms that could approximate people and appreciate science aside from us.

Probably won't call it science all the same but if they can count I'm sure they will draw similar conclusion to our own.

a reply to: andy06shake

Pi is pi.

No matter where you go, there you are.

Draw a square inside the circle of cern.
The points of square touch the circle.
Cern circumference = 26700metres
solve for radius -- 4249.36 metres

Radius divide by root 2 (ie.e 1.414)
x 8 = 24038metres length of perimeter of square

Now consider the slight difference in lattitude for square top line and square bottem line.

Now consider a light path between two opposite corners of square.

Consider light commencing at origibn time 0 in the circle travelling the circumferential direction comes to point of cornice and splits half continuing along circumference and the other half along diagonal. Will the two split fronts meet eachother and recombine in exact time sync at second cornice ?

a reply to: Phage

Pi is pi.

No matter where you go, there you are.

Hmmmm, and one plus one always equals two I spose?

Now what if we put two teenage kids alone in a dark room for a weekend.

Will one plus one still equal two? Or maybe 1 + 1 = 3?

So will pi always be pi?

a reply to: Whatsthisthen

Yes.

The ratio between the circumference of a circle and its diameter will still be that.

a reply to: Phage

The answer to that one depends if you wish to invest some time.

Follow the money!

P

a reply to: Phage

The point was simply that this not necessarily a purely Euclidean world, mathematics as a construct of mind, is a set of rules if you will.

Organic systems and consciousness don't necessarily follow conventional mathematics.

If one wants to navigate in consciousness, you need to learn to think in six dimensions.

To think outside the box. The box being length x width X height X motion X inside X outside. There exist one dimensional spheres with infinite interiors. Simple infinite closed spaces.

You guys will need to update your maths when you start navigation in non-euclidean space.

I don't know what will happen to pi, you might be right though Phage. So benefit of the doubt to you there.

We experience physical rate of motion as a velocity.
This is represented as
Velocity = 2*Pi*Radius* CosY * frequency * 1/(1-Cos (90-Y)) = where velocity of light is constant but the frequency pulse of time varies according to lattitude.

We do not feel this because we experience time as motion measured through our eyes as velocity.

So at lattitude 0 Velocity = 2*Pi*6371000* 7.489 * [Cos0/(1-Cos (90-0))] = 299792458 *[1] =299792458
So at lattitude 45 Velocity = 2*Pi*6371000* 3.1 * Cos45/1-Cos (90-45) = 124093538.13 * [2.414] = 299792458
So at lattitude 90 Velocity = 2*Pi*6371000* 0.065 * Cos89/1-Cos (90-89) = 2601961.283 * [114.58]= 299792458

A relative second at the equator is determine by T=1/f

so at 0 degree Lattitude 1/7.489= 0.133 seconds
at 45 degree Lattitude 1/3.1= 0.3.22 seconds
at 89 degree lattitude 1/0.065 = 15.38 seconds

we experience motion of time as velocity which is constant so are unaware of relative difference is pulses of time.

for Cern lattitude 46.3
Velocity = 2*Pi*6371000* 3.00* Cos46.3/1-Cos (90-46.3) = 120215116 * [2.4938]= 299792458

T = 1/f so frequency of time at location of Cern 1/3 = 0.333333

If T has a postive and negative cycle due to cern firing protons in two opposite directions along the cyclotron it doubles the period = 0.66666

They are definitely trying to manipulate time to open a portal