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Leaked Military Documents show the caravan isn't the threat Trump claims it is.

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posted on Nov, 2 2018 @ 02:49 PM
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a reply to: InTheLight

Trump paid $38 million in taxes in 2005, the White House says


www.washingtonpost.com...




posted on Nov, 2 2018 @ 02:49 PM
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a reply to: InTheLight

If he's smart? Little to none.

I'm not opposed to folks keeping more/all of their money. Government never did anything to earn it...



posted on Nov, 2 2018 @ 02:50 PM
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originally posted by: TinySickTears
a reply to: dug88

i am assuming yes

i am assuming they are desperate for the journey they undertook.

must be desperate to do that



Why? People do a lot of dumb # without being desperate.

There's no logical reason for a mass group of people to leave a country like that, without some kind of disaster or war happening, to a place where there's a fairly low chance of them being able to succeed unless they've been told they will.

There's people who live in worse poverty all over the world who don't leave because the risk is too great compared to the uncertainty of success. If that many people decide to leave there's got to be a reason. You've provided none. No one else has provided any. Yet there's plenty of evidence that's been posted that they've basically been supported any and everywhere they've gone, while not really looking overly desperate.



edit on 2/11/2018 by dug88 because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 2 2018 @ 02:50 PM
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originally posted by: ker2010
a reply to: InTheLight

Trump paid $38 million in taxes in 2005, the White House says


www.washingtonpost.com...



Yes, I read that...and how much after that?



posted on Nov, 2 2018 @ 02:51 PM
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originally posted by: JBurns
a reply to: InTheLight

If he's smart? Little to none.

I'm not opposed to folks keeping more/all of their money. Government never did anything to earn it...


Little to none is not contributing to your country, or paying your fair share.
edit on 111CDT02America/Chicago05220230 by InTheLight because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 2 2018 @ 02:52 PM
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originally posted by: JBurns
a reply to: shooterbrody


madcow tax return episode


I finally have a suitable way to describe Rachel Maddow


Her show used to be at least half-way informative until it became the 24/7 All Russia Conspiracy Network

That madcow is a handsome young man!



posted on Nov, 2 2018 @ 02:56 PM
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originally posted by: ker2010

originally posted by: TinySickTears

originally posted by: Xtrozero


I guess not desperate enough to take Mexico's offer, or anything from the other 3 countries they had to pass through.



guess not


best chance to have a decent life is in the states.



Finally, we agree, more tax payer handouts in the USA


yeah lets just build more bombs..

my tax money goes to all sorts of # i dont wish to support

guess youre just gonna have to suck that up big guy



posted on Nov, 2 2018 @ 02:58 PM
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a reply to: InTheLight

I don't mind contributing to the country and even paying taxes for certain social programs. I don't mind one bit. I don't want to see any of my fellow Americans struggling to get by. I sure don't want to see our roads and schools tank out either, but I must point out that the vast majority of roads/education funding comes from State taxes and not Federal taxes. And with how much our government frankly wastes on the stupidest things it makes me wonder how and why we keep pouring more and more into it and getting less and less out of it

I guess what I am saying is I would mind a whole hell of a lot less with a little accountability and responsibility. It is so easy for bureaucrats to spend someone else's money, and the national debt says we are no longer financing these things and instead the government is promising (without our consent, mind you) that we'll repay their now tens-of-trillions of dollars in debt. All the while a toilet seat costs several hundred dollars, a box of pens is $30 and special coffee cups are costing upwards of $1000 a piece. Something has got to give, and it can't be the American tax payer... we have done nothing but hand out hand out hand out for the last 100 years or so and government has continually reneged its duty to spend that money responsibly

If these government contractors genuinely can't do much, much better on prices (I'm talking 10% of present prices maximum) then we need to re-evaluate the current way contracts are awarded/purchasing decisions are made because paying $300 for a toilet seat is out of control. Yes I am sure it will devastate the corporate MIC, well too bad. They've been enriching themselves at the expense of the American taxpayer by wooing government officials for way too long now
edit on 11/2/2018 by JBurns because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 2 2018 @ 03:00 PM
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originally posted by: InTheLight

According to the Social Security Administration, there were nearly 11 million undocumented immigrants in the United States in January 2009. Factoring out kids, nonworking immigrants and those working in the underground economy and not paying taxes, the Social Security Administration estimated about 3.1 million unauthorized immigrants who worked and paid Social Security taxes in 2010. This group and their employers generated about $13 billion in payroll taxes in 2010. The administration then subtracted about $1 billion in benefits that could’ve been received in 2010 from earnings in years when workers were unauthorized. Workers and employers contribute roughly the same amount.

A left-leaning research organization estimated that undocumented immigrants paid about $12 billion in total taxes in 2010, while a conservative think tank pegged it at $17.6 billion.


How much tax did your President pay over the years, if at all?


The one tax form CNN got their hands on he paid 35 million that year...

Your numbers above suggest that 30% of illegals pay taxes and that was 2009. that means today 10 million or more do not pay taxes while maybe 4 to 6 million may. Your post above DISCOUNTS children, so we do not want those pesky number to screw up the narrative here do we..

If I take 3 million and divide it by 13 billion that comes out to $4000 per and if one kid cost 11,000 per, and a trip to the ER is $1000 per and many other social programs come out to $1000s what is your point?

Unless you are suggesting an illegal family is cost us 50,000 while paying 4000, and the other 10 to 15 million who pay nothing don't even pay the 4000 to off set the 50k+. If that is your point than I agree with you.
edit on 2-11-2018 by Xtrozero because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 2 2018 @ 03:00 PM
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a reply to: InTheLight




paying your fair share

exactly what would that be?



posted on Nov, 2 2018 @ 03:05 PM
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originally posted by: shooterbrody
a reply to: InTheLight




paying your fair share

exactly what would that be?


More than little to none.



posted on Nov, 2 2018 @ 03:09 PM
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originally posted by: Xtrozero

originally posted by: InTheLight

According to the Social Security Administration, there were nearly 11 million undocumented immigrants in the United States in January 2009. Factoring out kids, nonworking immigrants and those working in the underground economy and not paying taxes, the Social Security Administration estimated about 3.1 million unauthorized immigrants who worked and paid Social Security taxes in 2010. This group and their employers generated about $13 billion in payroll taxes in 2010. The administration then subtracted about $1 billion in benefits that could’ve been received in 2010 from earnings in years when workers were unauthorized. Workers and employers contribute roughly the same amount.

A left-leaning research organization estimated that undocumented immigrants paid about $12 billion in total taxes in 2010, while a conservative think tank pegged it at $17.6 billion.


How much tax did your President pay over the years, if at all?


The one tax form CNN got their hands on he paid 35 million that year...

Your numbers above suggest that 30% of illegals pay taxes and that was 2009. that means today 10 million or more do not pay taxes while maybe 4 to 6 million may. Your post above DISCOUNTS children, so we do not want those pesky number to screw up the narrative here do we..

If I take 3 million and divide it by 13 billion that comes out to $4000 per and if one kid cost 11,000 per, and a trip to the ER is $1000 per and many other social programs come out to $1000s what is your point?

Unless you are suggesting an illegal family is cost us 50,000 while paying 4000, and the other 10 to 15 million who pay nothing don't even pay the 4000 to off set the 50k+. If that is your point than I agree with you.


Why don't you read what the American Immigration Council has to say about the bigger picture here.



ITEP’s estimates, and those of other researchers, should be kept in mind as policymakers debate how best to deal with the millions of undocumented immigrants who now live in the United States. In spite of their undocumented status, these immigrants—and their family members—are adding value to the U.S. economy, not only as taxpayers, but as workers, consumers, and entrepreneurs as well. If they had legal status, they would contribute even more. On the other hand, one of the alternatives being discussed in some circles—mass deportation—would be very a costly and economically self-destructive blunder, not to mention a humanitarian catastrophe.


www.americanimmigrationcouncil.org...



posted on Nov, 2 2018 @ 03:10 PM
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a reply to: BlackJackal

Well according to Tim Pool whom I subscribe to on YouTube, he just released a video talking about a third migrant caravan. Apparently, according to Mexican officials, people in this caravan have armed themselves in anticipation of conflict. To what degree, I dont know but perhaps the rhetoric needs to stop amping up to such a degree. Even words have consequences.



posted on Nov, 2 2018 @ 03:15 PM
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a reply to: InTheLight

Yet what difference would him paying 100x that much make?

Where is all the money disappearing to? Who is misusing it, mismanaging it or misappropriating it? What is the physical location of the black hole sucking up our nation's wealth (has to be in proximity to the Treasury
). In fact, we no longer have "Wealth" we merely have exorbitant debt that can't possibly be repaid (hence why it keeps growing, no headway is made on repaying it).

I would say paying any-million $ amount in taxes is far more than your "fair share." How much do you pay in taxes? (rhetorical question only) I am sure it is less than Millions, I know mine sure is. Why should he have to pay more simply because he exchanges his knowledge/services/property for money more often than others?

Heck, I still have yet to see the IRS produce the law that requires Americans to pay an unapportioned tax on services exchanged for money. Last I checked the Constitution specifically prohibits that practice, despite whatever laws con-men may have passed in the mean time. And trust me IRS has no intention of providing any such documentation. But rest assured, if you don't pay up (and on time, too) they will send armed agents of the State to commit acts of violence against you. No big deal, nothing to see here...

I apologize for diverting so far off topic with the tax discussion

edit on 11/2/2018 by JBurns because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 2 2018 @ 03:16 PM
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originally posted by: TinySickTears

best chance to have a decent life is in the states. not Mexico
could be that simple you know


I think it is that simple, but that is not a reason for asylum.. Much of the world lives at a level below us that we can not even dream of, BUT that is their life and the life they know.

Think of it this way... You live and work, take care of your family and have what you see as a rather good life. You don't have much, live in a small apartment with you family, but you put food on the table have a roof, take care of the things in life that you need. Some rich guy comes along, owns a 60 foot yacht, 5 huge houses, dozens of expensive cars and lives a lifestyle you can only dream of.

He looks at you and your family and thinks what poor suckers they must hate their miserable able crappy lives, that is how we Americans see much of the world. What we see as the worst life we could ever have is a norm throughout the world in living standards, so just because we may see it as bad doesn't mean it is bad...

These people coming here are not fleeing a place like Darfur, they are just seeking a better life, and that is why they do not stop in Mexico, but once again that is not something one can claim asylum for.




im not super afraid of the non invasion like most people in here

i see the # for what it is and will not be convinced otherwise

i will mention again though the thread was about trump lying and getting his base fired up.
the military report

it was deflected right away. as usual



We let in 5000, what size is the next wave? As I said there are 100s of million wanting and willing to do the exact same thing as these groups want to do.

Outside of those seeking honest work we have the drugs, crime, human trafficking, sex trafficking, and much more... and so all of this is mixed in nicely too, but that is something the left doesn't want to talk about. (not saying you are left) but that stuff screws up their narrative of this as nothing more than poor people seeking a good life.


edit on 2-11-2018 by Xtrozero because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 2 2018 @ 03:34 PM
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a reply to: InTheLight

We already tried that with DACA, the democrats shot us down because they (for some reason) find border security unpalatable. And Yes, I do think we should try again. And again, until we get it right. But we can do far better than (as some suggested) blatantly ignoring our laws and allowing folks to openly violate it.

That's not to say deportation is the only solution. When you break the law, you can also be fined or imprisoned. In this case, with a non-violent individual (violent would be deported immediately), I would personally be OK with a guilty plea to a misdemeanor and fine paid. And yes, even a pathway to stay provided each non-violent & productive individual demonstrated their intention to abide by/be accountable to our system of justice by pleading guilty to breaking our immigration law and paying the associated price.

I don't think every single Trump voter is advocating deportation for everyone is the solution (both in terms of cost and practicality). In my opinion only we should continue prioritizing deporting those with violent criminal histories and to do that the limited US law enforcement capabilities need State and Local law enforcement to support their operations.

They can't do their job and deport violent criminals with sanctuary cities and states. federal agencies usually forms task forces with local law enforcement it is not all federal agents, the government just doesn't have the kind of resources (for one specific area/event) that it likes to make us believe it does


edit on 11/2/2018 by JBurns because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 2 2018 @ 03:39 PM
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originally posted by: JBurns
a reply to: InTheLight

We already tried that with DACA, the democrats shot us down because they (for some reason) find border security unpalatable

I don't think every single Trump voter is advocating deportation for everyone is the solution (both in terms of cost and practicality). In my opinion only we should continue prioritizing deporting those with violent criminal histories and to do that the limited US law enforcement capabilities need State and Local law enforcement to support their operations.

They can't do their job and deport violent criminals with sanctuary cities and states. federal agencies usually forms task forces with local law enforcement it is not all federal agents, the government just doesn't have the kind of resources (for one specific area/event) that it likes to make us believe it does


I don't disagree, but how will those with violent criminal histories be vetted out without proper resources in place? It seems those that are claiming economic hardship will indeed be deported and isn't that all of them? I am just seeing a broken immigration system and border being held up by a new military wall.



posted on Nov, 2 2018 @ 03:58 PM
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originally posted by: InTheLight


Why don't you read what the American Immigration Council has to say about the bigger picture here.



And who are they, do you just pick what works or are you suggesting they are the authority on all this. ... here is their web site.



You can't take away what I wrote about our education and medical system getting swamped, social programs getting over burden and this just justifies it all?



posted on Nov, 2 2018 @ 04:01 PM
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a reply to: InTheLight


I am just seeing a broken immigration system


Sounds spot on to me ITL


I wish I had the right answers to some of those questions. I am torn between wanting to ensure our law is upheld and not turning away families looking for a better life. It is sad, because I don't blame the families one bit I would do the same for mine in a second. But at the same time, our existing broken immigration laws do not cover economic hardship or even fleeing from crime so we are left with changing the law. But of course, that isn't really even practical because of partisan gridlock and intra-party squabbling that ensures our politicians are too busy fighting each other instead of passing laws and fixing precisely this kind of mess

It is a shame that so many families and job seekers get caught up in the mess that is our border largely due to congress. I am not particularly worried about the average job seeker or family coming to the country illegally. Of course I don't condone breaking the law, but aside from that I have no personal animus against those individuals. I am worried about our nation's many enemies trying to exploit the border situation and disguise themselves as immigrants, and I think a lot of that goes back to the need to have some kind of vetting infrastructure in place (which of course we do not have presently)

it really is a conundrum. And on top of that we have to figure out a solution that doesn't just leave the same broken laws in place while encouraging people to openly break them. The damage that alone could do to the legitimacy of our justice system is somewhat alarming. It is just a bad situation all around and I wish I had the right answers

EDIT: I say broken as in the way prohibition was broken. That the law existed while simultaneously utterly failing to stymie whatever conduct it was seeking to outlaw, eliminate or otherwise prevent
edit on 11/2/2018 by JBurns because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 2 2018 @ 04:05 PM
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originally posted by: BlackJackal

originally posted by: loam
This will be a good look at the US border.



So whats different this time than all the other migrant caravans? What makes this one so special?


I know, I know I know, the Midterms!




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