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Which bathroom should this person use?

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posted on Oct, 23 2018 @ 09:49 AM
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a reply to: LSU2018

The reason those laws were put into place, was to protect transgender employees whose employers forced them to use the restroom of the sex they were born as, or face losing their job. Also, it was to protect transgender students in public schools for the same situation.

These protection laws were first put in place in the more liberal northern states, and there was no major upheaval. There was no dramatic increase in bathroom assaults or rapes, or murders. It was only when the laws were put into place in the larger cities of the more conservative southern states that all the screaming started. The screaming is a result of the conservatives being already pissed off that they lost the same sex marriage debate, and feeling like they were losing another battle concerning another member of the LGBT group.

It’s nothing but fear mongering, used to put trans people “back in their place”.




posted on Oct, 23 2018 @ 09:53 AM
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a reply to: LSU2018


Maybe you can explain why they wanted to do that.

I think i can.

The reason for having gender-specific restrooms is to put the patrons at ease, as I mentioned. Men are generally more comfortable around other men, as they don't worry about being 'judged' by a potential mate at an inopportune time. Women are more comfortable around other women, for obvious reasons considering the female human is the passive partner in the majority of human mating.

Gah, I'm typing things which can be misunderstood... everyone, please remember I am talking scientific here and normal connotations do not apply. My curse... being so damn logical.

Anyway...

The reasoning is then, that the comfort level is based on a lack of sexual confrontation. We don't want women in the men's room laughing and pointing, nor do we want men in the women's room playing peeping tom or grabbing things that aren't theirs. That's the core issue. Add in the fact that gender is advertised to the public not by genitalia, but by outward appearance. You, for instance, call the person in the OP a 'girl'... but if you were to meet them, you would never think they were anything but male. We don't typically go around grabbing genitals to determine if we're talking to a guy or a girl.

A few late-night talk show hosts notwithstanding.


That's the position of the 'right'... we don't want sexual confrontation in the restrooms. And, to be honest, many on the right are somewhat antiquated in their views on sexuality... that even includes me. So what better way to antagonize the right than to attack the very concept of femininity and masculinity by bringing an uncomfortable subject to the forefront of discussion?

I really, really wish Obama hadn't pushed this issue... I think normal, thinking people can figure this stuff out on their own. As I said originally, it ain't hard. But they did, they got their lulz, and now we have the right pushing back... too hard, IMO.

TheRedneck



posted on Oct, 23 2018 @ 09:54 AM
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originally posted by: C0bzz
This is a thought experiment and I am genuinely interested in that answer for the members of ATS.



This person has a vagina. Which bathroom should they use?


So did a male ex-navy vet I supervised once.

Personally? More and more we are seeing UNISEX single and multiple paritioned restrooms with man and woman figures with a dividing line.

'Means...it's a TOILET! ...For anybody! A lot of med. centers/hospitals are like that now, among other places.



posted on Oct, 23 2018 @ 09:55 AM
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a reply to: C0bzz

Yeah, it's nice to agree sometimes, ain't it?



TheRedneck



posted on Oct, 23 2018 @ 09:56 AM
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The OP: They should each use whichever bathroom upsets as many people as possible.

That's the goal right? the pillars of civilization are just the bars of the prison that restrains the freaks. You have no right not to be offended.

Zer should prop the door open so everyone can watch to see how many holes zer can micturate from at once. And then fling zir's poo at the watching crowd.

The goal is Crowleyianity: "Do What Thou Wilt Shall Be The Whole of the Law.

Society forges the chains that restrain your unique personhood. Down with culture. down with values!



posted on Oct, 23 2018 @ 09:59 AM
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originally posted by: LSU2018

originally posted by: C0bzz
a reply to: interupt42

Do not compare transgender people to killers, it's disgusting.


Who made you the thread monitor?


Who made you the thread monitor? You're trying to get me to remove photos based on terms and conditions, instead of alerting the moderators to make a decision.


Why didn't you just take it down then?


i. I am very aware of all terms and conditions of ATS, however where the line is drawn varies depending on interpretation. I don't always know where that line is, therefore I like to eliminate all doubt by getting a moderator involved.

ii. This also helps show to myself and others what is and is not against the terms and conditions.

iii. It stops myself from inadvertently breaking terms and conditions multiple times, I don't want someone to go through my posts and report posts that are days, months, or years old. In other words, I don't want to get banned from ATS like Alex Jones was banned from Facebook. You'll note that I have sometimes alert my own posts in heated discussions without any prompt, to see if I have actually crossed the line. The moderation here is good, but moderators cannot be everywhere at once, hence it's best to alert. In the alert, I even used your wording in the alert by calling his nipples, "womans nipples".

iv. Whilst the man in the image does indeed have a vagina, he has also spent a significant amount of time on male hormones and likely had his breasts removed. Therefore, there are no pictures of human breasts, only human nipples. If I didn't tell you that he was assigned female at birth, then you probably wouldn't be able to tell he wasn't assigned male at birth. And the image is relevant to the discussion. So I feel the idea that it should be removed based on terms and conditions to be on shaky ground, at best.

In real life, I work on things that can explode. Do you know we do? Have external safety auditing.
edit on 23/10/18 by C0bzz because: (no reason given)

edit on 23/10/18 by C0bzz because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 23 2018 @ 10:02 AM
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a reply to: C0bzz




Therefore, throwing them in the "mental hospital" is completely absurd and disgusting.


Why is getting them appropriate help in a hospital absurd and disgusting? transgender people have a very high suicide rate even after transforming.




Yes, because he killed a person. Do not compare transgender people to killers, it's disgusting.

Nice deflection but It wasn't a comparison to a killer it was a comparison to an individual that feels and associates as a werewolf and likely suffers from a mental disorder called . lycanthropy

Its a valid comparison , observation, and thought process to see why its acceptable to classify people that associate as being a warewolf as a mental disorder , versus someone who identifies as being a women but being born with male physiology and DNA as a non mental disorder.

edit on 201031America/ChicagoTue, 23 Oct 2018 10:20:52 -0500000000p3142 by interupt42 because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 23 2018 @ 10:06 AM
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a reply to: Arnie123


But, if your born with a Penis, you're a BOY., Vice Versa.

Even if you no longer have one?


This is a reasonable choice and sets the standard for an overall foundation.

It is a reasonable choice for likely 99% of the population. It is not a reasonable choice for hermaphrodites (as the person in the OP) or for those who have completed gender modification surgery. A MtF transsexual who has completed the surgery is, for all intents and purposes, a woman. They look like a woman, they think like a woman,and they have the physical characteristics of a woman.

Now, look... I understand that the thought may be somewhat repulsive to many. That actually includes me as well. I don't believe I could have a relationship with a known transsexual. I also consider that attitude antiquated and illogical, despite my natural tendency to have it. But this is not about sexual relations; it is about comfort levels. If I saw the dude in the OP going into the women's room, I would likely report them... and so would you. But according to your own definition, they are a woman!

Do you see the inconsistency here?


Course, this thread is a deadly double edged sword and can used to push a variety of positions.

Part of the problem with our legal system is that laws are passed without considering the unintended consequences. Perhaps in this case we should consider them.

TheRedneck



posted on Oct, 23 2018 @ 10:11 AM
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If you should use the men’s then go to the men’s room. If you follow my wife or granddaughters into the ladies room, your going to need the handicapped rest room.



posted on Oct, 23 2018 @ 10:14 AM
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a reply to: LSU2018


That whole thing was in regards to throwing on a wig and saying you're a woman, therefore you should be able to use the women's room.

There I will agree with you completely!

I also wonder why a law is needed. Restrooms are private facilities, and rules can be set on who can and cannot use them based on private interests. WalMart has a public restroom, but they also can tell me I cannot use it. They actually have, when it was out of order once. Sucked... big time.

Also, remember that, like it or not, there are gay people around. Actual sexual confrontation is not the issue as much as a perceived lack of sexual confrontation. The guy in the urinal next to you might be sneaking a peek... I know I wouldn't know if he did, because I'm usually concentrating on that little spot of wall directly in front of me.

Sure, there will be people who make up silly rules for their use which make no sense in certain circumstances, but those people have a tendency to go by the wayside. There never was a need for a law. But like I said above, it was good way to show outward 'tolerance' and get the right upset.

TheRedneck



posted on Oct, 23 2018 @ 10:17 AM
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originally posted by: MarlbBlack
a reply to: Boadicea

It was pretty strange because I've never known someone that it's happened to, nonetheless you are correct. Just wanted to shout it out there, haven't seen him in about 10 years or so you could tell it haunted him.


I can see why it might haunt him. Girls/women are raised to expect such from men... But men aren't raised to expect it from women. That's gotta be a shock to the psyche and who as well as the body. I don't even know him but I've said a couple prayers for him...



posted on Oct, 23 2018 @ 10:20 AM
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a reply to: LSU2018


Read my post again. You wasted your time typing what I already know. I've already said the girl in your picture should use the men's room.


Glad we agree that the man in the picture should be able to use the men's room.

And this absolutely should not be legislated against.


Mmm hmm, that's why all reasonable answers were ignored.


Are you calling your own posts unreasonable?

Also I didn't mention the left or the right here, I simply care about the rights of transgender people.
edit on 23/10/18 by C0bzz because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 23 2018 @ 10:22 AM
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a reply to: neo96

Womens is far worse, at one time, many years ago I worked as a janitor in a shopping mall.
I still have nightmares


I don't really care what bathroom, to answer the OP question.
edit on 23-10-2018 by vonclod because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 23 2018 @ 10:28 AM
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a reply to: C0bzz

There is no choice here, definitively, he should use the Mans toilet because he looks like a dude.

Else run the risk of looking like a pervert in the Woman's toilet.

I can't see the dilemma to be honest.



posted on Oct, 23 2018 @ 10:28 AM
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a reply to: tadaman

Thanks for the response, I agree that it should be a non-issue. I have transgender friends and I want them to be left alone. But they aren't. If you go into a transgender community, you will see how much the changes to the law makes them fear. Like actually fear, not fear for their country, but fear for their friends and their lives.


then he needs to finish his transition before he asks to be publicly accommodated by the other people of the gender he wishes to join.


I can give a better answer tomorrow, it's late here, but I don't understand this focus on surgery. Surgery has risks of its own, is expensive, and results vary. It's not like anyone in the bathroom is going to see their genitalia and if they do then there's other problems anyway.
edit on 23/10/18 by C0bzz because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 23 2018 @ 10:32 AM
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originally posted by: C0bzz
a reply to: Boadicea

Neither of your source is credible, "Transgender fetish" don't real.


Weasel words. "Credible" is a subjective term. "Transgender fetish" is what it is whether you like the term "fetish" or not. The end result is the same: A disproportionate number of sexually violent men like to pretend they are women.



posted on Oct, 23 2018 @ 10:33 AM
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a reply to: andy06shake


I can't see the dilemma to be honest.

The dilemma is that, according to the law, he can't use the men's room. He has to use the women's room.

The law is the real issue.

TheRedneck



posted on Oct, 23 2018 @ 10:36 AM
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originally posted by: LordAhriman
Here ya go. I made this a few years ago when this nonsense first came about.


The answer is pretty obvious to me.
I don't get the US outrage about it all, public toilets are potentially dangerous places for anyone vulnerable, heck there was that poor young lad who got raped in a Manchester shopping centre a few years ago, that was by men in the men's toilets.
I've never heard of a transgender raping anyone in Britain, for sure it would be front page news by the far right newspapers, and all over ATS.

It seems crazy the emotion and outrage, same with your left/right anger, I don't get it, you guys seem nuts in the US.



posted on Oct, 23 2018 @ 10:39 AM
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originally posted by: C0bzz
a reply to: Brywilson2

So you're saying transgender people should be banned from using any bathrooms in public and stay at home?


3rd option, Adult diapers



posted on Oct, 23 2018 @ 10:41 AM
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originally posted by: neo96


Look both parties have been dumb on this


Never use public facilities if you can help it.

Men are nasty.

Never been in ladies so I can't speak to it.

But,

NEVER use public restrooms until they invent self cleaning ones.

Having had to clean restrooms before women are worse even if they male bathroom is used more.




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