German Protesters Call Bush America's Hitler

Originally posted by TheBandit795

Originally posted by mwm1331
Cut what out exactly?
Making accurate observations? Pointing out that germany has one of the highest unemployment rates of any western nation?
Or laughing at the fact that they dont realise this is the direct result of thier own economic policies?

You can say all of that without the tone you meant it with. I bet if somebody said something about the U.S. in the same tone you did it, you'd be angry. Can I laugh at the U.S. economic policies that might hang the country in the future???

Go for it. I dont get offended by others, I dont give them that much control.

Originally posted by nukunuku

Originally posted by mwm1331
In other wordy nuku you have absolutly no response to anything I said.
As for your inane comments, our currency s fine, and we have plenty of real allies from real countries, The UK Australia, Japan etc.
Germany on the other hand experienced negative economic growth last year,and has the highest unemployment rate in over 60 years, whilst france's economy is in equally dire straits and neither has been able to get thier debt below EU required figures in over three years.

So who's laughing now nukukookoo

Hey i never said i think highly of German government, i just appreciate those Germans standing out from a country that is filled with hitlerjugend. 12.000 may not be much but its a start.

And your countrys currency IS NOT FINE, anyway you are merely stating what theyre feeding you on FIX NEWS...and you named how many countries? Oh you forgot Poland....
Your government has "friends" becouse it bullys them into "friendship", you are all alone my friend, and bein taken for a ride

read some foreign newspapers, open your eyes

THINK HARDER

Well first of all cookoo I dont get fox news here in europe where I live. And yes the currency is fine despite what you may think in your infinite ignorance. There is a reason the US isn't taking any measures to prop it up or strengthen it. As for the rest of yur comments when youare willng to look past your eurocentric stereotypes and see the truth it will be a rude awakening.

Originally posted by mwm1331

And yes the currency is fine despite what you may think in your infinite ignorance.

The U.S. Dollar is currently trading at $1.32/Euro ... its lowest point was December 27th at $1.36/Euro. It's slowly losing value again, and is projected to be past the December '04 low by early April (data).

The British Pound has also gained about 15 cents on the dollar since September '04 -- a fairly large increase in the market.

No, I think the USD is in trouble ... as we delve more and more into debt to other countries ... and with a currency backed by the Full Faith and Credit of the Government, it's only a matter of time before we start losing it and are forced to default.

Well cyrus you are entitled to yor opinion of course. However the fact remains that most countries in the world have no choice but to keep large reserves of the dollar currency as it is the only currency you can buy oil with. In addition the US dollar is IMO intentionally being kept low as it puts more strain on european economies than on ours. Why else would EU finance ministers be complaining about the low dollars effect on thier economy?
The simple fact is the dollar will stay low as long as its useful, then it will come back.

And how right tey are!

The burning of the WTC is so uncannllily like the burning of the reichtsag.. well.. its scary.

Hitler uses the panic to rush through "Ermaechtigungsgesaetze" or "empowerment laws" to grab the power while every one was looking the pther way.. and would you believe it Bush did the same? Homeland security anyone?
The comparsions are two a penny and imo completely justified.

Yeah, Bush is the new hitler, America is being taken over by Nazi's, deathcamps are being built as we speak, and lists of subversives are being compiled.

Or amybe you just hope so. Is it still paranoia if you hope they're out to get you?

Originally posted by CazMedia
Sensfan levels an acqusation,

Why are people voting no on this submission? Is it Bush lovers that don't want a Bush protest posted as news? C'mon people, this is ATS, the news is supposed to be unbiassed. This is newsworthy.

How exactly can you offer ANY proof as to why anyone voted for or against this as a potential news story? This wont be the first time this idea will be desperatly bantered about here.

It was an opinion. and not only that, it was a question. There was no statement made there.

Kidfinger snatches the idea and runs,

It would seem to me that there are Bush supporters that are afraid this might lend credence to what quite a few of us have been saying for awhile now

Notice how this seems to lend more creedance to this already flawed hypothsis. Again tho, there is NO WAY to know who voted how.

Agian, I stated my opinion. What is the problem with this Caz? Why are you pointing out peoples opinions like it is a bad thing? You have an opinion dont you?

Websurfer chimes in,

The life of a person that affects me in no way is never newsworthy. The whole point to this article is Bush Bashing, which I don't mind partaking on now and again.

So Web, do you REALLY believe that Bush affects you in no way at all? The fact that foriegn people are protesting Bush is a testimant to how far his effects go...and you think Bush doesnt affect you?
As far as enjoying a good Bush bash, ME TOO!
Just looking at the drivel i just cited to see how amusing totally baseless banter can be from people that arent seeing the same reality that i am.

Why are you doing this? Is your view that much better than anyone elses?

Kidfinger tries to defend the Bashfest,

This is not Bush bashing. It is simply a report on another countries opinion.

Oh REALLY? While the initial report is newsworthy because of a Presidential diplomatic visit during a time of war..and citizens protesting....the rest of this thread so far has pretty much been an ADMITTED bash fest.

Reporting on OPINION is generally called POLL TAKING, not NEWS.
the newsworthyness of this article is because world leaders meet, not because of dislike of Bush...as i previously pointed out...looking back other Presidents have recieved similar or worse greetings from Europe before.
This is NOTHING NEW....and old news is stale news at best.

This as news worthy because 12000 Germans are comparing Bush to Hitler. How can you not see the significance in this? Are you really that much in denial?

The Kid gets back on track,

The citizens of the former NAZI government of Germany has made the accusation that Bush is comparitave to Hitler. I would think that if people with this kind of experience on the subject are making these claims, well, there must be something to them.

Can you BE more general? 12k people is a tiny fraction of the population of germany, yet you can leap to the conclusion that this is really representative of the overall german attitudes? I also must question the peoples experiance with nazism/hitler. Some citizens may have a decent idea but even fewer will actually remember that time. thats to say i "knew" about the kenedy era because i was alive as a child then...other than history lessons dont know kenedy any more than they would hitler.

How is this General? 12000 people is alot of people. That is not 1, 10, or 100. It is 12000 Germans who ALL have a good knowledge of Hitler and the Nazi party. So tell me. How is this a generalisation?



Caz, you are not the only person entitled to an opinion. The fact is, 12000 people is nothing to sneeze at. Especially when they come from the background they do, and they start making the accusations they made. Can you honestly say that 12000 people mean nothing? Can you honestly say that when 12000 German people who have the background, compare Bush to Hitler, we should just ignore them and not give it a second thought? This is a very important piece of international news that I think we should all heed. Especially when Bush is making statements like" And as for the notion that America is gearing up for an attack on Iran, well, thats wrong. With that being said, all our cards are on the table................." Which he said during his trip to Germany. I watched him say that with my own two eyes last night on the tube.

Now I will agree that some have used this opportunity to bash Bush. However, look at the content of the story. Dont just dwell on the fact that there are people who do not like Bush and make their feelings known. After all, There is two sides to every coin. There were people Bush bashing, and then there were people bashing them. What about that? Was that a good thing too?

Originally posted by Kidfinger

How is this General? 12000 people is alot of people. That is not 1, 10, or 100. It is 12000 Germans who ALL have a good knowledge of Hitler and the Nazi party. So tell me. How is this a generalisation?

12,000 out of a country with 82,424,609, and out of a city with 300,000 people?.... that's nothing.... and you are still ignoring the scandals that the Germans have been involved in recent history...with aiding and abeting genocide and help in the starving of people in Iraq to death.... of course, with your agenda to "oust or bash as much as you can" the president and the administration you can overlook this right?....

Originally posted by Muaddib


12,000 out of a country with 82,424,609, and out of a city with 300,000 people?.... that's nothing.... and you are still ignoring the scandals that the Germans have been involved in recent history...with aiding and abeting genocide and help in the starving of people in Iraq to death.... of course, with your agenda to "oust or bash as much as you can" the president and the administration you can overlook this right?....

So 12000 people with a personal knowledge of Nazi history are not qualified to see the differences or similarities? 12000 people is nothing?

I am ignoring the scandals because they are off topic. If you would like to start another thread about them, I would be more than happy to address those issues.

As far as my agenda goes, I am not bashing Bush. I am pointing out the facts. if Bush is being bashed by my words, then it is the facts that are bashing him. Not me. I am ovelooking nothing when it comes to this administration.

I will say this once more. 12000 German citizens have compared Bush to Hitler. 12000. That is a HUGE number of people. Not only that, but these German citizens are well versed in their heritage and national history. If anone is qualified to see the differences or the simillarities between Bush and Hitler, it is the people of Germany who have gone through it. It is the people of Germany who have passed down their experiences totheir children and grand children about Hitler and the Nazi way of life. These people are the living ancestors of the Nazis. That in itself should make you take notice when this accusation is leveled.

Muadibb, do not get angry when someone accuses your fearless leader of being a terrible leader. Instead of attempting to make those opinions look insignificant, how about attempting to understand why these things are being said. What is the root of these accusations? Try to understand where they are coming from so you can hold a conversation with them and express you views and allow others opinions not to be stifiled.



[edit on 2/25/05 by Kidfinger]

Well first of all cookoo I dont get fox news here in europe where I live. And yes the currency is fine despite what you may think in your infinite ignorance. There is a reason the US isn't taking any measures to prop it up or strengthen it. As for the rest of yur comments when youare willng to look past your eurocentric stereotypes and see the truth it will be a rude awakening.

Dude you crank me up

I think its pretty obvious where you stand....behid red white and blue, and behind you priceless president and his agenda towards USA = the world domination.
Im just glad not everyone thinks like you


And to everyone concerning the numbers : YUST HOW MANY WOULD IT TAKE TO MAKE A DIFFERENCE?

Like the anti-war protests against the war some time ago were not enough?
How many people was that again altogether? Check it out if you will.

[edit on 25-2-2005 by nukunuku]

Originally posted by nukunuku


I think its pretty obvious where you stand....behid red white and blue, and behind you priceless president and his agenda towards USA = the world domination.
Im just glad not everyone thinks like you

I stand behind Red White and Blue as well. I love America. I also dissagree with Bush. Please dont lump us all in one big bowl. Thanks

Originally posted by Kidfinger

Originally posted by nukunuku


I think its pretty obvious where you stand....behid red white and blue, and behind you priceless president and his agenda towards USA = the world domination.
Im just glad not everyone thinks like you

I stand behind Red White and Blue as well. I love America. I also dissagree with Bush. Please dont lump us all in one big bowl. Thanks

Ups im so sorry about that, i know very well there are a lot of nice people there as well. MY BAD

Kidfinger, perhaps you are too young to even know this...but this is nothing new..... More than 12,000 people in the past from countries in Europe have bashed and called past presidents of the US warmongers.... get it to your head...this is nothing new under the sun... and yes, the latest actions of the GErmans have a lot to do with what you are trying to say.....because it seems that the German government, and many German companies/people have not learnt anything about history, or what Hitler did....

Looking at the picture someone gave of the protesters in Germany you can see most of them are kids....teenagers or in their early 20s...

Germans are a bit paranoid for what happened with Hitler....

Here is an excerpt from a Blog by a German.

Radically Unpatriotic
In Germany, people wouldn't consider themselves patriots. Actually, if you would say "I'm proud to be German", you'd be considered a neo-Nazi. The political correct thing to say is somewhere along the lines of "I value our poets, like Goethe and Schiller, but I can't say I'm proud of this country, or love it, especially not considering its historical guilt". And yes, Germans do feel guilty. In Germany, the only time to hold up a German flag in public, without looking like a Nazi, is during football games.
...................
Organizing Everything
Bob Larson in his book Getting Along With the Germans writes: "In every German there's a hidden policeman (including inside the policeman)."

Germans love to organize public life, and make up rules, whether these rules are needed often, rarely, or never.

If you take a stroll through the park and are nearing a public greenery, you will find warning signs alerting you of what you may and may not do here. For example in the park near my home in Stuttgart (a very romantic and beautiful park) there are signs in some places emphasizing "Ball playing forbidden." (Bob Larson also writes Lenin concluded that you can't start a revolution in Germany because there are too many signs reading "Keep off the Grass.")

At any given time and place in Germany you will either see, or be made aware of by an official, whether you can do any of the following: sit down; smoke; play around; hang up posters; write on; make photos; park your car; enter; leave; speak.

Excerpted from.
blog.outer-court.com...

It does seem that Germans have become a bit too paranoid...

Originally posted by CazMedia

To which The Bandit scolds MWM....

You can say all of that without the tone you meant it with. I bet if somebody said something about the U.S. in the same tone you did it, you'd be angry. Can I laugh at the U.S. economic policies that might hang the country in the future???

Whats the problem here Bandit?
We can post any kind of "tone" we'd like here as long as we're not making attacks, or using foul terms. True open communication means your GONNA hear something that will make you "mad"....deal with it. MWM can certantly find humor in his observations of german economic issues and should be able to express them in a similar manner to the protesters hounding Bush.
YES Bandit, you CAN laugh at US economic policies all you'd like and i will support your abillity to talk about it. When talking about whos a nazi remember that silencing the opposition is one of the hallmarks of fascism.

What I'm talking about is that using such "tones" leads to less desirable situations here on the forum that have led to warnings and bannings before. Such "tones" are mudpit level (the way it used to be). And we don't tolerate that anymore on ATS, especially since we created the PTS forum. Plain and simple. So there's nothing to deal with. Just abide with the rules. There is no free speech here on ATS as we have said numerous times. This is a privately owned forum and we (and in particular Simon Gray) decide what goes and what. Comments like this, will continue to be scolded when seen. On PTS I will be more lenient, but not on ATS.

And by the way. I never intend to laugh at anyone's policy, no matter how much I disagree with it. I just said that to prove my point. We are talking about mutual respect here, and mwm clearly did not show respect for Germany by the ridiculing way he posted about their situation. Sure, he doesn't care whether the U.S. becomes a laughing stock apparently, but that doesn't give him the right to disrespect another country and it's government.

Bandit I care less about your approval or dissaproval of my "tone" than I do about the averge temperature in timbuktu. Warn me if you see fit again I dont really care. Get offended if you wish I don't really care.

Are you beginning to see a theme here bandit?

.
.
.
IMO - We would do well to listen to what Europeans are saying. It's not Bush-bashing - name-calling is just a juvenile emotional response, not an analysis. Our European family is expressing legitimate concerns.

Much has happened beneath the surface in the past week - and it doesn't take much research or reading between the lines to see it.


Bottom line: ...Most of the world is just worried about how to keep Bush under control until the end of his term.

The agenda:

1. Stop him from starting any more wars, especially a nuclear war; and

2. Prevent him from letting America's debt spiral out of control to cause a world wide depression.


As hard as it may be for some Americans to accept, the larger world's agenda truly is in our very best interests.

From:

Democracy Quest: Europe



If you read the news (not FOX) - you will see that the threat has been contained. For now at least.

Democracy Quest: Europe was a success. The world's civilized nations worked to together and roped a cowboy. Thank god.



.



[edit on 25-2-2005 by soficrow]

Originally posted by Muaddib
Kidfinger, perhaps you are too young to even know this...but this is nothing new..... More than 12,000 people in the past from countries in Europe have bashed and called past presidents of the US warmongers.... get it to your head...this is nothing new under the sun... and yes, the latest actions of the GErmans have a lot to do with what you are trying to say.....because it seems that the German government, and many German companies/people have not learnt anything about history, or what Hitler did....

Actually, I am 32, served in the first Gulf war, married with a 6 year old daughter, and very well awar of the situation that is transpiring. I am not arguing the fact that other presidents have been called war mongers. I am simply stateing that the average German citizen has compared Bush to Hitler. This is NOT something that has happened to any other president. IF this were to happen in New Guinnie, or Irland, the accusation would not hold much credence. However, the accusation arises from Geman citizens. People whom are intimatly familliar with the workings of Hitler and the Nazi party.

Looking at the picture someone gave of the protesters in Germany you can see most of them are kids....teenagers or in their early 20s...

Are they not taught their history? Are they not still decendants of the once Nazi state of Germany? I dont see what you are trying to say here.

Germans are a bit paranoid for what happened with Hitler....

Shouldnt they be?

Here is an excerpt from a Blog by a German.

The Blog entry you have quoted sounds like they are describing West Verginia. Have you ever been there? Signs posted everywhere telling you where ou can and cant walk. Keep off the grass signs. Hell, when I was in the Navy, the locals had signs in their yard that said 'sailors stay off grass!'. We have just as many, if not more rules than Germany, so the Blog entry is moot.


[edit on 2/25/05 by Kidfinger]

Originally posted by mwm1331
Bandit I care less about your approval or dissaproval of my "tone" than I do about the averge temperature in timbuktu. Warn me if you see fit again I dont really care. Get offended if you wish I don't really care.

Are you beginning to see a theme here bandit?

So you couldn't care less. It does not belong here. PERIOD.

Originally posted by TheBandit795

Originally posted by mwm1331
Bandit I care less about your approval or dissaproval of my "tone" than I do about the averge temperature in timbuktu. Warn me if you see fit again I dont really care. Get offended if you wish I don't really care.

Are you beginning to see a theme here bandit?

So you couldn't care less. It does not belong here. PERIOD.

You go Bandit!

These rules exist for a reason mwm - they protect the integrity of serious discussion. If you are not interested in serious discussion and don't respect the rules here, you should take your squabbles to the mudpit.



.

Originally posted by CazMedia
Sensfan levels an acqusation,

Why are people voting no on this submission? Is it Bush lovers that don't want a Bush protest posted as news? C'mon people, this is ATS, the news is supposed to be unbiassed. This is newsworthy.

How exactly can you offer ANY proof as to why anyone voted for or against this as a potential news story? This wont be the first time this idea will be desperatly bantered about here.

Well I can't show you a reason as to why people voted no, you would have to ask them. but when I first saw the submission it had a -3 rating, which means people did indeed vote for this thread not to be a news story.

Why? Good question, is it not news? It seems to be generating a lot of debate. Seems very newsworthy to me, don't you agree?

[edit on 25-2-2005 by sensfan]