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Crime, How do we deal with it?

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posted on Feb, 23 2005 @ 02:42 PM
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Righty then folks, the statistics tell us that crime is doing down, but the media continues to tell us violent crime is increasing. Who do we trust you ask, well I say ignore both and trust yourself and your own experiences.
Politicians seem to be happy using the same methods of control and punishment, simply slightly altering the idea to suit their party.

So what are your ideas, not the ideas of the politicians, not the ideas of the media but your ideas the ideas the politicians should be listening to.
What changes would you make, how would you reform the prision service, the police, how would you deal with the criminals?


***********************************

My ideas:

No Early Release
There should be no early release from jail for good behaviour, a prison sentence should never be reduced or the criminals will simply not believe they will have to serve out the full duration of the prison sentence.

Increase Capacity
Britain's prison population continues to grow yet the prison capacity does not. Criminals are being let off simply because there is not enough room of them. More prisons need to be built it is a simple fact, without them criminals will be returning to the streets to continue terrorising the common citizen.

Points Mean Prizes
Prisoners should live their prison life through a point based system, such as 10 points for good behaviour for a week, 15 points for helping with the laundry. These points can then be cashed in for 'comforts' such as a weekly rent of a television or the use salt and pepper at dinner time. It may sound a cruel idea, but this format of work and rewards will help teach the criminals discipline and good behaviour.

Free Labour
These low level non-violent criminals are a untapped source of free labour that Britain could benefit from. Britain is covered in litter and graffiti, why not take the criminals out in groups to clear up the mess that they have helped to cause. I'm not saying send out murderers to pick litter, I want only low level non-violent criminals taken out in groups and only if they are tagged so they can be tracked if they make a run for it. They should also be clothed so they are easily visually tracked, maybe a nice orange jump suit similar to those worn by criminals in America (that should make them regret committing the crime). Those that refuse to do the community service punishment would be given a prison sentence, society has given them a chance and they failed to repay their debt. My idea is really an expansion of community service, designed to keep prisons for what they are meant for: the socially violent, the drug dealers, the rapists, the murderers etc...


Fines
Financial fines seem to be the answer to every crime these days, vandalise something and you get fined, and guess where the money goes... to the Government. The reason why the current national Government brings in all these fines is because they get more money to spend, the money simply isn't going to where it's meant to go. For example when a building is vandalised, presuming the vandal is caught and fined, the money goes to the national Government as a form of punishment. What I believe is that the money generated from the fine should be spilt into two halves, one half going to the national Government and the other half going to the person who's was victimised by the crime. In the case of public property property being vandalised, destroyed etc, half would still go to the national Government but the other half would go to the local Government (county).




posted on Feb, 28 2005 @ 02:05 PM
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*bump*

I don't know whether i should expect a reply so soon, but what are your opinions and ideas everyone?



posted on Mar, 1 2005 @ 11:44 AM
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Originally posted by UK Wizard
Righty then folks, the statistics tell us that crime is doing down, but the media continues to tell us violent crime is increasing.


dont trust either violent crime isnt an issue hang the media for lying and shoot the goverment for denying




Who do we trust you ask, well I say ignore both and trust yourself and your own experiences.


trust noone the only thing you cant trust is what you see right outside your window, everyone has their own view but noone has the same opinion



So what are your ideas, not the ideas of the politicians, not the ideas of the media but your ideas the ideas the politicians should be listening to.
What changes would you make, how would you reform the prision service, the police, how would you deal with the criminals?


my best suggestion is do what im doing go back into law enforcement and figure it out for yourself , the only way you cant grasp the behind the scenes is to have a back stage pass.







but to answer the point about untapped labor oklahoma usa uses them already but I think if they put labor contracts such as roads back in the hands of the doc chain gangs then we wouldnt wait 6 or 7 years to get a road fixed and the inmates usually do a better job any way cause they have only the job to think about, not if they are going to get a beer after work.



posted on Mar, 1 2005 @ 02:30 PM
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Vigilantes, gated communities, intentiional communities, take up martial arts and how to have a good defense against knives and guns.

If they can make vigilantes legal in Arizona for border crossers, maybe those neighborhood crime preventers have a good thing going- by moving the bad guys to another neighborhood at the very least.


sorry for posting US alternatives in the UK board- but crime is crime- no matter where it occurs.



posted on Mar, 1 2005 @ 02:36 PM
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Originally posted by accountable
Vigilantes, gated communities, intentiional communities, take up martial arts and how to have a good defense against knives and guns.

If they can make vigilantes legal in Arizona for border crossers, maybe those neighborhood crime preventers have a good thing going- by moving the bad guys to another neighborhood at the very least.


So basically your saying we need to rely on ourselves and each other rather than the police and the government?


sorry for posting US alternatives in the UK board- but crime is crime- no matter where it occurs.


No need to say sorry, all ideas and opinions are welcome



posted on Mar, 1 2005 @ 11:13 PM
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1. Make less things illegal.
2. Make the penalties for the things that are illegal much more severe.



posted on Mar, 2 2005 @ 10:59 AM
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Originally posted by Ambient Sound
1. Make less things illegal.


Lets get rid of the word crime and then there'll be no crime....wait no lets not




2. Make the penalties for the things that are illegal much more severe.


That doesn't deal with the root of the crime, in my opinion crime is also a social issues as well as a law and order one.
We need to deal with the reasons for crime, and reform punishment .



posted on Mar, 2 2005 @ 02:52 PM
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Another idea which will most likely draw critisism from many members is the setting up of a national database containing all relevant information about all arrested criminals including a record of DNA.
But if a person is found to be wrongly arrested then they would be removed from the list.
This would enable the police to run a DNA check on crime scenes to see if a 'registered' criminal has commited the crime.


[edit on 2-3-2005 by UK Wizard]



posted on Mar, 2 2005 @ 05:23 PM
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Originally posted by UK Wizard
Another idea which will most likely draw critisism from many members is the setting up of a national database containing all relevant information about all arrested criminals including a record of DNA.
But if a person is found to be wrongly arrested then they would be removed from the list.
This would enable the police to run a DNA check on crime scenes to see if a 'registered' criminal has commited the crime.
[edit on 2-3-2005 by UK Wizard]


I thought that already existed
? I may be mistaken though.
---
I believe to get to the root of crime: You need to change society.
---
The people who become criminals are often those brought up in a bad enviroment. It is my opinion that kids need better role models. Change role models from pop stars and soccer players to scientists, musicians (talented), astronauts, war hero's.... anyone who really works to get to there posistion in life. The thing you often notice about footballer's and pop singers is that they dont do much to get to were they are (education wise), i think it sends a bad message.

Why have lets say a rapper endorse the latest Nike's.

Get a leading scientist to endorse them
.
---
There is no real push for some kids todo well in school. They know if they work hard they could get good jobs like that and make money, but they wouldnt be "cool", or they think they can do nothing and end up a millionaire pop singers or football players.

Later in life they realise thats not going to happen, most end up just working an un-skillled job but others turn to drugs or turn to crime.

That in my opinion is the root, and in my opinion big corporations could change crime statisitics by supporting education. If the media and big corps changed there ideas from big stars to people who have really made achievments!!! Over night, people would be forced into thinking education!
-
as far as punishments for crimes go, I suggest hard, unpaid work. In camps, yes im talking work camps but not the bad kind (if you get my meaning). Even small time shop-lifters i dont believe deserve a warning which they usually get, they should be assigned to work for X amount of hours. And hand back the stolen goods and pay double what there worth.

Just as an example.

-
There my ideas, but some say im mad
.

Vorta

[edit on 2-3-2005 by Vorta]



posted on Mar, 2 2005 @ 07:37 PM
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The solution is to let our police and the average joe have back his rights, and make it so that a criminal, in an act of breaking a servere law, such as murder, burglarly, etc, nulls his rights and he is violating osmeone elses.

And, FFS, arm our poor polie officers. The criminals have guns, our officers have... Tasars.
Come on...



posted on Mar, 3 2005 @ 11:44 AM
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I am not for haveing all our officers haveing guns, I dont see men or women in my street with guns thers no need.
We already have SO19 to take care of guns.

The cheap labour idea is fantastic.



posted on Mar, 3 2005 @ 12:20 PM
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Originally posted by devilwasp
The cheap labour idea is fantastic.


why thank you *bows*

--------

Giving guns to all police is a bad idea, if the police had guns then the criminals would use more guns to combat the new police weaponary.



posted on Mar, 3 2005 @ 03:40 PM
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Originally posted by Teh_Gerbil

And, FFS, arm our poor polie officers. The criminals have guns, our officers have... Tasars.
Come on...


no way. the day we arm our officers is the day we admit defeat and that our country is going downhill.

there is the occasional need for police to be armed. for example, 2 or 3 years ago a notorious area in bristol had to get armed officers on the street for a good few months because of a series of incidents. but this should not be the norm.

if tasars can apprehend a suspect without killing him, surely thats got to be better than a gun?



posted on Mar, 4 2005 @ 03:56 PM
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Firstly I'd stop looking to the US for answers and look in the opposite direction at how come continental Europe has a far lower level of crime and much smaller cheaper justice systems.

I don't go for the slave labour idea......it's a great idea until you are the one priced out of work by the prisoners.

As for arming the Police? No way.
If we did 'up the ante' like that it would simply lead to a response of even more arms in our society......and with the added twist of cop guns being a significant source of weapons to the criminal world too (as happens in the US).

This UK gun crime myth is a menace IMO.

People really should tune in to how little actual gun crime we have in the UK.

Instead of looking at scary % increase figures we should once in a while check out the actual numbers involved and consider how small they actually are.

Ditto UK violent assaults.



posted on Mar, 4 2005 @ 06:16 PM
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Originally posted by Ambient Sound
Make less things illegal.


he has a point there, UK Wizard. Alot of crime is a result of prohibition of many things. Legalised, licensed production of some drugs would drastically cut related crime.

For example, supply heroin addicts with a supply, whilst they go through a detox program. They won't need to offend to get the money they need for a hit.

And legalise canabis for gods sake! If Alcohol can be legal, then why the hell not pot?


Originally posted by UK Wizard
Another idea which will most likely draw critisism from many members is the setting up of a national database containing all relevant information about all arrested criminals including a record of DNA.


They do this already dude. Trust me. If you are found not guilty, they destroy the DNA and fingerprint records. Found guilty (like me
) and they keep it forever.


Originally posted by Vorta
That in my opinion is the root, and in my opinion big corporations could change crime statisitics by supporting education. If the media and big corps changed there ideas from big stars to people who have really made achievments!!! Over night, people would be forced into thinking education!


Funny, thats exactly what Charles said, and everyone jumped on him...



[edit on 4/3/05 by stumason]



posted on Mar, 6 2005 @ 08:49 AM
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Originally posted by stumason
he has a point there, UK Wizard. Alot of crime is a result of prohibition of many things. Legalised, licensed production of some drugs would drastically cut related crime.


Maybe its time we had a national referedum on whether drugs should be less restricted.




They do this already dude. Trust me. If you are found not guilty, they destroy the DNA and fingerprint records. Found guilty (like me
) and they keep it forever.



*Slap Self* I didn't know, thanks to explaining



sminkeypinkey
I don't go for the slave labour idea......it's a great idea until you are the one priced out of work by the prisoners.


It's not really slave labour is it, they would be serving an advanced community punishment for criminal acts.
And concerning people being forced out of their jobs, why not have the 'mobiles prisoners' clear up worn down neighbourhoods, rebuild walls, clean away graffiti etc, jobs that never seem to get done.



posted on Mar, 6 2005 @ 10:48 AM
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Originally posted by UK Wizard
It's not really slave labour is it, they would be serving an advanced community punishment for criminal acts.


- Well again it has to be recognised that an element of 'Prison work' does go on here in the UK at the moment already. But it is deliberately kept small scale for various reasons.


And concerning people being forced out of their jobs, why not have the 'mobiles prisoners' clear up worn down neighbourhoods, rebuild walls, clean away graffiti etc, jobs that never seem to get done.


- I have no doubt there are things that could be done but there are examples of where this can go very wrong very quickly to the detrement of wider society.
China is an obvious example. This idea there has grown into several vast factory set-ups challenging established firms internationally.

It seems to me one of those nice easy answers that really isn't.

Here in NI 'Restorative justice systems' are being closely looked at. They have their attractions but have found the first problem they usually encounter is (for instance, seeing as you mentioned them) people like pensioners feeling like the last people they want in or around them are the very people who did them wrong.

[edit on 6-3-2005 by sminkeypinkey]



posted on Mar, 6 2005 @ 10:52 AM
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Originally posted by sminkeypinkey
China is an obvious example. This idea there has grown into several vast factory set-ups challenging established firms internationally.


Advanced Community service not Chinese style labour camps.


It seems to me one of those nice easy answers that really isn't.


Nothing ever is I'm afraid



Here in NI 'Restorative justice systems' are being closely looked at. They have their attractions but have found the first problem they usually encounter is (for instance, seeing as you mentioned them) people like pensioners feeling like the last people they want in or around them are the very people who did them wrong.


Perhapes limit their working to activties that generally keep them away from close contact with others.



posted on Mar, 6 2005 @ 11:06 AM
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Originally posted by UK Wizard
not Chinese style labour camps.


- Well that's what I mean Wizard, we kind of have that now.....and China started somewhere small too.
In the begining it all made sense to them in that 'repaying debts to society' kind of way.


Perhapes limit their working to activties that generally keep them away from close contact with others.


- I can see what you mean but that's not always easy to do if you want them "clear up worn down neighbourhoods, rebuild walls, clean away graffiti etc, jobs that never seem to get done".



posted on Mar, 9 2005 @ 10:22 AM
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Originally posted by sminkeypinkey
- Well that's what I mean Wizard, we kind of have that now.....and China started somewhere small too.
In the begining it all made sense to them in that 'repaying debts to society' kind of way.


The thing is China is a communist dictatorship and Britains a democracy, the chances of forced Labour camps starting up are slim to none.


- I can see what you mean but that's not always easy to do if you want them "clear up worn down neighbourhoods, rebuild walls, clean away graffiti etc, jobs that never seem to get done".


Its impossible to keep them completely away from the public, but they will most likely need to interact with the public to do their jobs.
Getting them to work when people are at work would be one way of keeping problems to a minimum.



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