China Has Withheld Samples of a Dangerous Flu Virus

source

China seems to be less forthcoming with information on flu viruses then in the past and the reason seems to be the current trade tensions, an unintended consequence of Trumps trade polices.

I'm not going to panic. Flu viruses have been notoriously difficulty to predict. The success rate of flu vaccines is not very good.

But, if our vaccines are less effective or if there is a pandemic stemming from these strains, the results could be anywhere from not so good to catastrophic. The more information we have the better.

Are the gains in trade we've seen (or mostly not where China is concerned) worth the risk of losing this kind if cooperation?

Is the "bully" style of diplomacy the most effective way to deal with other governments?

I don't believe so, and this is one of the problems I have with Trump as a leader.

originally posted by: villagesmithie
source

China seems to be less forthcoming with information on flu viruses then in the past and the reason seems to be the current trade tensions, an unintended consequence of Trumps trade polices.

I'm not going to panic. Flu viruses have been notoriously difficulty to predict. The success rate of flu vaccines is not very good.

But, if our vaccines are less effective or if there is a pandemic stemming from these strains, the results could be anywhere from not so good to catastrophic. The more information we have the better.

Are the gains in trade we've seen (or mostly not where China is concerned) worth the risk of losing this kind if cooperation?

Is the "bully" style of diplomacy the most effective way to deal with other governments?

I don't believe so, and this is one of the problems I have with Trump as a leader.

So are you saying that if you come down with the flu, it's Donald Trump's fault?

The flu vaccines are BS anyway and full of mercury. You are taking a risk every me you take one not to mention the chance that it is even effective is around 10-15%. Also, China is getting what they deserve for cheating and screwing the U.S. for years in trade. You should be thanking Trump for actually standing up to them.

originally posted by: Metallicus
The flu vaccines are BS anyway and full of mercury. You are taking a risk every me you take one not to mention the chance that it is even effective is around 10-15%. Also, China is getting what they deserve for cheating and screwing the U.S. for years in trade. You should be thanking Trump for actually standing up to them.

Ain't ever took one, never will.

You and I can't be the only living human beings left that understand that negotiating from a position of strength isn't "bullying", you think?

It's pretty-much the preferred way to get things done. Do people think that somehow or another Donald Trump has "Hurt China's feelings"?

Maybe we should apologize to "China" for it.

Or maybe China plays the Eric Cartman part nowadays. "Screw you guys, I'm going home".

a reply to: MteWamp

China can’t afford to lose the U.S. market. They need us more than we need them. I would rather pay more for American made goods anyway than the Chinese junk they send us now.

China Always hides the severity of the flu’s. Plus it states that it takes months and months to get the results IF they are forthcoming.

The only time I ever caught the flu, was when a relative got her injection. We lived in a remote farmhouse isolated from anyone, so it wasn't contact with the outside world. She also ended up with a cancer lump at the injection site.

There's a theory that China has a flu outbreak with 50% fatality. If they keep that flu virus to themselves they have an useful bio-weapon. If they share it with the USA, then the USA get that technology too and can develop vaccines.

If China were to lose 50% of their population, and other countries were immunized, they would be at a disadvantage. If the virus spreads across the world, their economic rivals will be at the same disadvantage as they are.

originally posted by: Metallicus
a reply to: MteWamp

China can’t afford to lose the U.S. market. They need us more than we need them. I would rather pay more for American made goods anyway than the Chinese junk they send us now.

Exactly. That's what I mean. How is it a bad thing to negotiate from a position of strength? Is that not the entire POINT of negotiating?

Is that now considered "Bullying"?. So if I have something that you really need, I should just GIVE it to you, with a smile on my face? Just because we're all nice, and I KNOW that you will reciprocate.

Cuz that's what NICE people do...

You know. Cuz they're NICE. Otherwise, we wouldn't CALL them that, right?

So, nowadays, if you AREN'T a pussy, that's a bad thing?

a reply to: villagesmithie

China bullies and threatens and you blame Trump for not capitulating. Hilarious.

a reply to: stormcell

The US would use special ops to get samples. China couldn't prevent it.

Meh, Americans and the Flu go hand in hand, I've no doubt we'll do our best when combating it.

a reply to: villagesmithie

malarchy, the flu vaccine is useless if not outright dangerous. I can cure any flu, 99% of the time, with any combinatuon of a handful of plants...lol now we are blaming Trump for the upcoming flu season?

a reply to: villagesmithie

Funny thing is, they will still have a flu vaccine available for everyone.


So this would make me ponder the actual efficacy and the reasons behind the vaccine.

You dont give a enemy some thing they
will weaponize and then send back on you!

If it was usa giving a Very dangers Dangerous Flu
Virus to china. that could be used as a bio weapon.
would you think that was ok?

a reply to: buddha

That's the way it's been done. This is a change in the relationship we had in the past.

In the past, such exchanges have been mostly routine under rules established by the World Health Organization.

Most people are thinking world health not weapons. We have plenty of weapons and will continue to develop more. To say we're going to stop studying disease because someone will weaponize it is ridiculous.

a reply to: DBCowboy

The type of flu that goes through the population changes every year. It is developed by scientist (you know, people who study, think, check there work and are accused of plotting to take over the world). They studying what viruses are out there and make the best guess (based on facts) about which strain to prepare for. It's not an easy thing and the success rate is not great but they keep learning and saving some lives.

Without this input from a big part of the world, yes there will be a vaccine but, it's effectiveness will be based on incomplete information and will probable be less effective.There are plenty of replies on this thread of people with uniformed opinions about vaccines.\\\\

a reply to: MteWamp

So are you saying that if you come down with the flu, it's Donald Trump's fault?

No that's not what I'm saying.

Reply's like this are one of the things that make it difficult to have a real discussion on ATS.

Trump has a leadership style that his supporters admire. I am pointing out with this story that there are positives and negatives to any leaders choices.

I asked the questions in the OP.

Are the gains in trade we've seen (or mostly not where China is concerned) worth the risk of losing this kind if cooperation?

Is the "bully" style of diplomacy the most effective way to deal with other governments?

Many here believe vaccines are useless, so they are willing to throw them out. I think that is an uniformed view.

As for trumps way of dealing. If you wanted to barrow your neighbors weed whacker would you start by tell him his wife is ugly, throw a few dirt clods at his dog, then put up no trespassing sign, and go over and demand to use the weed whacker?

originally posted by: Metallicus
The flu vaccines are BS anyway and full of mercury. You are taking a risk every me you take one not to mention the chance that it is even effective is around 10-15%. Also, China is getting what they deserve for cheating and screwing the U.S. for years in trade. You should be thanking Trump for actually standing up to them.

Not usually mercury in vaccines these days, more of an aluminum chemistry that is used to trigger the immunity to form. Trouble is that that aluminum in the vaccines can trigger autoimmune conditions too or trigger the body to go into a cytokine storm in individuals who have a strong innate immunity system.

Other things to try to avoid are pickles containing Alum and some baked goods containing the aluminum baking powder and quick melting processed cheeses. The aluminum in cheese quickens the melting properties. Aluminum is a strong fungicide and part of the reason it is in baking powder is to extend shelflife. I see it more and more in foods to increase shelf life these days. The alum in your kitchen cabinet is high in aluminum. Too many aluminum products stimulates asthma attacks in people with asthma too. It is neuro-excitent and some people have limited ability to detox it's chemicals.

a reply to: MteWamp

Never had a flu vaccine. Never had the flu. I just turned sixty one. I hardly ever get sick.