"...not everyone who gets their period is a woman..." Reality or Mental illness??

originally posted by: shawmanfromny
This topic is getting a lot of attention. People are still debating whether gender dysphoria is a mental illness or not. The World Health Organization (WHO) at one point did classify it as a mental illness, but later removed 'Gender Dysphoria' from the list of mental disorders, sometime in 2018. Why did WHO do this?

The WHO expects this move to help remove stigma and make transgender people more socially acceptable (although this idea says something about people with mental illnesses not being socially acceptable). In turn, removing stigma could help to reduce violence against trans people, says Vanessa Victoria Crespo, counsellor and advocate at the New York City Anti-Violence Project (AVP).

www.refinery29.com...

Hey, I get that some people are confused on who they are and struggle to be comfortable in their own skin, but does that mean they don't have a mental illness? I've been suffering on and off again from anxiety and depression for many years and it's no picnic. However, I realized that I had issues and seeked professional help and counseling. I deal with my depression, by taking medication and working out. I've never cared less about being 'stigmatized' or what other people thought of me, when they found out I had some 'mental' issues. I just wanted to be well. So, tell me, is this a 'well' person who made this statement?

I am a nonbinary trans menstruator ― someone with a uterus that bleeds monthly, but who identifies outside of the fixed categories of male and female. Because of that, I have to navigate the challenges of getting my period every month in a world that refuses to acknowledge that not everyone who gets their period is a woman, and not every woman gets their period.

The representation of periods in the media has never matched the reality, but that’s even more true when you’re a trans person just looking for something that doesn’t scream, “You’re a W-O-M-A-N.”

www.huffingtonpost.com...

I really am sympathetic to this person's viewpoint and struggles, but the fact is, she is a woman. It's my opinion and that of many Americans, that transgenderism is a mental illness, because trans people are manufacturing their own kind of reality, complete with their own set of pronouns and identity labels. People should not be treated with contempt, just because their lifestyle is different than someone else's. They should be free to do whatever they want, as long as they don't disrespect or hurt anyone. Personally, I could care less with a woman who dresses and acts like a man, or a man who dresses or acts like a woman. They're free to live their life as they choose. That shouldn't mean that I should be viewed as a 'bigot' or a 'hateful' person, just because I feel that they're suffering from a mental illness. Why should I be forced to use certain labels for them and be viewed as "disrespectful" if I don't? Certain transgender people want people to "ask" them what pronoun to use, when they are addressed. But, what if I forget to ask, or mistakenly call them by the wrong pronoun. Why do trans people view this as being rude or disrespectful, when it was just an honest mistake, from someone confused by this whole concept?

If you must ask which pronoun the person uses, start with your own. For example, "Hi, I'm Alex and I use the pronouns he and him. What about you?" Then use that person's pronoun and encourage others to do so. If you accidentily use the wrong pronoun, apologize quickly and sincerely, then move on. The bigger deal you make out of the situation, the more uncomfortable it is for everyone.

www.glaad.org...

Shouldn't adults be treated like adults, or instead like emotionally weak, little kids whose feelings get hurt easily? How about addressing them by their name and if you make a mistake with their pronoun, why can't this be viewed simply as an honest mistake, instead of a sign of contempt? I believe author, Ryan T Anderson, nailed the problem with the following statement:

But we lose the ability to effectively call out bigotry when all disagreement is condemned as bigoted—and when lies are told in the process.

As I explain in “When Harry Became Sally,” contrary to the claims of activists, sex isn’t “assigned” at birth—and that’s why it can’t be “reassigned.” Sex is a bodily reality that can be recognized well before birth with ultrasound imaging. Cosmetic surgery and cross-sex hormones don’t change the deeper biological reality.

www.theamericanconservative.com...

This is exactly what I and many Americans believe, but we're considered "disrespectful" because we simply disagree. Anti-trans bigotry exists and it's wrong. You should still treat all people with respect, but that doesn't mean that I'm going to accept every cock and bull story out there. If you can't accept that you have a mental illness and instead blame other people and the body you were born with, for all your troubles, then maybe, just maybe the problem is inside your head.

Your disagreement is not based in reality.

There are males and females with different sex chromosomes than you would expect. Some of them are sterile due to this. It happens a lot more frequently than you might think.

For example, Klinefelter syndrome, where a male has XXY chromosomes, occurs in 1-2 in every 1,000 live male births. Some can father children, generally only with medical help. Males frequently are more feminine than

Some females are XXY, as well.

There are other genetic conditions, some with just as much frequency. Actual hermaphrodites, although rare, do exist.

It's become increasingly more apparent with the greater availability of genetic testing that our world is far less black and white than some would like to believe.

a reply to: kaylaluv

seems like this is a sensitive topic to you, maybe you should take a step back and look at it objectively.

is it medically ethical to remove a person's sexual organs because of how they feel on the inside? i dont know, only time will tell.

first its dressing like a woman, then is hormones, then facial surgery then reassignment, its an evaluation of extremes.

Do i think some of these people have mental health issues? hell yeah i do they say they themselves have them.

I have PTSD, anxiety and depression from some serious sht and during some of my darker days i NEEDED to be in the VA hospital getting my mental health squared away. i was not making good decisions because of my mental health.

i know there is a vetting process that is supposed to take place before reassignment but i wonder how many people they deny.


I never claimed to have the answers as to how to help these people, but i dont think cutting your junk off in most people is going to fix a mental health issue.

a reply to: watchandwait410

mental illness is just phenomena we don't understand yet. Who knows, people with schizophrenia who hear voices might actually hear telepathic aliens or whatever.

I understand youre trying to come at this from a "woke" position, and thats all fun...

However as someone who actually works in the medical field, it is most def an illness and not a phenomenon, and left unchecked and unmaintained can be life threatening to the sufferer and the general public

originally posted by: Greven

originally posted by: shawmanfromny
This topic is getting a lot of attention. People are still debating whether gender dysphoria is a mental illness or not. The World Health Organization (WHO) at one point did classify it as a mental illness, but later removed 'Gender Dysphoria' from the list of mental disorders, sometime in 2018. Why did WHO do this?

The WHO expects this move to help remove stigma and make transgender people more socially acceptable (although this idea says something about people with mental illnesses not being socially acceptable). In turn, removing stigma could help to reduce violence against trans people, says Vanessa Victoria Crespo, counsellor and advocate at the New York City Anti-Violence Project (AVP).

www.refinery29.com...

Hey, I get that some people are confused on who they are and struggle to be comfortable in their own skin, but does that mean they don't have a mental illness? I've been suffering on and off again from anxiety and depression for many years and it's no picnic. However, I realized that I had issues and seeked professional help and counseling. I deal with my depression, by taking medication and working out. I've never cared less about being 'stigmatized' or what other people thought of me, when they found out I had some 'mental' issues. I just wanted to be well. So, tell me, is this a 'well' person who made this statement?

I am a nonbinary trans menstruator ― someone with a uterus that bleeds monthly, but who identifies outside of the fixed categories of male and female. Because of that, I have to navigate the challenges of getting my period every month in a world that refuses to acknowledge that not everyone who gets their period is a woman, and not every woman gets their period.

The representation of periods in the media has never matched the reality, but that’s even more true when you’re a trans person just looking for something that doesn’t scream, “You’re a W-O-M-A-N.”

www.huffingtonpost.com...

I really am sympathetic to this person's viewpoint and struggles, but the fact is, she is a woman. It's my opinion and that of many Americans, that transgenderism is a mental illness, because trans people are manufacturing their own kind of reality, complete with their own set of pronouns and identity labels. People should not be treated with contempt, just because their lifestyle is different than someone else's. They should be free to do whatever they want, as long as they don't disrespect or hurt anyone. Personally, I could care less with a woman who dresses and acts like a man, or a man who dresses or acts like a woman. They're free to live their life as they choose. That shouldn't mean that I should be viewed as a 'bigot' or a 'hateful' person, just because I feel that they're suffering from a mental illness. Why should I be forced to use certain labels for them and be viewed as "disrespectful" if I don't? Certain transgender people want people to "ask" them what pronoun to use, when they are addressed. But, what if I forget to ask, or mistakenly call them by the wrong pronoun. Why do trans people view this as being rude or disrespectful, when it was just an honest mistake, from someone confused by this whole concept?

If you must ask which pronoun the person uses, start with your own. For example, "Hi, I'm Alex and I use the pronouns he and him. What about you?" Then use that person's pronoun and encourage others to do so. If you accidentily use the wrong pronoun, apologize quickly and sincerely, then move on. The bigger deal you make out of the situation, the more uncomfortable it is for everyone.

www.glaad.org...

Shouldn't adults be treated like adults, or instead like emotionally weak, little kids whose feelings get hurt easily? How about addressing them by their name and if you make a mistake with their pronoun, why can't this be viewed simply as an honest mistake, instead of a sign of contempt? I believe author, Ryan T Anderson, nailed the problem with the following statement:

But we lose the ability to effectively call out bigotry when all disagreement is condemned as bigoted—and when lies are told in the process.

As I explain in “When Harry Became Sally,” contrary to the claims of activists, sex isn’t “assigned” at birth—and that’s why it can’t be “reassigned.” Sex is a bodily reality that can be recognized well before birth with ultrasound imaging. Cosmetic surgery and cross-sex hormones don’t change the deeper biological reality.

www.theamericanconservative.com...

This is exactly what I and many Americans believe, but we're considered "disrespectful" because we simply disagree. Anti-trans bigotry exists and it's wrong. You should still treat all people with respect, but that doesn't mean that I'm going to accept every cock and bull story out there. If you can't accept that you have a mental illness and instead blame other people and the body you were born with, for all your troubles, then maybe, just maybe the problem is inside your head.

Your disagreement is not based in reality.

There are males and females with different sex chromosomes than you would expect. Some of them are sterile due to this. It happens a lot more frequently than you might think.

For example, Klinefelter syndrome, where a male has XXY chromosomes, occurs in 1-2 in every 1,000 live male births. Some can father children, generally only with medical help. Males frequently are more feminine than

Some females are XXY, as well.

There are other genetic conditions, some with just as much frequency. Actual hermaphrodites, although rare, do exist.

It's become increasingly more apparent with the greater availability of genetic testing that our world is far less black and white than some would like to believe.

I will agree that there are genetic disorders but to say that is the reason for All transgender is absurd.
Many trans people have a mental disorder.
Others in MHO want attention.
Quad

originally posted by: snarfbot

originally posted by: mysterioustranger

originally posted by: shawmanfromny
This topic is getting a lot of attention. People are still debating whether gender dysphoria is a mental illness or not. The World Health Organization (WHO) at one point did classify it as a mental illness, but later removed 'Gender Dysphoria' from the list of mental disorders, sometime in 2018. Why did WHO do this?

The WHO expects this move to help remove stigma and make transgender people more socially acceptable (although this idea says something about people with mental illnesses not being socially acceptable). In turn, removing stigma could help to reduce violence against trans people, says Vanessa Victoria Crespo, counsellor and advocate at the New York City Anti-Violence Project (AVP).

www.refinery29.com...

Hey, I get that some people are confused on who they are and struggle to be comfortable in their own skin, but does that mean they don't have a mental illness? I've been suffering on and off again from anxiety and depression for many years and it's no picnic. However, I realized that I had issues and seeked professional help and counseling. I deal with my depression, by taking medication and working out. I've never cared less about being 'stigmatized' or what other people thought of me, when they found out I had some 'mental' issues. I just wanted to be well. So, tell me, is this a 'well' person who made this statement?

I am a nonbinary trans menstruator ― someone with a uterus that bleeds monthly, but who identifies outside of the fixed categories of male and female. Because of that, I have to navigate the challenges of getting my period every month in a world that refuses to acknowledge that not everyone who gets their period is a woman, and not every woman gets their period.

The representation of periods in the media has never matched the reality, but that’s even more true when you’re a trans person just looking for something that doesn’t scream, “You’re a W-O-M-A-N.”

www.huffingtonpost.com...

I really am sympathetic to this person's viewpoint and struggles, but the fact is, she is a woman. It's my opinion and that of many Americans, that transgenderism is a mental illness, because trans people are manufacturing their own kind of reality, complete with their own set of pronouns and identity labels. People should not be treated with contempt, just because their lifestyle is different than someone else's. They should be free to do whatever they want, as long as they don't disrespect or hurt anyone. Personally, I could care less with a woman who dresses and acts like a man, or a man who dresses or acts like a woman. They're free to live their life as they choose. That shouldn't mean that I should be viewed as a 'bigot' or a 'hateful' person, just because I feel that they're suffering from a mental illness. Why should I be forced to use certain labels for them and be viewed as "disrespectful" if I don't? Certain transgender people want people to "ask" them what pronoun to use, when they are addressed. But, what if I forget to ask, or mistakenly call them by the wrong pronoun. Why do trans people view this as being rude or disrespectful, when it was just an honest mistake, from someone confused by this whole concept?

If you must ask which pronoun the person uses, start with your own. For example, "Hi, I'm Alex and I use the pronouns he and him. What about you?" Then use that person's pronoun and encourage others to do so. If you accidentily use the wrong pronoun, apologize quickly and sincerely, then move on. The bigger deal you make out of the situation, the more uncomfortable it is for everyone.

www.glaad.org...

Shouldn't adults be treated like adults, or instead like emotionally weak, little kids whose feelings get hurt easily? How about addressing them by their name and if you make a mistake with their pronoun, why can't this be viewed simply as an honest mistake, instead of a sign of contempt? I believe author, Ryan T Anderson, nailed the problem with the following statement:

But we lose the ability to effectively call out bigotry when all disagreement is condemned as bigoted—and when lies are told in the process.

As I explain in “When Harry Became Sally,” contrary to the claims of activists, sex isn’t “assigned” at birth—and that’s why it can’t be “reassigned.” Sex is a bodily reality that can be recognized well before birth with ultrasound imaging. Cosmetic surgery and cross-sex hormones don’t change the deeper biological reality.

www.theamericanconservative.com...

This is exactly what I and many Americans believe, but we're considered "disrespectful" because we simply disagree. Anti-trans bigotry exists and it's wrong. You should still treat all people with respect, but that doesn't mean that I'm going to accept every cock and bull story out there. If you can't accept that you have a mental illness and instead blame other people and the body you were born with, for all your troubles, then maybe, just maybe the problem is inside your head.

I was supervisor of an ERT male team member...had all male parts...yet had a fistula (opening) and monthly menstrual cycles.

Born male with complicated internal female organs. He had one hell of a life, especially trying to explain it to Drs.

I insisted he bring me proof to support his days off requests. He did from U.S. Navy Drs.

It is real....he led a disturbed and confused life...lonely as well....
MS/EMT

Okay so does the existence of this legitimate genetic anomalies mean anyone in the world with normal sex organs can decide willy nilly whether they want to be their actual sex or another or one they simply invented just because? Because that's what the options was talking about those people with male or female parts deciding they weren't what the are essentially, not some rare sex disorder causing them to possess both sexes reproductive organs in whole or in part.

a reply to: Quadrivium
Transgender is a tiny population.

You're looking at an estimated 0.05% of the male population and 0.03% of the female population that identify as transgender. A few surveys have gone as high as 1%.

a reply to: bigfatfurrytexan

That said...people can be dysphoric in a non-clinical sense.

Politics.

In other words: normal people don't fixate on the minor details of their lives to a point that it derails the rest of their life.

Nutters

a reply to: Whatthedoctorordered

I am not saying it is not bad I am just saying sometimes it is more then we as humans can handle at the current time. Just because it is overwhelming doesn't mean there is not truth somewhere in the horribleness. I am speaking from first hand experience. Don't knock it until you try it and I "tried" it.. I had no choice in getting mentally ill but there is a small amount of truth in even the worst things including schizophrenia.

originally posted by: kaylaluv
a reply to: bigfatfurrytexan

I’ll ask you the same questions I just asked Penroc.

What do you do when the software can’t be changed, but the hardware can be adjusted - not perfectly, but adequately? Just throw the whole thing away? Is that what you’d suggest?

As i mentioned: pain is what the patient says it is, and the physicians role is to create the most healthy person possible. There is nothing wrong with surgical solutions to this. That is what is known as "freedom" and I support that stuff 100%.

What i don't support is forcing a change in vernacular, using shaming and insults to support this change, for the sake of people who have abnormal psychology. For the sake of what is and is not real in this world, we cannot force the world to participate in the mental illness of a few.

a reply to: bigfatfurrytexan
I don't get the big hangup with vernacular.

I mean, we call people by the name they want to be called already.

This is not always what their parents named the person.

Why do folks care so much about the pronoun for the tiny number of people where this may be different than perceived?

originally posted by: neo96
Doesn't appear to be strictly true?

I've never had to go buy a box of tampons for myself.

Neither have I, but that doesn't negate the apparent existence of a male periodic hormonal cycle.

originally posted by: penroc3
a reply to: kaylaluv


I never claimed to have the answers as to how to help these people, but i dont think cutting your junk off in most people is going to fix a mental health issue.

The thing is, surgical transition HAS helped many people with gender dysphoria. Not everyone needs surgery - as a matter of fact, the majority of trans people haven’t had sex reassignment surgery. It depends on the individual and how severe their dysphoria is.

a reply to: bigfatfurrytexan

It’s hard to create the most healthy person possible when others are refusing to legitimize that person, hence the high rate of suicides. It’s not like anyone is asking you to do something that is horrible, painful and tortuous.

a reply to: kaylaluv

no doubt, but it seems easy to get it done if you have the $.

and there are without a doubt people who regret their choices and there is no going back.

i guess it just seems very dark and sad that someone cant be happy as they are.

what makes a woman? a vagaina or the mind/soul?

originally posted by: kaylaluv
a reply to: bigfatfurrytexan

It’s hard to create the most healthy person possible when others are refusing to legitimize that person, hence the high rate of suicides. It’s not like anyone is asking you to do something that is horrible, painful and tortuous.

Ah... and your post gets to the heart of the matter...
If a person has to have others "legitimize that person" then said person will never be able to "create the most healthy person possible".
If one waits on other to accept them they will never be happy. Hardly anyone is fully accepted by most people.
We find those that are most like us or those with which we have a connection, those are who we "click" with.
If you try and force people to accept you then you are only widening the gap you wish to close.
Moral of the story:
Be happy with YOU, if you worry about how others feel about you, you will never be happy.

well, one thing I know for sure is that not every women has periods!! one of my good friends never had one.
and, there are those that don't really fit into xx or xy scheme of things like someone already pointed out.

originally posted by: dawnstar
well, one thing I know for sure is that not every women has periods!! one of my good friends never had one.
and, there are those that don't really fit into xx or xy scheme of things like someone already pointed out.

And that percentage is VERY small compared to the number of trans people.
Yes, there are those with genetic disorders but there are also those with mental illness and those that just want attention.

a reply to: Greven

If i say "ma'am" and it upsets someone, that is their problem, not mine.

If i believe you to be a female, to call you "sir" causes me to feel like i am not internally consistent. I do not lie, and am unable to lie to myself without my own stresses and anxieties. WHy should my own mental comfort take a back seat to someone elses?

Labeling anyone who doesn't fit inside some sort of societal "norm" as mentally deficient is a form of authoritarian control.

It's social engineering.


If these individuals can function in society then they should be free to do so.

It is not up to anyone else to determine how someone should act/behave as long as the individual is not infringing upon the rights and freedoms of others.

originally posted by: kaylaluv
a reply to: bigfatfurrytexan

It’s hard to create the most healthy person possible when others are refusing to legitimize that person, hence the high rate of suicides. It’s not like anyone is asking you to do something that is horrible, painful and tortuous.

???

How do you expect to force a global population to validate the insane beliefs of the mentally ill, though?

To most anyone who exists, there are 2 genders. Then there are people who think there are more than 2 genders. Then there are the medical oddities.

It may be hard, but no one has a right to legitimization or validation. Especially when you are validating beliefs that are not factual and provably demonstrably false.

Ill tell you a hint: i have a chronic condition that medicine has not found any real treatment for. So I suffer with this day in and day out. I drag my ass out of bed in pain every day and work my 10 hour job in pain every day. Sometimes life sucks. I feel that pain, and see no issue if others must be burdened with it as well until medical science can give us relief.

originally posted by: kaylaluv
a reply to: bigfatfurrytexan

It’s hard to create the most healthy person possible when others are refusing to legitimize that person, hence the high rate of suicides. It’s not like anyone is asking you to do something that is horrible, painful and tortuous.

Ill add: how do you know? I have been VERY clear that lying, even to myself, creates incredible anxiety within me. I do not lie. I can't "role play". I can't "act". I don't read fiction, and really don't enjoy watching fictional movies. I don't like things that are not true and factual.

Why does my own mental health have to take a backseat to a stranger who simply wants to be validated in their obsessive mental illness?